2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

[BQ32]

Everyone knows that a green equals a make. Many hate it because it ruins the immersion and a lot of the myplayer online community love it because they have built a whole culture around it. But what many don't know is that it was not until 2k19 that you could guarantee a green release with perfect timing and now this year also with perfect timing or aiming after a certain attribute level (I think 86). Before 19 a perfectly timed shot would give you a higher percentage of greening but never guaranteed you would actually green/make a shot. This is a big reason why past games felt like they played out a lot more organically. It has made timing a single button press so much more paramount to any other skills or tactics balance and realism have been decimated. Add on top of that the disgusting amount of badges to aid shooting turning decent contests into light contest and now even a large amount of decently defended plays are still guaranteed to go in with great timing.
Finally, and what makes this even more damning is how easy it has made the game to cheat using the appropriate hardware. It is so rampant that you will run into it every time you play the game for an extended amount of time online. The nature of the guaranteed makes can turn a very low iq/skill scrub into a highly competitive player completely ruining the game.
Going back to the system where no shots were guaranteed makes and move away from perfect timed button presses mattering more than working for good open shots would go a long way to rebalancing the game and simultaneously limit the effectiveness of the ramping cheating taking place.

[Caelumfang]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

At this point, it’s too late. When Mike gave in to ‘fans’ crying and whining after he tried to get rid of it in 2k16, that pretty much sealed their fate. We’re stuck with green hunting for the rest of 2k’s existence.

[adamspag]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

yeah we need more RNG in the game

[AIRJ23]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

I hate it. It destroys the immersion when you know it’s going in before it actually does. Game winners are totally devoid of celebration because you already know you’re winning the game from a color meter, not the visceral sensation of making the shot.

I wish there was a way to turn off the green notification.

[Shaffty]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

yeah we need more RNG in the game

You sir, are part of the problem.


It´s not RNG, if a certain outcome is based on numbers like shot rating, defense/openess/difficulty (aka quality of the shot).

[f3r]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

agree


is terrible that you know (and your opponent as well) when a shot is made before the ball touch the basket

[jk31]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

yeah we need more RNG in the game

What people like you don't understand is, that "RNG" (how I ****ing hate this term) is part of the game of basketball. The whole game is about shot percentages nowadays in the NBA. The goal of basketball (well besides "score more points than your opponent") is to get more higher percentage shots than your opponent because then you will most likely win. It should be like this in 2k, too and you know what? It was like that up until NBA 2k15 or 2k16! If you are able to get better shots than your opponent for the duration of a game you likely came up as the winner.


What these automatic green makes do is divide the shot percentages too much. A good shooter like Steph Curry has way too good shot percentages compared to his real self while guys in the 80 3pt rating range without badges, who shot sth like 36 % in real life, will shoot below 30 % in 2k because it's not as easy to get a green shot with them. Makes the whole game an arcady cheesefest about who is able to get more green releases, not who is able to execute better on offense.


I mean, think about it, just a thought game for the sake of showing you what I mean:
You have two players taking the exact same shots with the exact same rating, no defender around, so basically same shot quality.

Player A shoots 40 % on non-green threes and does not get a single green release. He will hit 4 out of 10 shots, resulting in 12 points on 4/10 shooting (40 %)

Player B shoots 40 % on non-green threes and hits 3 green shots. He will hit these 3 shots AND additionally 40 % of the other 7 shots, resulting in 17.4 points on 5.8/10 shooting (58 %).


So both players took EXACTLY the same shots, but player b shot 18 % better, because he is able to get green releases? This completely ****s up the competitiveness of the game. And I know from my experience in our online leagues that there are guys that green basically every 3rd 3 pointer while there are others that don't hit a single green in a whole 40 minute game.....

[adamspag]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

What people like you don't understand is, that "RNG" (how I ****ing hate this term) is part of the game of basketball. The whole game is about shot percentages nowadays in the NBA. The goal of basketball (well besides "score more points than your opponent") is to get more higher percentage shots than your opponent because then you will most likely win. It should be like this in 2k, too and you know what? It was like that up until NBA 2k15 or 2k16! If you are able to get better shots than your opponent for the duration of a game you likely came up as the winner.


What these automatic green makes do is divide the shot percentages too much. A good shooter like has way too good shot percentages compared to his real self while guys in the 80 3pt rating range without badges, who shot sth like 36 % in real life, will shoot below 30 % in 2k because it's not as easy to get a green shot with them. Makes the whole game an arcady cheesefest about who is able to get more green releases, not who is able to execute better on offense.


I mean, think about it, just a thought game for the sake of showing you what I mean:
You have two players taking the exact same shots with the exact same rating, no defender around, so basically same shot quality.

Player A shoots 40 % on non-green threes and does not get a single green release. He will hit 4 out of 10 shots, resulting in 12 points on 4/10 shooting (40 %)

Player B shoots 40 % on non-green threes and hits 3 green shots. He will hit these 3 shots AND additionally 40 % of the other 7 shots, resulting in 17.4 points on 5.8/10 shooting (58 %).


So both players took EXACTLY the same shots, but player b shot 18 % better, because he is able to get green releases? This completely ****s up the competitiveness of the game. And I know from my experience in our online leagues that there are guys that green basically every 3rd 3 pointer while there are others that don't hit a single green in a whole 40 minute game.....

I'm sorry I don't get your last paragraph; just looking for clarification. Are you saying that you are upset because person A was able to time his shot better than person B thus got better results and that screws up competitiveness? or are you saying that both player A and player B timed the shot exactly the same but you are upset that player A got better RNG rolls to hit more greens than player B so we should add more RNG to fix that? Not trying to be a smart ***, just curious

[f3r]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

I'm sorry I don't get your last paragraph; just looking for clarification. Are you saying that you are upset because person A was able to time his shot better than person B thus got better results and that screws up competitiveness? or are you saying that both player A and player B timed the shot exactly the same but you are upset that player A got better RNG rolls to hit more greens than player B so we should add more RNG to fix that? Not trying to be a smart ***, just curious

i think he is saying about the green shot doesn't be affected by the quality of the offensive execution, only for the timing.

[Junior Moe]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

I only use the shot meter in MyCareer. I think greens should only be possible when the shot is registered as uncontested with a great shooter like Steph or Dame. It would incentive actually working to get an open look. The more contested the shot is greens shouldn't be possible. In addition, the line on the shot meter should move instead of being dead center. Have it move around depending on the difficulty of the shot and ratings. If I shoot a 3 with Clint Capela the line could be on the far left and the meter moves fast as hell to simulate difficulty and ratings. The same shot with Steph and the line and meter are like it is now. You could even scale it so that defensive player ratings matter. If Kawhi is smothering Steph and he pulls up that meter could resemble Capelas wide open 3 meter. It could also make post players and ratings matter. If Joel Embiid is in the post and Steph or some guard is in him Embiids meter would move slow and the line would be dead center. That's a rough idea of what I'm thinking but I think it could solve some issues with adding skill and difficulty without being overly complicated.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Operation Sports mobile app

[The 24th Letter]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

What people like you don't understand is, that "RNG" (how I ****ing hate this term) is part of the game of basketball. The whole game is about shot percentages nowadays in the NBA. The goal of basketball (well besides "score more points than your opponent") is to get more higher percentage shots than your opponent because then you will most likely win. It should be like this in 2k, too and you know what? It was like that up until NBA 2k15 or 2k16! If you are able to get better shots than your opponent for the duration of a game you likely came up as the winner.


What these automatic green makes do is divide the shot percentages too much. A good shooter like Steph Curry has way too good shot percentages compared to his real self while guys in the 80 3pt rating range without badges, who shot sth like 36 % in real life, will shoot below 30 % in 2k because it's not as easy to get a green shot with them. Makes the whole game an arcady cheesefest about who is able to get more green releases, not who is able to execute better on offense.


I mean, think about it, just a thought game for the sake of showing you what I mean:
You have two players taking the exact same shots with the exact same rating, no defender around, so basically same shot quality.

Player A shoots 40 % on non-green threes and does not get a single green release. He will hit 4 out of 10 shots, resulting in 12 points on 4/10 shooting (40 %)

Player B shoots 40 % on non-green threes and hits 3 green shots. He will hit these 3 shots AND additionally 40 % of the other 7 shots, resulting in 17.4 points on 5.8/10 shooting (58 %).


So both players took EXACTLY the same shots, but player b shot 18 % better, because he is able to get green releases? This completely ****s up the competitiveness of the game. And I know from my experience in our online leagues that there are guys that green basically every 3rd 3 pointer while there are others that don't hit a single green in a whole 40 minute game.....

Honestly, This sounds too far on the other end of the spectrum, and you want the game to rely solely on percentages, taking user skill out of the equation. Why not just play on Real Player %?

High % shots aren't created equal in real life...there's no 'fairness' to shooting in basketball...someone's contested mid range could be more reliable than someone's open 3 because of their skill levels.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

[Dlee3]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

I only use the shot meter in MyCareer. I think greens should only be possible when the shot is registered as uncontested with a great shooter like Steph or Dame. It would incentive actually working to get an open look. The more contested the shot is greens shouldn't be possible. In addition, the line on the shot meter should move instead of being dead center. Have it move around depending on the difficulty of the shot and ratings. If I shoot a 3 with Clint Capela the line could be on the far left and the meter moves fast as hell to simulate difficulty and ratings. The same shot with Steph and the line and meter are like it is now. You could even scale it so that defensive player ratings matter. If Kawhi is smothering Steph and he pulls up that meter could resemble Capelas wide open 3 meter. It could also make post players and ratings matter. If Joel Embiid is in the post and Steph or some guard is in him Embiids meter would move slow and the line would be dead center. That's a rough idea of what I'm thinking but I think it could solve some issues with adding skill and difficulty without being overly complicated.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Operation Sports mobile app

I like this. Wide opens should be the only shot you can green. Anything else should be base on your attributes, the contest, badges, and of course timing

[Dlee3]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

"Competitive" players may get upset but the way things are looking 2k competitive scene will never take off. A change need to happen

[Cavsfan4life]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

I hate it. It destroys the immersion when you know it’s going in before it actually does. Game winners are totally devoid of celebration because you already know you’re winning the game from a color meter, not the visceral sensation of making the shot.

I wish there was a way to turn off the green notification.

You can, it's in the controller settings and I think regular settings, but it won't stop perfect animations.

Never liked perfect releases, especially for a sport like basketball. Rather ratings and shot selection matter more vs getting the timing down. Having the perfect release should mean there's a higher chance of going in, not an absolute.

[Guard-ian]

Re: 2K desperately needs to move away from guaranteed makes/greens

Count me in also for one that hates the greens and the shooting meters...

The day they started adding those mechanics was the day this game crossed the line from a simulation approach to an arcade gameplay which it is still fun, but it is a little bit unfair to those of us who loves to compete with a videogame playing pure NBA basketball.