Official Boston Celtics Thread

[tonybologna]

Marcus Smart speaks about Kyrie: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...eltics-fall-bs

[R1zzo23]

There are two directions this team can go:
1) Re-sign Kyrie Irving, make a trade for Anthony Davis, get rid of Brad Stevens
2) Kyrie Irving walks, re-sign Terry Rozier, retain Brad Stevens and make all your draft picks.

There's really no in between in my mind. Either you're all in with Irving, AD and a veteran team that needs to be in title contention. Unfortunately, Stevens has proven that he's not able to establish a hierarchy where your best players dominate the ball and the rest fall in line. That was evident this year and killed this team.

If Kyrie leaves, or it's a real possibility the Celtics say thanks but no thanks, then Stevens stays, they re-sign Rozier, continue to build around Tatum and Brown and go back to being the gritty, young team that plays hard and plays together. Without Kyrie in town I don't think Marcus Morris stays either. You use all three draft picks and Stevens can continue to play 10-11 deep all season long to develop the youth.

[jake44np]

All of this negativity towards Stevens is cracking me up.
You all loved him the last few years and all of the sudden think he has forgotten how to coach. Lets now blame the elephant in the room here at all.

All I needed to hear was the post game presser.

One guy took blame and responsibility and said he needed to get better.

One guy took none of the blame or responsibility even tho he played horribly the last 4 games of the series.

Ill keep the first guy every time.

One a side note I would love to see Stevens not come back and come home to coach IU!

[tonybologna]

Quote: Originally Posted by R1zzo23

There are two directions this team can go: 1) Re-sign Kyrie Irving, make a trade for Anthony Davis, get rid of Brad Stevens 2) Kyrie Irving walks, re-sign Terry Rozier, retain Brad Stevens and make all your draft picks. There's really no in between in my mind. Either you're all in with Irving, AD and a veteran team that needs to be in title contention. Unfortunately, Stevens has proven that he's not able to establish a hierarchy where your best players dominate the ball and the rest fall in line. That was evident this year and killed this team. If Kyrie leaves, or it's a real possibility the Celtics say thanks but no thanks, then Stevens stays, they re-sign Rozier, continue to build around Tatum and Brown and go back to being the gritty, young team that plays hard and plays together. Without Kyrie in town I don't think Marcus Morris stays either. You use all three draft picks and Stevens can continue to play 10-11 deep all season long to develop the youth.

+1 on your post. The problem in trading for AD is what the Pelicans has already stated multiple times in what players they want back in return. They want Tatum, Brown, & Rozier in any deal with the Celtics. Those 3 plus a 4th & possibly 5th thrown in player as well. We would get AD & one other Pelican player on their roster but nobody that's a key player for them. Ainge already has said there's no way he would part ways with both Tatum & Brown. He didn't rule out one of them but not both. So, unless the Pelicans lighten or change who they want in return then a trade to get AD might end up being too difficult.

I would love to have Kyrie back if we can get AD too. I just don't want to see us give up both Tatum & Brown. We need to keep one of these guys & probably both really. Brown outplayed Tatum in the playoffs & down the stretch of the regular season too. He just keeps improving. Both guys are very athletic but Brown is more athletic than Tatum & the upside/ceiling for both of them is still rising. I really think Kyrie would stay if we can get AD on our roster before he makes a decision. No doubt getting AD would make this a better team but this would come with not having both Tatum & Brown on our roster anymore.

I don't think Ainge can wiggle his way out of getting by with trading just one of these key players. I think we would have to part ways with both of them & me personally wouldn't like to see that happen. It would be like wasting 2 lottery picks with 2 players that are still young & improving with a higher ceiling. Brown just might end up once their careers are over a better player than Tatum. He is quicker & more athletic than Tatum plus he's stronger & a little better defender too. He just hasn't developed a better overall offensive game yet compared to Tatum but he's not far away.

Quote: Originally Posted by jake44np

All of this negativity towards Stevens is cracking me up. You all loved him the last few years and all of the sudden think he has forgotten how to coach. Lets now blame the elephant in the room here at all. All I needed to hear was the post game presser. One guy took blame and responsibility and said he needed to get better. One guy took none of the blame or responsibility even tho he played horribly the last 4 games of the series. Ill keep the first guy every time. One a side note I would love to see Stevens not come back and come home to coach IU!

Yes, I have supported Stevens in the past & said he was a good young coach. He himself put the blame on his coaching for the Celtics failed 2018-19 season. The media didn't do it. The fans didn't do it. He vividly took the blame. Now, of course it's not 100% his fault. The players on EVERY team have to perform as well.

Hayward underperformed all season long except for the last 8-10 games of the regular season. Even Stevens said he thought Hayward's game suffered because of the way he used player rotations & also how he used Hayward on the court. It's like he was in over his head with all of their talent. That's basically what he's saying about himself. Can coaches improve just like players? Sure they can but I wouldn't use the word improve. I would use the word "learn" instead. Stevens came straight from Butler to the NBA. Having never coached an NBA game before I think he's done well. However, he didn't coach this 2018-19 fully loaded team the right way. I was one that called him out in the 1st 15-20 games this season on player rotations.

That's the one thing in interviews & press conferences since being ousted that he said he done a poor job handling. He also said he tinkered with the starting lineup way too many times & I said that about him too. All of this caused players to not know or accept their roles. It affected Hayward more than any other player but every player that received playing time were affected no doubt. Rozier was also significantly affected. He is just better starting. I was begging for Stevens to start Rozier & move Kyrie to SG & just try that out but he never even tried that one single game. But, he sure tried numerous other starting lineups. The players just weren't happy with their roles & also Kyrie early on was speaking to the media about problems with the team so Celtics players became aggravated about that too.

It was just a total nightmare of a season. No way this team should have been a #4 seed in the East. They never got it together as a complete team the entire regular season. They looked to have turned it on by sweeping the Pacers in the payoffs & beating the Bucks in Game #1. That wasn't the case though. However, the Bucks are a juggernaut & have so many weapons all over the court. What I don't understand though is why Stevens changed how he played Giannis after game #1. Plus, coaching adjustments by Budholtzer fixed that issue for the Bucks.

Stevens didn't have a clue as to what to do after Game #1 against the Bucks. He just like the players needs to "learn" from this coaching season. I have never called for him to be fired. He's a good coach. He just didn't know how to handle the talent on this 2018-19 team that was fully loaded. Hopefully whatever type team we have next season Stevens will know how to handle them better.

[BleacherBum2310]

I was wrong about this team. I thought they'd turn it up in the postseason and they did not though a good portion of that was because I was optimistic with how Hayward was looking. but yeah I was very wrong.

I don't think it can be stated enough how bad Kyrie was in the MIL series. and how miserable this season was but....despite that you have to want him back because % of an AD trade goes up alot and that's really the only shot they have at being a contender. just don't include Smart as salary filler that's a total non starter for me. Build him a statue. what this season did do as I don't think i'd be okay with Kyrie leaving before now if that's the worst case scenario I'm more than okay with having like 10-15 more losses rolling with the Jays and having a fun team. That matters after you go through this miserable of a season.

I'll give Mook credit after being complete garbarge for 2 months he stepped up in the playoffs. Hayward doesn't get a pass but I want to see him get a complete off-season to recover like he didn't get last year. That really mattered. It's hard to be too critical off him coming off such a devastating injury. on Terry I'm going to miss his personality but he's terrible... He's was one of the worst players in the league last year. I can't wait to see which team gives him a terrible deal.

lastly Brad is going get alot of the heat for the playoffs but that blame is misguided. put the blame on him during the regular season because he was awful all around whether it's not benching or limiting terry/Mook, rotations, managing ego's. But in the playoffs where Terry barely played and Starters are playing near 40 mins when your star player and everyone hears about he's elite in the postseason to get outplayed by George Hill and Bench guys there's no adjustments in the world after that.

I think Brad is still one of the best coaches in the league that just had a bad year.

[areobee401]

I have faith in Brad learning and improving going forward. He should look to replacing Micah Shrewsberry with someone who can help in those areas.

Would love to turn back time for the chance to see what the Celtics would have become had Hayward never broke his ankle.

Crazy ride we’ve encountered since the day Hayward and Irving were introduced to were we are today.

[R1zzo23]

I agree that the Celtics if they decide to keep Kyrie need to find an assistant with the credentials to keep superstar egos in check. Without that I think Irving will again undermine Brad throughout the season and we know that didn’t help much at all this year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[tonybologna]

Quote: Originally Posted by R1zzo23

I agree that the Celtics if they decide to keep Kyrie need to find an assistant with the credentials to keep superstar egos in check. Without that I think Irving will again undermine Brad throughout the season and we know that didn’t help much at all this year. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I really don't think Kyrie undermined Stevens throughout the season. I just think Kyrie put it upon himself to try & do too much for this multi-talented team. No doubt Kyrie overall is our best offensive weapon but we have multiple scorers on the court at any one time. He didn't need to score 30+ every game like he was trying to do most of the season & in the playoffs.

In the Pacers series Kyrie turned back his forcing of shots quite a bit & only had one game in which he scored over 25 points in that series (26 in game #1). That just proved Kyrie didn't need to score so many points for us to win. I do think he needed to turn it up a notch though vs the Bucks because they are a juggernaut team & nothing like the Pacers. On this Celtics team if Kyrie can't accept the role of leading with ~20 PPG average then he's not a right fit for this team.

He shoots like he needs to average 30+ PPG when on this team he doesn't. On other teams 30+ might be the best option for him but not on this team that has at least 4-5 other players that can score 15-20 PPG. We have Kyrie giving us 20, Tatum 16-18, Horford 15-17, Hayward 14-16, & Brown 13-15 then that would be the ideal situation.

I don't mention Morris here because he will be an UFA. Even Horford has a player option for next season just like Kyrie but all signs point to Horford picking up that option. It's not pointing to Kyrie definitely doing this but it's also not clear cut that he's leaving either. I think Kyrie wants to see if we can get AD in a trade. Now, if we do make that trade we take probably Tatum & Brown both off this Celtics team even though Ainge has stated Tatum would be a Celtic for a long time.

The Pelican have made it clear in return they want both Tatum & Brown & that was the snag in us pulling the plug on a possible AD deal this season. Ainge wasn't willing to part ways with Tatum. He might do that though now once FA starts. I would love for us to keep Tatum over Brown but Brown outplayed Tatum in the playoffs plus the last 8-10 games of the regular season. We are going to have to part ways with both probably on an AD trade. Is AD worth getting rid of for 2 still young & potentially upcoming All-Star players?

I would say one of them but not both. The Pelicans also want Rozier & Yabusele plus rumors now so Hayward would need to be added to an AD deal to Boston. We would get AD & another Pelicans player in return. So, it would be a 5-2 trade. We give up 5 players while the Pelicans give up 2 players. It would be fair in a 5 for 2 player trade if we don't give up too much for AD because the other Pelicans player probably would just be a fill-in type player or a bench/role player only.

I do think Kyrie will wait on his player option decision until we have a chance to see what or if we can make a deal for AD. I do not think he has mind set right now to leave Boston. He might get a little more money signing elsewhere but after next season he will be available for the Max with us so that might also play a role into his decision.