Who is your choice for QB?

[SPTO]

Quote: Originally Posted by CW McGraw

You know who should get thrown into this discussion more? Bert Jones. Other than Dan Marino, he was probably the greatest pure passer ever.

Injuries really ruined him. He had 4 or so really solid years then fell to pieces. Even when he was really good he kept collecting nagging injuries. I've got a game where he comes back from injury and he re-injures the shoulder again but STILL plays in the game and leads the Colts to victory over the 'Skins.

The guy was a tough SOB but when you get so much crap happen to you health wise then all the talent in the world isn't going to see you through.

[shotgun styles]

Quote: Originally Posted by SPTO

Close, but not quite. They give Peyton 3 different plays at one time. (2 passing 1 running) He then picks his play or audibles to one of the two at the LOS.

That is true in some situations, but the ultimate authority lies with the coaches. In specific down and distance situations Manning does not make the call.

He does have some play selection duties, you're right to point that out. But he's not the O-coordinator out there. That is more media hype than it is reality on the field.

[shotgun styles]

Quote: Originally Posted by CW McGraw

You know who should get thrown into this discussion more? Bert Jones. Other than Dan Marino, he was probably the greatest pure passer ever.

I would argue that Warner and Brady are better pure passers. Both are super accurate, and neither is any kind of running threat.

[CW McGraw]

Quote: Originally Posted by shotgun styles

I would argue that Warner and Brady are better pure passers. Both are super accurate, and neither is any kind of running threat.

Both are certainly accurate, but when I think of a great pure passer, arm strength factors into that decision greatly. Bert Jones is the only QB I've seen that could throw a forty yard bullet in the middle of a blizzard. I kid you not, this pass was never more than 12 feet off the ground. The guy was a freak. Warner and Brady have an NFL caliber arm, but neither has the arm that allows them to simply go out and improvise like Marino did.

[wheelman990]

Quote: Originally Posted by shotgun styles

Lord, not this crap again... Peyton Manning does NOT call his own plays. He has SOME freedom on audibles, but the coaches make the game plan and call the plays.

Wow another person who has no clue but wants to voice his opinion. Do some research before you talk. Tom Brady doesnt call the plays, Montana didnt call the plays, Peyton does.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/footb...afc-beat_x.htm

This isnt media hype its all over the webpages and has been said over and over again during nfl games. Not to mention tony Dungy addressed it. Why would a steelers fan try and prove something he doesnt really know to a colts fanatic?

Manning usually gets a call in of 3-4 plays, he picks at the line, or can audible out if he wishes. I CALL THAT CALLING THE PLAYS!!!! Its a one of a kind offense that reads the defense and picks its plays accordingly. Only with a QB as smart as Manning can this be done.

Basically he gets suggestions, but does what he wants. Really with his success would you have it any other way? Who better to call a play then a QB who see's what he is looking at. Dungy was awesome. He didnt have pride. He saw Manning could get it done, and let him.Tom Moore more or less makes suggestions of plays.

[tonybologna]

Marcus Vick! Ha! I'd have to go with Peyton on this one but I'm biased being a Tennessee Vols fan.

[allBthere]

Quote: Originally Posted by SPTO

Close, but not quite. They give Peyton 3 different plays at one time. (2 passing 1 running) He then picks his play or audibles to one of the two at the LOS.

From what I understand they aren't even specific plays he is given. It is kind of like that bar game qb club. Moore would say in peyton's ear "run right" or "draw" In many cases he is given 3 'concepts' and from there picks a specific play to relay to the team, and calls the blocking scheme and all that

[shotgun styles]

Quote: Originally Posted by CW McGraw

Both are certainly accurate, but when I think of a great pure passer, arm strength factors into that decision greatly. Bert Jones is the only QB I've seen that could throw a forty yard bullet in the middle of a blizzard. I kid you not, this pass was never more than 12 feet off the ground. The guy was a freak. Warner and Brady have an NFL caliber arm, but neither has the arm that allows them to simply go out and improvise like Marino did.

I would argue that pure passers don't improvise, gunslingers and play-makers do. Pure passers run the offense with precision, and usually opt out (throw the ball away) when things don't open up.

Bert had a good arm. Vick's is better, though he's no pure passer. I guess it's just a matter of what we each think a pure passer is, in terms of what makes one better than another. You bring up a good point with Bert, I just don't think he's quite what Warner and Brady are. In my mind, highly refined skills more define a pure passer than innate talents like arm strength.

Quote: Originally Posted by wheelman990

Wow another person who has no clue but wants to voice his opinion. Do some research before you talk. Tom Brady doesnt call the plays, Montana didnt call the plays, Peyton does. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/footb...afc-beat_x.htm This isnt media hype its all over the webpages and has been said over and over again during nfl games. Not to mention tony Dungy addressed it. Why would a steelers fan try and prove something he doesnt really know to a colts fanatic? Manning usually gets a call in of 3-4 plays, he picks at the line, or can audible out if he wishes. I CALL THAT CALLING THE PLAYS!!!! Its a one of a kind offense that reads the defense and picks its plays accordingly. Only with a QB as smart as Manning can this be done.

I call that a short leash. Terry Bradshaw called ALL of his own plays. All of them. No leash, no 2-3 play package. Indeed the coaches have 200 or so pass plays, and Manning gets to choose 2-3 of them. That's not calling your own plays, it's not much more than audible selection.

As for smarts, I don't think that has much to do with it. Chad Pennington was a Rhodes Scholar, he's never called his own plays. One thing has nothing to do with the other. It's more about trust than intelligence.

Quote: Originally Posted by wheelman990

Basically he gets suggestions, but does what he wants. Really with his success would you have it any other way? Who better to call a play then a QB who see's what he is looking at. Dungy was awesome. He didnt have pride. He saw Manning could get it done, and let him.Tom Moore more or less makes suggestions of plays.

Suggestions? Being allowed to pick only 3 plays out of 200 is a suggestion? So if you could only choose between peas, carrots, and lima beans for dinner every night, you'd be fine with that? No pizza, burgers, steak, or whatever YOU'RE hungry for, just the arbitrary 3 veggies chosen by someone else. That's not a real choice, and Manning is not a real play caller.

When Manning makes the game-plan, organizes the matchups, cuts the film, gets the ENTIRE playbook to choose from, AND is put in charge of substitutions, THEN you can call him a real play caller. Right now he's just another QB with an over hyped run/pass option.