Madden 2010 News Post

Madden NFL 10: PRO-TAK - What's NOT There Yet...

01:19 PM - May 9, 2009 by Ian_Cummings

I think more and more videos are going to be coming out by our marketing department and from preview events...just wanted to let you guys know what's missing from the feature still that we are working on (this also is a bit of a response to apex and co. and their critiques).

The biggest missing feature is probably carrying through velocity from original animations -> PRO-TAK. You can see that on the Lendale White video...meaning that when players transition from a normal mocap tackle into PRO-TAK stuff their velocities get zeroed out (meaning they stop in place). This will definitely be addressed before we ship...our goal is that you don't even notice the transition from one to the other...it should just look like another guy added on seamlessly. This is causing a lot of the feeling of "it needs more umph"...

Second biggest is the "warping" into the PRO-TAK multi-man stuff. This hasn't been tuned really so guys are just 'suction-ing' like magnets to the ballcarrier. Also when the guys add on the goal is that they drastically effect the pile's velocity and positioning and stuff...right now they just attach and that's about it. Again when the feature is actually done you should feel a lot more 'power' when these guys hit the pile.

The "endless chopping" stuff is often turned on for demo purposes...this will really not happen in the game when it ships...you'll see a guy drive forward and they'll then get pushed to fall forward or backward (or sideways or whatever) way quicker than just standing up chopping their feet.

Lastly, we really don't have barely any animation variety in there yet. We're looking to at least add quadruple the amount of stuff to keep it fresh. We've built some new tech this year that basically swaps the animation banks for each PRO-TAK set of animations after they play (moving them to the end of the list after they do), but up until basically today we haven't had the variety to swap. That will be coming very soon as well.

So anyway, I don't want to act like I don't want feedback from you guys as you see the new stuff...all of it is valuable and please keep posting...but I also wanted to let you know what we're currently working on. We definitely aren't going to be spending our whole cycle on this tech to have it not come out looking perfect. We just have to balance the needs of marketing to show stuff early even when it's not done.

- Ian

Game: Madden NFL 10Reader Score: 7.5/10 - Vote Now
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Member Comments

# 61 jjdogjjdog5162 @ 05/09/09 04:55 PM

ugghh...can we just get a backbreaker board already so this stuff will stop appearing in Madden Forums. Seriously, all these post defending/comparing backbreaker are getting old.

# 62 adembroski @ 05/09/09 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjdogjjdog5162


	ugghh...can we just get a backbreaker board already so this stuff will stop appearing in Madden Forums. Seriously, all these post defending/comparing backbreaker are getting old.

They'd still post here. Many of them are not interested in actually talking about BackBreaker, they just want something to compare Madden negatively too.

# 63 RGiles36 @ 05/09/09 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adembroski


	They'd still post here. Many of them are not interested in actually talking about BackBreaker, they just want something to compare Madden negatively too.

+1

BTW, good stuff Ian. It's comforting to know that there's still some critical work going into PRO-TAK to make it look better.

# 64 jjdogjjdog5162 @ 05/09/09 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adembroski


	They'd still post here. They're not interested in actually talking about BackBreaker, they just want something to compare Madden negatively too.

True. I just dont understand it. I love football games, and have been watching backbreaker, but im not going to say anything about it after a few short videos on tackling. I've went to their forum and tried to sift through the info to find anything about it being "sim" or franchise, or rules, or amount of teams, or gameplay in general, yet im not finding anything.

Maybe im looking at the wrong place, but i dont know how you could start comparing the game with a established franchise after what, 5 videos? And all they show is tackles and 1 pass.

On to the topic of this thread, im excited to actually see try pro-tak with all this stuff implemented. I like what i have seen so far, and these things make it sound like its only going to be getting better and better. One thing that excites me is hearing that the play can be called dead like in real life. Thats a "little" thing that i would of never of thought of. That will help with the immersion factor. Something madden has been missing for me for along time.

# 65 tron8 @ 05/09/09 05:04 PM

Sounds like the final product will be awesome

# 66 speedy9386 @ 05/09/09 05:05 PM

Why everytime I say something nobody listens? I said THE DEVS SAID THAT THE GLOWING BALL IS JUST A TRACKING SYSTEM ON REPLAYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

# 67 Unforgiven @ 05/09/09 05:13 PM

Wow, there is a nice sum of fanboyism in here. If you don't like what BB has to offer, then DON'T PLAY IT. If you don't like what Madden has to offer, then DON'T PLAY IT. I don't see why this has to expand, and eventually begin to derail a thread such as this. Can we move on, and talk on topic for once, please?

Anyways, from what I understand, Pro-tak will become less of a struggle, and more of who is the biggest guy that can jump in..?

And I'd like to see it where someone can come in at full speed, and lay a huge hit on the ball carrier. I'd hope that its not just going to be a few steps from side to side every single time. I'd also like to see some ball stripping animations in there to, like Urlacher always seems to do when there is a slew of defenders standing up the ball carrier.

# 68 adembroski @ 05/09/09 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hmoob


	It's clear this is isn't going anywhere. You're bias is clear and I can understand that. You've been given special privledges by the Madden team therefore it's natural for a average human being like you to have an emotional connection towards them and favor them, and your logic gets clouded, the hype takes over. It's ok though, You'll buy BB just like me. I wouldn't be surprised if you forced yourself to play Madden (assuming Madden fails) just to support EA with your time.

You know, I've been nothing but respectful. I've twice asked you to act with a modicum of respect, and you've ignored me twice. It's unfortunate you're on the other side of a computer screen because I sure wish I could break your fecking nose right now.

I considered ignoring this post because, well, it's rather infantile, and I can see you're more interested in attention whoring than debating, so from here out I will... but I just wanted to tell you that you have not-a-goddamn clue who I am or what I think. Do not presume to know what's going on inside my head.

You're a hypocrite and quite honestly, you're coming off as the biggest fanboy on these boards. You have been on here kissing BB *** from day one with no ****ing reason. I've played Madden, I have reason, and yes, I am able to put aside the hookers and blow they gave us and judge it on it's own merits. I hope to God BB is great, but that's not going to stop me from calling it out where it needs to improve. You wanna talk about cheap shots? How about assuming Ian Cummings = David Ortiz.

Anyways, I'm done. I'll let the rest of the board deal with you now. Most of them wont be as nice, thankfully.

# 69 canes21 @ 05/09/09 05:28 PM

lol First of all. The glowing ball is in replays and it may be an option in the final product. I still don't see how that makes the game unsim. Madden's balls are not even close to the correct size, though 10 is fixing that, so is Madden not sim?

Also, I find it funny that everyone blindly says Backbreaker his nothing but Blitz style tackles. First of all, blitz tackles usually end up 5 feet in the air. I don't see that in Backbreaker. Second of all, the developers are tuning the tackles to make them realistic. The only reason we see all these diving tackles is because those are highlight reel tackles. The trailers are meant to hype the game. If they just made a trailer full of regular old tackles, no casual would be interested.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say Backbreaker will be the most realistic football game to date. It uses the engine of the future. This engine reflects real momentum, gravity, etc. This will make players have to learn how to sprint and stay agile. The developers already stated that if you try to juke in aggressive mode you will fail hard. Before anyone says aggressive mode sounds like a Blitz idea,. Its more realistic than Sprint Buttons. Sprint buttons make you reach top speed in under a millisecond. Aggressive mode makes your guy lower his should and pick up momentum and speed as he goes.

Thank you.

# 70 prettyrik @ 05/09/09 05:28 PM

This is the exact purpose of forums and people expressing their criticism�s constructively to EA development team about the madden franchise. This is more reassurance to me that Ian and the rest of EA development team are reading our posts/blogs and acknowledging them in a timely manner letting us know what they are trying to do address issues and concerns raised by the madden community and the challenges they are currently facing. Instead of people constantly bashing who have no clue of what goes on behind the scenes of making a video game every year for the madden community's leisurely pleasure. Keep up the good work EA. Also a apexisfree should be acknowledge for making the constructive blog to get a response from the EA development team. That guy's videos are hilarious along with his vocabulary "U know" lmao.ffice

ffice" />>>

# 71 SageInfinite @ 05/09/09 05:37 PM

Is this the first time a game that doesn't even have a release date have fanboys? If so backbreaker is already ground breaking in that aspect.

# 72 canes21 @ 05/09/09 05:38 PM

It has a release date. It just hasn't been announced.

# 73 Valdarez @ 05/09/09 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adembroski


	They'd still post here. Many of them are not interested in actually talking about BackBreaker, they just want something to compare Madden negatively too.

It's nice to have something to compare Madden to, it just so happens that in many cases Madden compares negatively based on the last installment. That's not the posters, or the any other games fault. That's just Madden. If they don't want Madden to compare negatively, then make a better game (which it looks like they are trying to do), it's really that simple.

# 74 Valdarez @ 05/09/09 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Details


	I'm just happy there's another football game coming out. Glowing balls or not.

Right there with you. I'm stoked about the new technology. It's going to be interesting to see how backbreakers gang tackles (where more than 3 people are involved) look like in comparison with the new ProTak in Madden (back on topic FTW!).

# 75 adembroski @ 05/09/09 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valdarez


	It's nice to have something to compare Madden to, it just so happens that in many cases Madden compares negatively based on the last installment. That's not the posters, or the any other games fault. That's just Madden. If they don't want Madden to compare negatively, then make a better game (which it looks like they are trying to do), it's really that simple.

I don't disagree... but some people are only hear to **** on Madden, and BB is just a vehicle for that to them. hmoob is here for the sole purpose of ****ting on Madden. He's bringing nothing constructive, and BB is just his avenue. I don't think he cares what BB is or isn't, it's not Madden and that's all he cares about.

# 76 Marino @ 05/09/09 06:05 PM

Both you guys need to cool it. Now.

# 77 Droopy03 @ 05/09/09 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian_Cummings_EA


	I think more and more videos are going to be coming out by our marketing department and from preview events...just wanted to let you guys know what's missing from the feature still that we are working on (this also is a bit of a response to apex and co. and their critiques). The biggest missing feature is probably carrying through velocity from original animations -> PRO-TAK. You can see that on the Lendale White video...meaning that when players transition from a normal mocap tackle into PRO-TAK stuff their velocities get zeroed out (meaning they stop in place). This will definitely be addressed before we ship...our goal is that you don't even notice the transition from one to the other...it should just look like another guy added on seamlessly. This is causing a lot of the feeling of "it needs more umph"... Second biggest is the "warping" into the PRO-TAK multi-man stuff. This hasn't been tuned really so guys are just 'suction-ing' like magnets to the ballcarrier. Also when the guys add on the goal is that they drastically effect the pile's velocity and positioning and stuff...right now they just attach and that's about it. Again when the feature is actually done you should feel a lot more 'power' when these guys hit the pile. The "endless chopping" stuff is often turned on for demo purposes...this will really not happen in the game when it ships...you'll see a guy drive forward and they'll then get pushed to fall forward or backward (or sideways or whatever) way quicker than just standing up chopping their feet. Lastly, we really don't have barely any animation variety in there yet. We're looking to at least add quadruple the amount of stuff to keep it fresh. We've built some new tech this year that basically swaps the animation banks for each PRO-TAK set of animations after they play (moving them to the end of the list after they do), but up until basically today we haven't had the variety to swap. That will be coming very soon as well. So anyway, I don't want to act like I don't want feedback from you guys as you see the new stuff...all of it is valuable and please keep posting...but I also wanted to let you know what we're currently working on. We definitely aren't going to be spending our whole cycle on this tech to have it not come out looking perfect. We just have to balance the needs of marketing to show stuff early even when it's not done. - Ian

I know you said that you can hold the tackler up and come and hit stick, but teams like the Chicago Bears and the Ravens like to hold the guy and and come strip the ball. Will we be able to stip the ball if the ball carrier is not covering the ball up? Really if you think about it all teams are now taught to do that.

# 78 RGiles36 @ 05/09/09 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canes21


	*I'm going to go out on a limb and say Backbreaker will be the most realistic football game to date.* It uses the engine of the future. This engine reflects real momentum, gravity, etc. This will make players have to learn how to sprint and stay agile.

WOW!

(Subscribes to thread...)

# 79 Valdarez @ 05/09/09 06:16 PM

Generally speaking, I think ProTak will look better once we get a side view. So far all we have seen is a front or back view, which doesn't lend itself well to a feeling of movement forward or backwards. You really need the side view in order to appreciate the forward movement.

# 80 RGiles36 @ 05/09/09 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SageInfinite


	Is this the first time a game that doesn't even have a release date have fanboys? If so backbreaker is already ground breaking in that aspect.

Unprecedented, right?

. Admittedly, I jumped on the BB bandwagon about 15 months ago. I was stoked about the tech as it was the first I was hearing about it. 2-4 months of failed promises to deliver information were enough to turn me off though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by canes21


	It has a release date. It just hasn't been announced.

I wouldn't be so naive my friend. They had their entire fanbase (or at least those on their forums) swearing the game would debut in 2008. When those fans were getting skeptical, the "Head Coach" would assure the fans that infomation was imminent and a release date was coming soon. Needless to say, w/ the exception of a few more screens and short vids, we still have as much information as we did a year ago.

With that said, whether or not a release date is in place remains to be seen.

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