NFL Hall of Fame class of 2009

[Kelverin]

Quote: Originally Posted by Alliball

For someone to say a guy like Winslow is not on Sharpe's level is pretty laughable. Winslow opened the door for guys like Sharpe and is arguably the greatest TE to ever play the game.

If you go just by stats, Sharpe along with Gonzales are on their own level, but you have to study the history of the NFL to know the evolution of the position, all the people I mentioned dominated their position at the time they played just like Sharpe did, so they definitely belong in the same discussion.

[ProfessaPackMan]

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Quote:

IRVIN CALLS WOODSON “SOFT” Posted by Mike Florio on January 31, 2009, 12:35 p.m. As we continue to work through the list of all the things about which we wanted to write this week but couldn’t find the time, we remembered that we’d heard about Hall of Fame receiver Michael Irvin expressing an opinion that former Steelers, 49ers, Ravens, and Raiders defensive back Rod Woodson should not be a first-ballot Hall of Famer. Why? Because Irvin thinks Woodson is “soft.” “Soft,” Irvin repeatedly said while talking with Scott Paulsen, Mike Logan, and Eddy Crow of ESPN Radio 1250 in Pittsburgh. “When I lined up with him I saw intimidation in his eyes,” Irvin said. “I just call that soft.” After Irvin finished his thought, the hosts moved to another topic. And Irvin then pulled it back to Woodson and pointed out that Irvin repeatedly beat Woodson when they played. The folks who determined in 1994 the league’s 75th Anniversary Team apparently disagreed with Irvin’s assessment. As did the folks who picked the 1990s All-Decade Team. As do we. Regarding the 75th Anniversary Team, Woodson was one of only five active players to make the team. The others already are or will be in the Hall of Fame on the first try — Jerry Rice, Joe Montana, Reggie White, and Ronnie Lott. So, yeah, Woodson should be in. Today, not in a year or two. In our view, Irvin’s position on Woodson making it to Canton on the first try has less to do with Woodson and more to do with the fact that Irvin didn’t make it to the Hall of Fame on the first attempt. We’re talking about some of the most intense competitors in our society. And in every club there are classes. In the Hall of Fame, the elite level contains the guys who made it in on the first try. And since Irvin isn’t in the elite level and thinks Woodson was “soft,” Irvin surely doesn’t want to see Woodson leapfrog him in the Canton clique. We’ll find out whether Woodson gets it done in less than two hours.

[Howie75]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kelverin

If you go just by stats, Sharpe along with Gonzales are on their own level, but you have to study the history of the NFL to know the evolution of the position, all the people I mentioned dominated their position at the time they played just like Sharpe did, so they definitely belong in the same discussion.

I agree with you completely. You definitely have to comapre numbers amongst their peers, not just in black and white. All kinds of TE in the modern era have better numbers than Mackey and Ditka, for example, but obviously the game, and thus position has changed.

[SPTO]

Winslow not on Sharpe's level? Winslow is the greatest modern day TE i've ever seen. The guy was the template for Sharpe. If there was no Winslow there's no Sharpe or Gonzalez.

[yvesdereuter]

Quote: Originally Posted by MizzouBravesFan

Actually Tony Gonzalez has those records and all time receiving TDs for TE's as well.

I realize that. I was talking about holding the records when he retired. I dont want to get into a thing between Gonzalez and Sharpe. I think both should get in but when you look at critieria that is typically emphasized in getting in, Sharpe has everything in spades that is typically required to get in as a 1st ballot HOFer. He retired as the all time leader in the stats I mentioned and he also has 3 SB rings. Plus to those who want to emphasize a TEs blocking, he blocked for a 2,000 yard rusher. And whether anyone thinks Winslow was better or not, its not only about making athletic catches and such. Its about accomplishment and the stats, the rings, and blocking for a 2,000 yard rusher makes Sharpe's resume vastly superior to any other TE.

[Alliball]

Quote: Originally Posted by yvesdereuter

I realize that. I was talking about holding the records when he retired. I dont want to get into a thing between Gonzalez and Sharpe. I think both should get in but when you look at critieria that is typically emphasized in getting in, Sharpe has everything in spades that is typically required to get in as a 1st ballot HOFer. He retired as the all time leader in the stats I mentioned and he also has 3 SB rings. Plus to those who want to emphasize a TEs blocking, he blocked for a 2,000 yard rusher. And whether anyone thinks Winslow was better or not, its not only about making athletic catches and such. Its about accomplishment and the stats, the rings, and blocking for a 2,000 yard rusher makes Sharpe's resume vastly superior to any other TE.

I often wonder if some fanse realize football was played before they were born.

Saying his numbers are vastly superior is an epic stretch at best. Just remember, Winslow played in only 109 games while Sharpe played in over 200. With that being said, Winslow had a higher catch per game average, by over a full reception, had a higher average per catch and only 17 fewer TD's in 95 fewer games played. On top of those number, let's just say Winslow is widely recognized as a revolutionary figure in the world of pro football.

Other than blind Bronco fans and people born after 1980 will say Sharpe is better than the likes of Winslow.

[yvesdereuter]

Quote: Originally Posted by Alliball

I often wonder if some fanse realize football was played before they were born. Saying his numbers are vastly superior is an epic stretch at best. Just remember, Winslow played in only 109 games while Sharpe played in over 200. With that being said, Winslow had a higher catch per game average, by over a full reception, had a higher average per catch and only 17 fewer TD's in 95 fewer games played. On top of those number, let's just say Winslow is widely recognized as a revolutionary figure in the world of pro football. Other than blind Bronco fans and people born after 1980 will say Sharpe is better than the likes of Winslow.

Thats not what I said. I didnt say his numbers were vastly superior. I said his resume was vastly superior when you look at what it encompassed and I listed very specific items for why. How you missed that, i do not know. And since you didnt know what you were responding to, it makes your comments on not watching football before 1980 and blind Broncos fan even more silly.

But go ahead and try to name another TE who was an all time statistical leader for his position upon retirement, blocked for a 2,000 yard rusher and had 3 SB rings.

[Alliball]

Quote: Originally Posted by yvesdereuter

Thats not what I said. I didnt say his numbers were vastly superior. I said his resume was vastly superior when you look at what it encompassed and I listed very specific items for why. How you missed that, i do not know. And since you didnt know what you were responding to, it makes your comments on not watching football before 1980 and blind Broncos fan even more silly. But go ahead and try to name another TE who was an all time statistical leader for his position upon retirement, blocked for a 2,000 yard rusher and had 3 SB rings.

You're right my bad, I miss quoted you. And his resume is not vastly superior, still an epic stretch.