Angryjoe's 2k take.

[mb625]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

This whole "lacked self-control" thing is an undefeated excuse. You're depressed? It's because you lack self control. You have ADHD? It's because you lack self control. You don't like the way you look so you get plastic surgery? It's because you lack self control.

Lack of self control is undefeated. That's why people take advantage of those who may have an underlying "personality disorder". Someone call you out on it, just say, "Hey, no one told them to get addicted! They have a disorder!". Best excuse in the world.

Dude. As someone with ADHD and Anxiety, having these compared to something like spending tons of money virtual currency on a video game is laughable at best and a little offensive at worst.

More on topic, the portions that are "gambling" are not tethered to the buying of VC. The fact that this has lasted seven pages is laughable. Yes, micro-transactions aren't good. Yes, they need to change. And yeah, they can be predatory for some who do not exercise control over their finances. Yes, addiction is a bad thing and yes those people do need help to cease this behavior, but the presence of "casino-like elements" in the mode isn't a part of this. At all. It actually provides some of the free things that this game has to offer. This game is no worse than it was last year in these terms.

If you'd like to avoid these elements, then there are plenty of modes for you to do so. If you'd like to avoid the game altogether, that's your prerogative. If you're worried about the behavior of your kids, strictly charge them not to spend money on that game, and make sure there are consequences if/when they do. It really is not that difficult from a personal perspective.

[ILLSmak]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

You could substitute 2K for any product and the same points still stand. Dont let that knock you off that soapbox, though.


Sent from my SM-G950U using Operation Sports mobile app

Exactly, I'm all for removing that 'it's 2k' from the equation. Seems like it's really getting in the way of people understanding the point.



Edit: no micros *are* predatory whether you are preyed on by them or not. They are conceptually predatory. It's not just consuming money but time. It's designed to make you addicted to the game and spending money. Honestly, I care about the latter. The former is troubling, too, the way it's woven in (that it's broken down to such a reward/no reward) at its base level, not just like... y'know running to the end of a stage and pulling down a flag, or being happy you dropped 50.



But if you hole yourself up and play 2k and lose your job or flunk out of college, then you bear some responsibility for that. You bear responsibility for spending money on micros, too, but you are punishing yourself if you don't, if you math out time as a money value, basically sweat shop wages beat grinding 2k.



-Smak

[awg811]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Gambling is a game of chance. Ante up is a game of skill. You’re playing a normal game of basketball, just with VC on the line.

Gambling is no more a game of chance than 2k or any other sport. Texas Hold’em, Black jack, even slots take skill. The only thing “skill” does is increase your chances of winning.


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[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Real talk...If you regulate games for "gambling" to protect the "weak" , then you need to start regulating games for violence, drugs, and sex.

You can't regulate one item while touching on the other ones. So ask yourself. How bad you want the government to regulate your hobby, because a small percentage of people blame their behavior on your hobby?

[triplechin]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

No video game designer is intentionally trying to get people that play their games to shoot people or sex or whatever and there is no evidence that it affects the players in a significant way (that I have read up on).

Meanwhile they do have people who they hire just to exploit mtx and algorithms which are specifically designed to exploit frustrating mechanics and vulnerable moments to squeeze that extra cash.

Sounds like a dumb comparison to me. And again, no I'm not buying this year bc they ruined the mode that I enjoy (ProAM/Park) by making the grind trash and not improving the modes significantly.

[fysens]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Some elements of the game use the same psychological hooks as gambling such as partial reinforcement mechanisms and near misses, and now they added literal gambling devices to deliver the prizes. Yet according to some of you, as long as it eludes the technical definition of gambling, we are supposed to be unconcerned that this type of psychological manipulation techniques makes its way into our basketball game of choice.

[Kid OS]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Real talk...If you regulate games for "gambling" to protect the "weak" , then you need to start regulating games for violence, drugs, and sex.

You can't regulate one item while touching on the other ones. So ask yourself. How bad you want the government to regulate your hobby, because a small percentage of people blame their behavior on your hobby?

Do you see violence, drugs, or sex in NBA2K20?

It's an E rated BASKETBALL game.

[mb625]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Do you see violence, drugs, or sex in NBA2K20?

It's an E rated BASKETBALL game.

I see you missed the point...

[BasketBalla21]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

I see you missed the point...

They always miss the point. They're not even interested in actually talking about how the mode works or introducing ways to improve it before they implode it.

Only two people have given suggestions for alternatives to the pack opening structure and they suggested alternatives that are more time consuming than the current structure.

The least they could do is have an alternative that the MyTeam community would accept before they try to destroy the mode forever. But they're forever hiding behind children they don't have and people with poor self-control that they don't even know.

I'm not an anarchist, I have a lot of respect for government and lawmakers that I know are un-corrupted. But I do not want the same people that tell me Call of Duty turns kids into school shooters to determine what is "good for the children" in 2k. They don't understand the medium. Until they do they shouldn't touch it.

[Vroman]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

They always miss the point. They're not even interested in actually talking about how the mode works or introducing ways to improve it before they implode it.

Only two people have given suggestions for alternatives to the pack opening structure and they suggested alternatives that are more time consuming than the current structure.

The least they could do is have an alternative that the MyTeam community would accept before they try to destroy the mode forever. But they're forever hiding behind children they don't have and people with poor self-control that they don't even know.

I'm not an anarchist, I have a lot of respect for government and lawmakers that I know are un-corrupted. But I do not want the same people that tell me Call of Duty turns kids into school shooters to determine what is "good for the children" in 2k. They don't understand the medium. Until they do they shouldn't touch it.

Regarding packs , at least one thing must be mandatory. Its shown chance to pull anything possible. Now we don't know the chance at all, you don't know at all what you getting per x amount of money spent. 2k could just straight disable or tamper the chances for certain card if they wanted.

Having casino machines to decide progress in basketball game is just awful and such desperate way to add "more stuff" rather than improving quality of the game in general.

2k don't do it out of gratitude for people grinding myteam without money spent either. You will definitely need to have strong cards to win online TTO consistently (speaking about average players, not the top 1% "elite skills") to get the "rolls" on those machines and if rewards gonna appear very good they will nerf it like they did in 2k19.

In mycareer case 2k nerfed VC gain from regular games big time (like 2-3 times) and spin wheel was added instead. Sure maybe 0.5% population gonna win 1 milion VC and chance of winning it look like something 2k "improved" for players.

Whats really nasty and got overlooked by reviewers not familiar with nba 2k is ante up mode. Playing wager games with in game currency that you can purchase is just too shady. Yes you can argue you can wager the VC u gotten for free from other game modes, but so you can gameble money on real casino from cash grandpa gifted or whatever and say why to regulate gambling and not rate it "for kids" as well.

[mb625]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Regarding packs , at least one thing must be mandatory. Its shown chance to pull anything possible. Now we don't know the chance at all, you don't know at all what you getting per x amount of money spent. 2k could just straight disable or tamper the chances for certain card if they wanted.

Having casino machines to decide progress in basketball game is just awful and such desperate way to add "more stuff" rather than improving quality of the game in general.

2k don't do it out of gratitude for people grinding myteam without money spent either. You will definitely need to have strong cards to win online TTO consistently (speaking about average players, not the top 1% "elite skills") to get the "rolls" on those machines and if rewards gonna appear very good they will nerf it like they did in 2k19.

In mycareer case 2k nerfed VC gain from regular games big time (like 2-3 times) and spin wheel was added instead. Sure maybe 0.5% population gonna win 1 milion VC and chance of winning it look like something 2k "improved" for players.

Whats really nasty and got overlooked by reviewers not familiar with nba 2k is ante up mode. Playing wager games with in game currency that you can purchase is just too shady. Yes you can argue you can wager the VC u gotten for free from other game modes, but so you can gameble money on real casino from cash grandpa gifted or whatever and say why to regulate gambling and not rate it "for kids" as well.

Here's another thing I don't understand about this whole argument. These "casino machines" are completely unrelated to the monetary side of the game. They give you free things that you would get either way, regardless of method for distributing them, just for playing the game. Is it a bad design choice? Maybe. Is it in anyway promoting the gambles within the game? No. Should those gambles be removed? Maybe, but that's ultimately not something that I think should be regulated.

Looking at VC gains from MC this year, it looks to be better based on what I've seen. 12 to 14 hundred if you play your way to a solid first round pick. I'm assuming that's just a base that doesn't include bonuses for performance that have always existed, it seems that VC will be easier to come by this time around.

[Kstat]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

...and here we come to the actual reason for the fake outrage. Entitlement. “I want a maxed out player in an online mode from the beginning without any cost or effort. Because, I’m better than everyone else. I have a life, which is totally unique to me and nobody else.”

At least this one is honest.

No one cares about your “life,” dude. The game would suck if everyone has max attributes right away and The neighborhoods would be empty by Halloween. If you don’t want to work at it, don’t play MyPlayer, or just don’t buy 2K. There absolutely is an aspect of grinding which makes you appreciate what you have. Maybe 2K could tone is down a notch, but that’s still a reward for investing time into the mode. Take that away and it gets taken for granted.

[Kid OS]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

I see you missed the point...

How? He said that if they regulated "gambling" in the games, they would then have to regulate "drugs, sex, and violence" in the games. Do you see drugs, sex, or violence in NBA2K? No. Regulation is already happening. It just needs work.

[Vroman]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

...and here we come to the actual reason for the fake outrage. Entitlement. “I want a maxed out player in an online mode from the beginning without any cost or effort. Because, I’m better than everyone else. I have a life, which is totally unique to me and nobody else.”

At least this one is honest.

No one cares about your “life,” dude. The game would suck if everyone has max attributes right away and The neighborhoods would be empty by Halloween. If you don’t want to work at it, don’t play MyPlayer, or just don’t buy 2K. There absolutely is an aspect of grinding which makes you appreciate what you have. Maybe 2K could tone is down a notch, but that’s still a reward for investing time into the mode. Take that away and it gets taken for granted.

NBA 2k gameplay (and basketballin general) is deep enough to have "grind" in a state of learning game controls and basketball strategies in general. If your statements were true, we wouldn't have other PVP type games striving without "grinding/paying for advantage" .
Even from 2k16 experience your statements straight false. It was nothing special being 99 ovr there, it was easy (relative to last few 2k games) to get your player maxed, but i still saw parks full by the end of game cycle.

[mb625]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

How? He said that if they regulated "gambling" in the games, they would then have to regulate "drugs, sex, and violence" in the games. Do you see drugs, sex, or violence in NBA2K? No. Regulation is already happening. It just needs work.

His point was that if a game like 2k needs to be regulated via governance for microtransactions, video games which promote sex, drugs and violence ought to be regulated for these things too. Given that no one seems to be taking the charge on that one, why take up this crusade?

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