IGN 7.6

[jetsdynasty]

Quote: Originally Posted by Keirik

but you wouldnt be scoring apf up with madden 08, so what is your point? Madden people gave Madden a slide for several years due to the "It's their first effort on next gen..." but then hold 2k responsible as if the same doesnt apply to them ? Also, the game is groundbreaking on the concept of originality. We understand your point about apf. You've stated it and regurgitated it several times in this thread. However you are trying to compare apples and oranges...

Lets see. 1st off I wasnt comparing APF with Madden 2008. Madden 08 isnt even out yet. So thats the 1st thing. Yes Madden people and everyone else in the next gen era gave sports games a do over. Even 2K games. The all had there do overs. So If you read my post I said APF vs Madden 06 is no comparison. APF kills it. Madden 06 was horrible. Now, Madden 07 was a decent game. I liked it and I played about 5 seasons with it. I played NCAA 07 and thought the same. BUT I played NCAA 08 and I think it blows BOTH Maddens and NCAA 07 on next gen away.

Thats why im excited about Madden 2008. Thats all i was saying. The only one comparing anything is you. Apples and Oranges is compaing APF to Madden 2008. That what you are doing not me. Actually maybe not you personally but 2k fanboys are. I just want a great football game with all the bells and whistles. Thats all im saying.

[DaveDQ]

Quote: Originally Posted by blackceasar

Actually this game ISNT for the hardcore. its the most commericialized football title they could put out without having an NFL license. If it were for the hardcore they would have dumped the whole legends idea, made a completely generic football game, and put in a deep franchise mode, etc etc. They knew they were making another football game, and they wanted to make sales and get noticed again as a football game making company to the gernal buying public. That is why you have the legends in there (cuz people know who they are..and its the closests thing they can get to Madden in that aspect)..and thats why you have Rappers and stuff on commericals on ESPN promoting the game. My background is in marketing (be it im a designer ive been in markeint for 10+ yrs now).... here is what I think they did. They dont wanna sink a TON of money into promoting this game because it might backfire. Every time they run that commerical it costs serious money and it costs money to run it on a bunch of diff chanels at a bunch of diff times. Since the game itself is a bit of a risk (because its NOT an NFL title) they have to do some balancing with thier money as far as how much to spend on promoting a game that youre not sure will sell enough to even recoup the promotion costs. So they looked for that demographic of people who are sports fans, but not die hard video game sports fans. They marketed this game to that dude who does watch his sportcenter at 6 and 10 pm and probably owns a console system, but isnt the kind of dude whos so into it that hes a member of a site like this one. This is called 'segmentation'. Tihs same dude is just hip enough to recognize some of the rappers promoting this game which help give the game some "crediblity" in his eyes. For the hardcore? I dont think so. I think they made this game as mass appealing as they possibly could without violating the NFL/EA deal.

Again, if that's the case, and if you do have a background in marketing, you will very quickly notice how uninspiring the periphials of this game are. What exactly is in the makeup of this game that will initially impress a newcomer and make them stay with it?

I personally believe they ran out of time with this title. Look, I wanted this game as much as anyone else, but I'm not going to get caught up in the hype around here that is forcing the greatness of this game. There's a reason Chau was so quick to say they weren't working on this game for 3 years, the game is incomplete. I don't care that this is its first year on next-gen systems. If you are saying the success of this year's game is going to be a guage for future releases, you don't make this year's game such a shallow, confusing, mixed up game.

I love 2K Sports and what they have done in the last 7-8 years. But, this game is in its honeymoon stage. The fans of the franchise, those who are familiar with 2K football, will play this game for some time, but don't for a minute think this game will last more than a month in the library of those who are unfamiliar with 2K football.

Quote: Originally Posted by burnwood

Hmmm, I don't remember them actually saying 'hardcore', I remember them saying they made this game for 'the fans' of 2K football.

Ok, bad choice of word. When I say hardcore, I mean those who know of and anticipated this title since 2K lost the license. ie. the fans.

[grunt]

Quote: Originally Posted by blackceasar

Grunt yes its deep in the way youre talking about but IMO that means it's "one dimensional deep". To me having a game with 1000000 plays with 100000 ways to configure a team but has no franchise mode or other things we have come to expect is still not a deep game to me. On that same note though, a game with a huge franchise mode, online play, etc etc but has 50 plays would not be a deep game either IMO.

Many people would say 2k5 was the greatest football game ever but the franchise mode was broken. How many people here ran multiple seasons in 2k5? How many people care that the "crib" mode is gone and how many people played first person football?

When we take all these features away what we had was a great season mode, online play and online leagues. I really don't see that much of a difference between the 2 games except the improvement of the engine. I played 2k5 to death for 3 years playing online, online leagues and season mode. I didn't feel like managing all 32 teams in franchise.

Wanna bet madden franchise will be "broken" again and how the hardcore NCAA guys will still have to use "house rules" to not exploit the weak ai. The weakest aspect in console sport games are the franchise mode. Even if APF had a franchise mode would reviewers play it? No. Franchise mode is just one of the check list for sport games and the quality of these modes are usually ignored by reviewers and constantly complained by hard core gamers.

It is the engine that will carry this game.

Peace

[Panzeh]

People talk about the Madden franchise like it was groundbreaking but it usually really ended up with almost all players falling in the 82-86 overall category with free agents just below. As soon as the real players retired and generated players took their place, the league got pretty homogenous, 82-86 overall.

[LIGHTNING]

I like this game for what it does have like better game play than the competition. The crowd reacts logically to what is happening in the game and it feels ALIVE! There is nothing more boring than playing a football game with the atmosphere and presentation of a MEME convention.

[goz]

Quote: Originally Posted by grunt

Many people would say 2k5 was the greatest football game ever but the franchise mode was broken. How many people here ran multiple seasons in 2k5? How many people care that the "crib" mode is gone and how many people played first person football? When we take all these features away what we had was a great season mode, online play and online leagues. I really don't see that much of a difference between the 2 games except the improvement of the engine. I played 2k5 to death for 3 years playing online, online leagues and season mode. I didn't feel like managing all 32 teams in franchise. Wanna bet madden franchise will be "broken" again and how the hardcore NCAA guys will still have to use "house rules" to not exploit the weak ai. The weakest aspect in console sport games are the franchise mode. Even if APF had a franchise mode would reviewers play it? No. Franchise mode is just one of the check list for sport games and the quality of these modes are usually ignored by reviewers and constantly complained by hard core gamers. It is the engine that will carry this game. Peace

Good Post. Co-sign. Now back to playing APF

Peace.
GOZ

[puja21]

Quote: Originally Posted by grunt

Many people would say 2k5 was the greatest football game ever but the franchise mode was broken.

i dont think the franchise mode was anymore "broken" than the gamplay (as in not so). do most/all franchise modes have some problems? of course. but even 2K5 had many people developing "house rules" as you put it for gameplay to avoid exploiting AI issues. just search "house rules" here @ OS to see proof of this.

yes there are things like:
-problems w/ CPU signings (too many good players @ the same pos or none at others)
-draft class bug in the 1st round
-trade exploitation
-progression issues (too fast, no one goes backwards, the different attributes which improve dont always naturally "mix" or go together)

this doesnt equate w/ broken for me, however. even the amazing gameplay of 2K5 has many more issues than this (some of which can be corrected w/ sliders or house rules, & many which cannot). but nobody would say the gameplay is "broken." it's amazing in spite of issues-- & all sports games will have some issues replicating reality.

i love franchise mode in 2K5 & many other games despite a few issues. do i play more than 2 seasons like you said? almost never, but that isn't because of any deficiencies in the game mode itself... it's just because i that's how i like to play franchise. personally, i dont think that says anything significant about the quality of the franchise mode.

[ChicagoSparty]

I can't really complain about the review. The game is good, the gameplay is great, but I am left wanting more at times. You just have to take some points off for that, no question.