CPU Bullpen Management

[bravesfan1984]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

I haven't kept track as much as last year, but i've seen good results with the following.

Here's my setup
LR1: SP6 or RP w/ highest Sta.
MR1: 2nd best PC
MR2: 3rd best PC
MR3: 4th best PC
MR4: 5th best PC
SU1: Best PC
SU2: Best LHP

If my 2 most clutch are lefties, I slot the most clutch RHP in SU1, most clutch in MR1, next in SU2.

In my limited testing, I haven't seen the LRP coming in near as much as I did last year. Middle relievers haven't been left in for more than 1 inning. I've only seen good signs as far as BP logic.

Any more testing with this setup?

[knich]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

Any more testing with this setup?

I tried this set up and it didn't work well for the slider set I'm using. Perhaps others have had more promising results.

[bravesfan1984]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

I tried this set up and it didn't work well for the slider set I'm using. Perhaps others have had more promising results.

What slider set you use? I use Josh's.

[garry1221]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

Any more testing with this setup?

I'm still seeing smart usage. Relievers rarely go more than 1 inning. LR only comes in before 5th in blowouts. Reminder I only sim, but based on box scores, I see no reason to change things up.

[knich]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

What slider set you use? I use Josh's.

TrueSim with his roster. I am testing a couple of the suggestions here though.

I'm still seeing smart usage. Relievers rarely go more than 1 inning. LR only comes in before 5th in blowouts. Reminder I only sim, but based on box scores, I see no reason to change things up.

The problem is not so much the number of innings per outing but whom the CPU is using per outing. CPU is not using its full roster of pitchers. It recycles the same ones. And they are not the best ones.

[JoseJoseph9119]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

Its pretty common. They make good long relievers. And if a guy is on the 40 man roster and is a better pitcher than guys who are in the bigs, its totally logical for the CPU to bring him up and put him in the MLB pen then to keep him at AAA, unless he's a top prospect who needs to develop.

Unfortunately the CPU is anything but logical, as I usually see A potential guys get eaten alive as long men while a C potential journeyman with some good per/9s sits in AAA.

The issue is starters are inherently higher OVR than relievers in general. This is why I believe it's vital to edit some starters into relievers to balance things out. If a guy has been pitching out of the pen in the bigs without a start for 2 years or is fully developed and blocked(or blocking a top prospect) from the rotation then I will make him a RP. My formula goes:

20 point trade from stamina to durability
Boost his 2 highest per/9s by 5-7
Delete his worst pitch and reorder the rest if necessary
Save and exit to check his OVR(should be 5-6 points lower)
Go back in and add to his 3rd highest per/9 until he is back to his original OVR

I never touch the clutch rating or boost any pitches as they don't affect OVR enough to be fairly boosted. I also never boost the worst per/9 to keep some semblance of realism. The final result is successful in making a statistically slightly above average-to-solid RP about ~60% of the time, which is about what I would think a team would hope for in making the conversion in real life

[garry1221]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

The problem is not so much the number of innings per outing but whom the CPU is using per outing. CPU is not using its full roster of pitchers. It recycles the same ones. And they are not the best ones.

When I started looking at the 'pen more it was because my LR was coming in too frequently and my MR were going 2 IP/G quite a bit. So IP was a big part of figuring out a more logical pen. As long as I'm not seeing MR or SU going 2 IP on a regular basis, I'm happy.

I'm not going to pretend I know any pens other than my own team. I'm not a 30 team control person. At seasons end of every test I've done RP's have mostly averaged 1 IP/G, leaguewide. Through the season I randomly choose 1 or 2 games per week and look at the boxscores to make sure the pen is being utilized right. If something looks off, I may check the game or two before to see if a pitcher's being rested. By and large with my setup, I see very few questionable decisions.

[tdogg097]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

I have tried every slider combination I can think of and I'm convinced the only way to get realistic bullpen usage is to quick manage every game.

The bullpen logic is totally broken and sliders can't fix it. If you make the SP stamina too high and the hook too low then you'll get an insane amount of complete games. RP stamina too low and hook too high you get an insane amount of games pitched. I thought I might of had a breakthrough with zeroing out SP stamina, RP stamina and hook. Everything looked pretty good. Low number of complete games but still realistic innings per start, a little high on total relief appearances but reasonable. Then I noticed the offense had gone insane. Angels team hit over .300 with 1000+ runs scored. Lowest team batting average was .260. The only sliders that impact sim stats are stamina and hook so there is no way to correct the increased offense.

It's almost like they need 2 separate hook sliders. One for starters and one for relievers. However, I'm not even sure that would fix certain relievers from being forgotten in the bullpen. It is a frustrating situation and has been a showstopper for me starting a franchise.

[JDL375]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

Every game I play, the CPU bring in ONE reliever following the starter, and he completes the game no matter if it is 2,3,4+ innings.

And even WORSE, when I play a 3 game series against the same team, they will use the same reliever in EVERY game.

I am the Yankees and in the first series against Baltimore, they brought in Richard Bleier 3 games in a row and he pitched, 3, 2, and 5 innings respectively.

I've also never had the CPU bring in their closer in to start the 9th in a save situation. Usually the previous reliever will start the 9th and the CPU won't bring in the closer until 1 or 2 outs into the 9th.

CPU Bullpen logic is, was, and probably always will be busted. I just don't think there's a way to get a computer to think like a person when it comes to pitching decisions.

[knich]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

Every game I play, the CPU bring in ONE reliever following the starter, and he completes the game no matter if it is 2,3,4+ innings.

And even WORSE, when I play a 3 game series against the same team, they will use the same reliever in EVERY game.

I am the Yankees and in the first series against Baltimore, they brought in Richard Bleier 3 games in a row and he pitched, 3, 2, and 5 innings respectively.

I've also never had the CPU bring in their closer in to start the 9th in a save situation. Usually the previous reliever will start the 9th and the CPU won't bring in the closer until 1 or 2 outs into the 9th.

CPU Bullpen logic is, was, and probably always will be busted. I just don't think there's a way to get a computer to think like a person when it comes to pitching decisions.

I think there is but SDS has to put the time in to write the code. Just not a priority for them.

Anyone know if OOTP Baseball handles pitching decisions properly?

[ktd1976]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

one other question: when you say highest rated..do you mean overall or based on clutch rating?

The old system is not working this year. I am interested in both of these approaches.




I am using TrueSim too. Curious are you using these ratings for both played and sim games?

Also, with the low SP stamina how many innings are your SPs averaging in played and sim?



I like this approach too. Are the results impacted if you have 2 LRs with 1 LR being your 2nd best MR?

This year I can't get the CPU to use that 2nd best MR in the LR slot.

The CPU will not bring in a MRP in situations where the LRP would be used. IE before the 6th inning.

If you have 2 relievers in the LRP slots, it will use the highest rated overall, UNLESS their stamina is low, then it will bring in the other one.

Same thing with MRPs. It will use the HIGHEST OVR MRP first, and so on. Unless stamina is depleted.

I just finished a 3 game series against Seattle, and the CPU used every reliever in the bullpen, except the closer, because they never had a save situation.

[Unlucky 13]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

The CPU will not bring in a MRP in situations where the LRP would be used. IE before the 6th inning.

If you have 2 relievers in the LRP slots, it will use the highest rated overall, UNLESS their stamina is low, then it will bring in the other one.

Same thing with MRPs. It will use the HIGHEST OVR MRP first, and so on. Unless stamina is depleted.

I just finished a 3 game series against Seattle, and the CPU used every reliever in the bullpen, except the closer, because they never had a save situation.

Well, the answer there is that it depends. You are right that the CPU will always want to bring in a LR instead of a MR in those cases. However, things can alter that like the LR being out of energy, getting shelled as soon as he comes into the game, or being forced to pinch hit in a NL game.

I had a game this year where the opposing starter was knocked out of the game in the first inning with an injury. The CPU brought in their LR, but he was already in the yellow. I knocked him around for the remainder of the first and the second, and they pinch hit to start the third. Since it was a home game for me, I ended up going through the rest of their bullpen the remaining seven innings.

Playing without the DH, IMO, absolutely effects how quickly the CPU will change guys out.

[garry1221]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

The three sliders that affect that the most are starter/reliever stamina and manager hook. Low settings on these will basically make it that every pitcher throws worth his stamina and little to nothing more, while not being taken out unless he's getting roasted. So less 4 inning LR outings and fewer overworked middle relievers.

I used to want PC and STA to match. I mean, it seems logical .. but it's not. If STA was strictly tied to PC, pitchers would be absolutely gassed at their STA # with default sliders. The STA attribute is more or less when pitchers start tiring and pitches start losing effectiveness. Most SP are good for 80 to 90 pitches minimum per start, but in the game, far fewer have 80+ STA attributes.

[ktd1976]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

Well, the answer there is that it depends. You are right that the CPU will always want to bring in a LR instead of a MR in those cases. However, things can alter that like the LR being out of energy, getting shelled as soon as he comes into the game, or being forced to pinch hit in a NL game.

I had a game this year where the opposing starter was knocked out of the game in the first inning with an injury. The CPU brought in their LR, but he was already in the yellow. I knocked him around for the remainder of the first and the second, and they pinch hit to start the third. Since it was a home game for me, I ended up going through the rest of their bullpen the remaining seven innings.

Playing without the DH, IMO, absolutely effects how quickly the CPU will change guys out.

I have yet to see a MRP get out in a game before the 5th inning, unless the opponent only had 1 pitcher slotted as a LRP.

If they have 2 slotted at LRP, then they will put in the higher rated one unless his stamina is low. If that pitcher gets knicked out before the 6th inning, they will put in the other LRP regardless of his stamina level remaining.

[The Kid 24]

Re: CPU Bullpen Management

The CPU will not bring in a MRP in situations where the LRP would be used. IE before the 6th inning.

If you have 2 relievers in the LRP slots, it will use the highest rated overall, UNLESS their stamina is low, then it will bring in the other one.

Same thing with MRPs. It will use the HIGHEST OVR MRP first, and so on. Unless stamina is depleted.

I just finished a 3 game series against Seattle, and the CPU used every reliever in the bullpen, except the closer, because they never had a save situation.

How did you achieve this?