Angryjoe's 2k take.

[Kstat]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

NBA 2k gameplay (and basketballin general) is deep enough to have "grind" in a state of learning game controls and basketball strategies in general. If your statements were true, we wouldn't have other PVP type games striving without "grinding/paying for advantage" .
Even from 2k16 experience your statements straight false. It was nothing special being 99 ovr there, it was easy (relative to last few 2k games) to get your player maxed, but i still saw parks full by the end of game cycle.

Yeah....no you didn't. At least not anywhere close to what it is now.


Yes, there is PNO for people that don't want to work for anything....and it's not even close to as active as MyPlayer. And once you get past 85 there is no "paying," to skip to the next level. it's just you working to break the next level cap.

[Kid OS]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

...and here we come to the actual reason for the fake outrage. Entitlement. “I want a maxed out player in an online mode from the beginning without any cost or effort. Because, I’m better than everyone else. I have a life, which is totally unique to me and nobody else.”

At least this one is honest.

No one cares about your “life,” dude. The game would suck if everyone has max attributes right away and The neighborhoods would be empty by Halloween. If you don’t want to work at it, don’t play MyPlayer, or just don’t buy 2K. There absolutely is an aspect of grinding which makes you appreciate what you have. Maybe 2K could tone is down a notch, but that’s still a reward for investing time into the mode. Take that away and it gets taken for granted.

He's literally the only person in here who has said anything about wanted to have a maxed out player instantly. The only time this is ever brought up is when people say that MyCareer and MyPark should be separated.

What most people want is a less grueling grind and less focus on VC. I'm sure you and I can agree on that. There are very few people out here who will whine about not having a 99 overall player at any point in the game's lifespan. We really just wanna be able to get up to a 97 overall in about 320 hours (which is around two months of playing the game for 5 hours a day if my math is correct). That's all.

The real entitlement comes from the people who ignore the issues that others are having simply because it, "doesn't affect me".

[Vroman]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Yeah....no you didn't. At least not anywhere close to what it is now.


Yes, there is PNO for people that don't want to work for anything....and it's not even close to as active as MyPlayer. And once you get past 85 there is no "paying," to skip to the next level. it's just you working to break the next level cap.

Comparing PNO with MyCareer is like comparing different video games entirely. Doesn't shock me that mycareer got more players (was the case in 2k16 as well), its so much easier to get into controling one player with optimal animations and build you comfortable with than learn how to run all players in ur team, their strengthts, tendencies, find out goot team strategy etc. Besides PNO got much less development from 2k in general, its treated like a side kick mode .


I was playing few days until 2k17 release and park was packed with people. . I even played it few months after 2k17 and sunset park was still full of people. But ok you know better what I saw or didn't..

[Kid OS]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

His point was that if a game like 2k needs to be regulated via governance for microtransactions, video games which promote sex, drugs and violence ought to be regulated for these things too. Given that no one seems to be taking the charge on that one, why take up this crusade?

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Ah I see now. Thanks for the clarification. My point still stands tho. The games that promote sex, drugs, and violence are pretty much all rated T and up. I'm sure someone can find a few games that are rated E and fit the description, but for the most part, E rated games don't fit. That's why I dont get his arguement. These games are already being regulated whether we like it or not. That's why we have the "idea of the ESRB" , and why certain places are beginning to investigate these new gaming practices at a governmental level. I'm sure we all remember the Hot Coffee mod for GTA:SA back in the days. Just recently, a few countries have banned GTA's new Casino thingy majiggy they have now. Pretty sure Manhunt had an A rating at some point in time. You see the picture. Games are regulated, and for no reason should a person believe that they are not. With the way Take Two is handling microtransactions, they have exceeded the E rating in my opinion. The fact that you can wager VC on a pickup game, in a game where VC can be bought using real money, goes to show that what people are doing on NBA 2K is 100% gambling, and it should be categorized as such. Slot machine or no slot machine.

[Kid OS]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Also, remember that nothing in NBA 2K is bought with real money. This is Take Two's workaround for avoiding the gambling loophole. All of their prices are in VC. Doing this ensures that their is no paper trail. No one can say that they "bought something in NBA 2K using real money." The reality is that they bought it with VC... a currency which is unregulated. VC's is fiat money, without a legal tender.

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Ah I see now. Thanks for the clarification. My point still stands tho. The games that promote sex, drugs, and violence are pretty much all rated T and up. I'm sure someone can find a few games that are rated E and fit the description, but for the most part, E rated games don't fit. That's why I dont get his arguement. These games are already being regulated whether we like it or not. That's why we have the "idea of the ESRB" , and why certain places are beginning to investigate these new gaming practices at a governmental level. I'm sure we all remember the Hot Coffee mod for GTA:SA back in the days. Just recently, a few countries have banned GTA's new Casino thingy majiggy they have now. Pretty sure Manhunt had an A rating at some point in time. You see the picture. Games are regulated, and for no reason should a person believe that they are not. With the way Take Two is handling microtransactions, they have exceeded the E rating in my opinion. The fact that you can wager VC on a pickup game, in a game where VC can be bought using real money, goes to show that what people are doing on NBA 2K is 100% gambling, and it should be categorized as such. Slot machine or no slot machine.

Then rate NBA 2K "T" and call it a night...

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

The fact you think people shouldn't just be able to turn on a video game to have fun and be on an even playing field with everyone else where skill and teamwork is what matters shows just how brainwashed your crowd has become.

Tons of other games have been successful with cosmetic rewards instead of Pay2Win advantages, but you do you broseph.

I don't know about that. Maybe I just have an "old head philosophy" regarding competition. Personally, I believe that EVERYONE should have a starting point, then it's just survival of the fitness when it comes to online multiplayer games. GRANTED and admittedly, VC does allow people to jump over the base starting point and pick their own starting point. However, that does't really bother me so much, since MyPark is open where those people (in theory) should be playing games against other high overall opponents and not beating up on weaker competition. Although to my understanding, that's been addressed for NBA 2K20.

The idea of "even playing field" sounds too much like "participation trophies" to me. I ABSOLUTELY HATE the concept of participation trophies. Every time my kids got one those lame trophies, I just threw them in the garbage. Of course, that's assuming that the competition is not using game exploits and cheats to win the game.

[awg811]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

There’s a reason why 2k gives more attention, development time, and features to MyCareer and MyTeam.
It’s because they’ve not yet found a way to get users to spend actual money on the other modes.
Let’s say that in PNO or Franchise/MyLeague you had to pay each player in VC to be able to use them. If you want to play with the Warriors full team, you’d have to pay the players, especially the good ones lots of VC in order to use them. Example, Steph would cost 500 VC, Klay, Draymond, and Russell 400 VC a piece, and role players 200 VC a piece for every game you play. You can earn 1,000 VC per win plus 200 to 400 for in game performance.
There’s really no way to use the real team unless, 1. you buy VC, or 2. you grind out VC using weak teams until you have the VC to purchase the full squad.
This is the pay to win model that 2k uses in MyCareer and MyTeam. You want to be the best, pay to be the best or grind for months so that you can be decent. Then add in boosts, Gatorade, clothes, and shoes.
Now in PNO and Franchise/MyTeam you can get the players if you pay the VC, but if you want them to be wearing their signature shoes, sleeves, handbands, what have you, you have to buy those things with more VC. If you want them to have stamina and boosts you can buy those as well. And you better, because in order to be competitive, you’ll have to because those that don’t mind paying real money will have them.
I hope that 2k takes my example and puts it in the game so that all people can experience the shady pay to win practices in their favorite game mode.
You start out as a 60 Overall in MyCareer and it costs 200 thousand VC to get to an 85. Someone please show me a first round draft pick in 2k that’s a 60 Overall, I don’t believe you’ll be able to.
You’re intentionally a 60 Overall in order to incentivize you to buy VC to upgrade to 85 Overall so that you can be competitive. Can you grind it out and eventually become an 85 overall, sure, if you want to spend months just to become competitive. 2k knows that most people want to be competitive as soon as possible and therefore millions will pay for VC.
The pay to win model is a shady practice that almost every game except 2k stays away from.


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[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

There’s a reason why 2k gives more attention, development time, and features to MyCareer and MyTeam.
It’s because they’ve not yet found a way to get users to spend actual money on the other modes.
Let’s say that in PNO or Franchise/MyLeague you had to pay each player in VC to be able to use them. If you want to play with the Warriors full team, you’d have to pay the players, especially the good ones lots of VC in order to use them. Example, Steph would cost 500 VC, Klay, Draymond, and Russell 400 VC a piece, and role players 200 VC a piece for every game you play. You can earn 1,000 VC per win plus 200 to 400 for in game performance.
There’s really no way to use the real team unless, 1. you buy VC, or 2. you grind out VC using weak teams until you have the VC to purchase the full squad.
This is the pay to win model that 2k uses in MyCareer and MyTeam. You want to be the best, pay to be the best or grind for months so that you can be decent. Then add in boosts, Gatorade, clothes, and shoes.
Now in PNO and Franchise/MyTeam you can get the players if you pay the VC, but if you want them to be wearing their signature shoes, sleeves, handbands, what have you, you have to buy those things with more VC. If you want them to have stamina and boosts you can buy those as well. And you better, because in order to be competitive, you’ll have to because those that don’t mind paying real money will have them.
I hope that 2k takes my example and puts it in the game so that all people can experience the shady pay to win practices in their favorite game mode.
You start out as a 60 Overall in MyCareer and it costs 200 thousand VC to get to an 85. Someone please show me a first round draft pick in 2k that’s a 60 Overall, I don’t believe you’ll be able to.
You’re intentionally a 60 Overall in order to incentivize you to buy VC to upgrade to 85 Overall so that you can be competitive. Can you grind it out and eventually become an 85 overall, sure, if you want to spend months just to become competitive. 2k knows that most people want to be competitive as soon as possible and therefore millions will pay for VC.
The pay to win model is a shady practice that almost every game except 2k stays away from.


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How you going to wish the VC model on the PNO and MyLeague/MyGM modes? PNO uses existing teams for quick matches while MyLeague/MyGM are mostly offline modes. These two modes are probably the "least" popular modes by a landslide when compared to the MyPlayer mode. As a result, PNO is basically a farming method for VC. I don't play MyLeague/MyGM, so I don't know if they're rewarded for VC for doing certain tasks.

Inherently speaking, the only way that you could try apply the VC model to those modes is if you cap the how often you can play those modes within a certain timeframe. If that were to happen, then there would be riots in the street. At the point, you took my freedom of choice to play a mode of my liking while indirectly forcing me to play other modes to get my basketball fix in.

[mb625]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

How you going to wish the VC model on the PNO and MyLeague/MyGM modes? PNO uses existing teams for quick matches while MyLeague/MyGM are mostly offline modes. These two modes are probably the "least" popular modes by a landslide when compared to the MyPlayer mode. As a result, PNO is basically a farming method for VC. I don't play MyLeague/MyGM, so I don't know if they're rewarded for VC for doing certain tasks.



Inherently speaking, the only way that you could try apply the VC model to those modes is if you cap the how often you can play those modes within a certain timeframe. If that were to happen, then there would be riots in the street. At the point, you took my freedom of choice to play a mode of my liking while indirectly forcing me to play other modes to get my basketball fix in.

While we're on this topic... Can I just point out that there are plenty of free-to-play modes available that are used by a miniscule percentage of the community? Everyone is flocking to the modes where you can use money and are using money to get ahead of the competition, when they could easily enjoy and play the game without anything more than the regular $60 price of admission. No one is forcing the community to play these other modes and yet they flock to them... No wonder 2k spends tons of time and resources on them.

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[awg811]

Angryjoe's 2k take.

How you going to wish the VC model on the PNO and MyLeague/MyGM modes? PNO uses existing teams for quick matches while MyLeague/MyGM are mostly offline modes. These two modes are probably the "least" popular modes by a landslide when compared to the MyPlayer mode. As a result, PNO is basically a farming method for VC. I don't play MyLeague/MyGM, so I don't know if they're rewarded for VC for doing certain tasks.



Inherently speaking, the only way that you could try apply the VC model to those modes is if you cap the how often you can play those modes within a certain timeframe. If that were to happen, then there would be riots in the street. At the point, you took my freedom of choice to play a mode of my liking while indirectly forcing me to play other modes to get my basketball fix in.

And that’s the issue.
I really don’t want to hamper anyone’s favorite mode. I just want those that don’t play modes that are pay to win to get an idea of why it’s so bad, instead of pretending that there’s no issue.
2k could go the route of nearly every other game and keep in game purchases to things that don’t give an advantage for paying. Clothes, shoes, and accessories are fine to spend VC on, but paying to get an advantage is a shady practice.
Let’s take boosts for example. Boosts are in essence, steroids, a band substance in any sport. Yet, in 2k, if you don’t buy them you are at a disadvantage. I can’t even believe that the NBA allows this in a video game with their name on it, but fines and suspends players for using them in the NBA.


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[Kid OS]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

Then rate NBA 2K "T" and call it a night...

That's where the issue arises. Based on gambling ages by state, the game would need to be rated M. Pretty sure you can't gamble until you're 18 in all states (playing lotto), and if it were to be considered casino style gambling, the age would raise to 21 in most states.

With the current rating systems we have in place, 2K should be rated M... which is a sad thought considering it is a NBA Basketball video game. This is why people are so upset at the gambling aspects of the game. Yeah, we all know that the implementation of VC is terrible and scummy, but the currency itself isn't an issue. The issue is what people are allowed to do with the VC, and the fact that the VC only has a monetary value when it is bought, and while it is treated as a currency, it cannot be resold by the buyer, unlike all other forms of currency. That's kinda messed up.

[Kid OS]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

While we're on this topic... Can I just point out that there are plenty of free-to-play modes available that are used by a miniscule percentage of the community? Everyone is flocking to the modes where you can use money and are using money to get ahead of the competition, when they could easily enjoy and play the game without anything more than the regular $60 price of admission. No one is forcing the community to play these other modes and yet they flock to them... No wonder 2k spends tons of time and resources on them.

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That's not the point tho. It's like going to a salon that doubles as you know what. When the cops show up, saying that, "We offer tons of services that don't break the law" isn't going to be a good arguement. Take Two has unfortunately dipped into the realm of possible illegality and may or may not suffer the consequences.

Trust us, we all know that you don't have to spend a dime over $60 in order to get your money's worth with this game. That doesn't change the gravity of the situation though.

[olajuwon34]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

The game costs exponentially more to make than it did 10 years ago and the price for the base game is still the same, despite the fact $60 in 2009 is worth $71 today. Over the last ten years they added more staff, more unlicensed retired players, more online infrastructure, invested more in more advertising.... and the base price for the game is locked at $60.

And the naïveté to tell a publicly traded company how much revenue should be “enough” for them is so far outside the realm of reality I don’t know where to begin. This is kindergarten logic.

MyTeam is 99% the reason we still have classic teams in the game 7 years after the gimmick peaked. They add those players to the base game anyway and we never have to play MyTeam to access 99% of them.

My reply was to someone talking about the NECESSITY of having those mechanics in the game, not simply a company trying to make money, of course certain companies are going to try and make as much as they can and get away with whatever they can to do it, my argument is they make enough off of retail sales of the game to still be successful in making NBA 2k as a series, they dont need to have excessive microtransactions in the game to have classic teams and pay for more staff, just do the simple math, they sold 9 million copies of nba 2k19, multiply that by 60$(cheapest version of the game) even with that being taxed, thats still well enough to make the game without excessive microtransactions and a pay to win model.


They need more than 5 hundred million dollars to pay for rights to players and more staff, and notoriously bad servers? Yes their gonna try to make as much money as possible, but dont give the excuse that they NEED excessive microtransactions and a shady business model for the sake of the games well being and the possibility for the games creation.

[zrohman]

Re: Angryjoe's 2k take.

So y'all buying the game or naw?

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Bro enough. You can still buy the game and be pissed off that half the modes are locked down and pay to win. And you can be pissed off that they are pushing addictive elements of gambling on kids.

When you pull that slot machine and have a chance to win 100 vc or 1,000. And you win 100. You will feel a big let down. As if you lost something, the chance at 1,000 vc.

You win. You will go crazy.

Even if you don't lose something it is simulated gambling. As it simulates the same feelings of losing or winning in us

All we want is a great basketball game. 2k plays such good basketball...

What if we could play my team, on equal grounds, no vc, and just play, buy, and trade?

What if they made my career easier to grind, with no vc?

No boosts. Just cosmetics.

I could play and enjoy my team. I could go to the park and enjoy it. 2k would be the greatest and deepest basketball game in history.

Instead, I'm tearing my hair out on my team playing 5 99 rated players with my average squad. So I don't play my team. I don't play in the park.

I can only enjoy half a basketball game. It's great enough for me to purchase. So I can enjoy online head to head, so I can enjoy franchise, etc.

We can be pissed off about half of the game essentially being destroyed, and still buy it for the other half

We can still have outrage about micro transactions. We can have outrage that kids are being trained to be addicted and spend money in games that already cost $60.

Doesn't mean we can't enjoy parts of the game, appreciate the game, and still be pissed.

If we had 4 great NBA games it would be a different story. But we don't have options. Live 20 probably isn't even coming out. So we have to enjoy and appreciate what we like. And contest what we dislike.

Don't act like you don't complain about things you dislike about 2k... We all know you're going to complain about something at some point. I guess we could all troll you then and say "you gonna buy the game".... I guess anyone who buys the game can't voice concerns???

2k could be legendary. But many of us will forever remember it as the game with realistic basketball, great gameplay, great graphics, and pay to win cheese that essentially locks down half the game modes, by that I mean, unless you're a user who has 20,000 hours to spare, you will get lucky to be a 70 rating.

To improve your player you will have to spin a wheel every day, play a slot machine, get on a 2k app you care nothing about, and pay 10 games Just to get a crumble of half an attribute point worth of vc.

30 minutes extra per day spinning wheel and playing an app you care nothing for, playing mindless hours, just to still be the rating of a role player by the end of the year. That's the life of a casual player in this game. It's a shame. Because 2k could be so great.

I'll still buy and play some other modes. Maybe I'll buy vc because I have to in order to enjoy half this game. But it's a shame. I can still be pissed about those facts, and still enjoy parts of the game and still own it