CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

[spankdatazz22]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

I don't know- I think VC has had two years now of being so vastly superior in terms of presentation to EA's products, that they could have easily afforded to use that time to get things right on the field and on the court.

I have to disagree with that (no surprise huh). I agree that VC is far ahead in terms of presentation, but I think they're so far ahead that many hardcore gamers (particularly people that favor the EA games) and reviewers disregard it as an advantage. Or at least as much of an advantage as it should be. How many times to you see people say "I only care about graphics and gameplay". And now the argument has changed to I only care about gameplay and franchise.

I think NBA2k4 was an abomination. They tried to co-opt NBA Live to make the game more popular (I guess) which was a huge mistake. I think now, this year with their products, they seem to be making the games they want to. All of their games have improved considerably across the board. I don't look at this as a one-year deal, where they needed to do everything this year. It surprises me that Live is given credit for steadily improving, but ESPN is faulted for not being "where it should be". I understand this is a QC issue; more time needs to be devoted to that. But I'd rather have this year's game than a fixed version of last year's stiff game. VC seems to have thrown the kitchen sink into each of their games in terms of features this year; you would think that next year they can afford to refine those features. It remains to be seen that if they take that route, if they will be praised for trying to refine their games or chastised for not continually pushing the envelope.

And while the argument could be made that there's no need for the Crib (or whatever else you consider fluff), in today's age you need things like that to sell games. I don't see the Crib as being some huge resource drain. I hated the idea when it was announced, but in execution it's actually pretty good. In today's age, extras are what's needed to sell and get people's attention. Mortal Kombat Special Edition, $59.95. Madden Collector's Edition $59.95. Same for Halo. (the regular versions of those games have tons of extra modes/options) People buy dvds and look to see what the extras are. Would NBA Live be as attractive w/o ASW? I like VC's mantra w/NBA2k5, No Fluff. But sometimes you need a hook to get the casual gamers involved. Just the way of the world we live in now.

[spankdatazz22]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

I don't know- I think VC has had two years now of being so vastly superior in terms of presentation to EA's products, that they could have easily afforded to use that time to get things right on the field and on the court.

I have to disagree with that (no surprise huh). I agree that VC is far ahead in terms of presentation, but I think they're so far ahead that many hardcore gamers (particularly people that favor the EA games) and reviewers disregard it as an advantage. Or at least as much of an advantage as it should be. How many times to you see people say "I only care about graphics and gameplay". And now the argument has changed to I only care about gameplay and franchise.

I think NBA2k4 was an abomination. They tried to co-opt NBA Live to make the game more popular (I guess) which was a huge mistake. I think now, this year with their products, they seem to be making the games they want to. All of their games have improved considerably across the board. I don't look at this as a one-year deal, where they needed to do everything this year. It surprises me that Live is given credit for steadily improving, but ESPN is faulted for not being "where it should be". I understand this is a QC issue; more time needs to be devoted to that. But I'd rather have this year's game than a fixed version of last year's stiff game. VC seems to have thrown the kitchen sink into each of their games in terms of features this year; you would think that next year they can afford to refine those features. It remains to be seen that if they take that route, if they will be praised for trying to refine their games or chastised for not continually pushing the envelope.

And while the argument could be made that there's no need for the Crib (or whatever else you consider fluff), in today's age you need things like that to sell games. I don't see the Crib as being some huge resource drain. I hated the idea when it was announced, but in execution it's actually pretty good. In today's age, extras are what's needed to sell and get people's attention. Mortal Kombat Special Edition, $59.95. Madden Collector's Edition $59.95. Same for Halo. (the regular versions of those games have tons of extra modes/options) People buy dvds and look to see what the extras are. Would NBA Live be as attractive w/o ASW? I like VC's mantra w/NBA2k5, No Fluff. But sometimes you need a hook to get the casual gamers involved. Just the way of the world we live in now.

[quietcool72]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

I have to disagree with that (no surprise huh). I agree that VC is far ahead in terms of presentation, but I think they're so far ahead that many hardcore gamers (particularly people that favor the EA games) and reviewers disregard it as an advantage. Or at least as much of an advantage as it should be. How many times to you see people say "I only care about graphics and gameplay". And now the argument has changed to I only care about gameplay and franchise.

I think NBA2k4 was an abomination. They tried to co-opt NBA Live to make the game more popular (I guess) which was a huge mistake. I think now, this year with their products, they seem to be making the games they want to. All of their games have improved considerably across the board. I don't look at this as a one-year deal, where they needed to do everything this year. It surprises me that Live is given credit for steadily improving, but ESPN is faulted for not being "where it should be". I understand this is a QC issue; more time needs to be devoted to that. But I'd rather have this year's game than a fixed version of last year's stiff game. VC seems to have thrown the kitchen sink into each of their games in terms of features this year; you would think that next year they can afford to refine those features. It remains to be seen that if they take that route, if they will be praised for trying to refine their games or chastised for not continually pushing the envelope.

And while the argument could be made that there's no need for the Crib (or whatever else you consider fluff), in today's age you need things like that to sell games. I don't see the Crib as being some huge resource drain. I hated the idea when it was announced, but in execution it's actually pretty good. In today's age, extras are what's needed to sell and get people's attention. Mortal Kombat Special Edition, $59.95. Madden Collector's Edition $59.95. Same for Halo. (the regular versions of those games have tons of extra modes/options) People buy dvds and look to see what the extras are. Would NBA Live be as attractive w/o ASW? I like VC's mantra w/NBA2k5, No Fluff. But sometimes you need a hook to get the casual gamers involved. Just the way of the world we live in now.

I think the mantra of "Better Graphics Or Else" was specifically aimed by gamers at the Madden series. I mean, who can blame anyone who has grown tired of the Madden 2001 engine with minimal makeup tossed on it for FIVE years now.

I think even the biggest Madden supporter has to concede that EA has done a little too much milking out of the Madden 2001 engine and the Madden 2002 commentary. So I think that there is a specific graphics complaint about one EA product series. That does not mean that it should be inferred that nearly every sports gamer is willing to say "GRAPHICS BEFORE ALL ELSE! EVEN BEFORE BUGS!"

If that's the message VC got from the Madden complaints, then they are -in my opinion- making a huge mistake.

Regardless, I know we have gotten way off topic-
The question remains- what IS the status of the potential TO patch?

I mean, I see JUST how far down the cracks that post at the ESPN boards has fallen.

(I just bumped it.)

[quietcool72]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

I have to disagree with that (no surprise huh). I agree that VC is far ahead in terms of presentation, but I think they're so far ahead that many hardcore gamers (particularly people that favor the EA games) and reviewers disregard it as an advantage. Or at least as much of an advantage as it should be. How many times to you see people say "I only care about graphics and gameplay". And now the argument has changed to I only care about gameplay and franchise.

I think NBA2k4 was an abomination. They tried to co-opt NBA Live to make the game more popular (I guess) which was a huge mistake. I think now, this year with their products, they seem to be making the games they want to. All of their games have improved considerably across the board. I don't look at this as a one-year deal, where they needed to do everything this year. It surprises me that Live is given credit for steadily improving, but ESPN is faulted for not being "where it should be". I understand this is a QC issue; more time needs to be devoted to that. But I'd rather have this year's game than a fixed version of last year's stiff game. VC seems to have thrown the kitchen sink into each of their games in terms of features this year; you would think that next year they can afford to refine those features. It remains to be seen that if they take that route, if they will be praised for trying to refine their games or chastised for not continually pushing the envelope.

And while the argument could be made that there's no need for the Crib (or whatever else you consider fluff), in today's age you need things like that to sell games. I don't see the Crib as being some huge resource drain. I hated the idea when it was announced, but in execution it's actually pretty good. In today's age, extras are what's needed to sell and get people's attention. Mortal Kombat Special Edition, $59.95. Madden Collector's Edition $59.95. Same for Halo. (the regular versions of those games have tons of extra modes/options) People buy dvds and look to see what the extras are. Would NBA Live be as attractive w/o ASW? I like VC's mantra w/NBA2k5, No Fluff. But sometimes you need a hook to get the casual gamers involved. Just the way of the world we live in now.

I think the mantra of "Better Graphics Or Else" was specifically aimed by gamers at the Madden series. I mean, who can blame anyone who has grown tired of the Madden 2001 engine with minimal makeup tossed on it for FIVE years now.

I think even the biggest Madden supporter has to concede that EA has done a little too much milking out of the Madden 2001 engine and the Madden 2002 commentary. So I think that there is a specific graphics complaint about one EA product series. That does not mean that it should be inferred that nearly every sports gamer is willing to say "GRAPHICS BEFORE ALL ELSE! EVEN BEFORE BUGS!"

If that's the message VC got from the Madden complaints, then they are -in my opinion- making a huge mistake.

Regardless, I know we have gotten way off topic-
The question remains- what IS the status of the potential TO patch?

I mean, I see JUST how far down the cracks that post at the ESPN boards has fallen.

(I just bumped it.)

[Walker8]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

So any news on a patch yet? Or was this just hopeful thinking.

[Walker8]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

So any news on a patch yet? Or was this just hopeful thinking.

[GAMEC0CK2002]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

Seems to me that VC can go at least 3 years without touching it's graphics or presentation and still be better than anything EA sports can put out. That being said, Sega just needs to make sure their titles have minimal bugs and comes out polished. I'm sure they could have gotten a ton of people willing to test out NFL and NBA 2k5 to find the major gameplay flaws that somehow slipped past their QA.

Sometimes I get the feeling that some of those flaws they know about, and just say screw it...they'll buy the game anyway. Which we usually do...

[GAMEC0CK2002]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

Seems to me that VC can go at least 3 years without touching it's graphics or presentation and still be better than anything EA sports can put out. That being said, Sega just needs to make sure their titles have minimal bugs and comes out polished. I'm sure they could have gotten a ton of people willing to test out NFL and NBA 2k5 to find the major gameplay flaws that somehow slipped past their QA.

Sometimes I get the feeling that some of those flaws they know about, and just say screw it...they'll buy the game anyway. Which we usually do...

[Auggie Blatz]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

Seems to me that VC can go at least 3 years without touching it's graphics or presentation and still be better than anything EA sports can put out. That being said, Sega just needs to make sure their titles have minimal bugs and comes out polished. I'm sure they could have gotten a ton of people willing to test out NFL and NBA 2k5 to find the major gameplay flaws that somehow slipped past their QA.

Sometimes I get the feeling that some of those flaws they know about, and just say screw it...they'll buy the game anyway. Which we usually do...

That is exactly the reasoning. There will be more people who will buy this game and totally overlook this bug and any of the other issues than the hardcore basketball fan. Bottom line is sales. They had to make deadline, so if the game didn't crash, there were gonna ship it anyways. There will be more people who will buy this game at $20 than those who won't due to a bad review and a few glitches (albeit, this TO issue is large).

[Auggie Blatz]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

Seems to me that VC can go at least 3 years without touching it's graphics or presentation and still be better than anything EA sports can put out. That being said, Sega just needs to make sure their titles have minimal bugs and comes out polished. I'm sure they could have gotten a ton of people willing to test out NFL and NBA 2k5 to find the major gameplay flaws that somehow slipped past their QA.

Sometimes I get the feeling that some of those flaws they know about, and just say screw it...they'll buy the game anyway. Which we usually do...

That is exactly the reasoning. There will be more people who will buy this game and totally overlook this bug and any of the other issues than the hardcore basketball fan. Bottom line is sales. They had to make deadline, so if the game didn't crash, there were gonna ship it anyways. There will be more people who will buy this game at $20 than those who won't due to a bad review and a few glitches (albeit, this TO issue is large).

[jayjackson]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

I think the mantra of "Better Graphics Or Else" was specifically aimed by gamers at the Madden series. I mean, who can blame anyone who has grown tired of the Madden 2001 engine with minimal makeup tossed on it for FIVE years now.

I think even the biggest Madden supporter has to concede that EA has done a little too much milking out of the Madden 2001 engine and the Madden 2002 commentary. So I think that there is a specific graphics complaint about one EA product series. That does not mean that it should be inferred that nearly every sports gamer is willing to say "GRAPHICS BEFORE ALL ELSE! EVEN BEFORE BUGS!"

If that's the message VC got from the Madden complaints, then they are -in my opinion- making a huge mistake.

Regardless, I know we have gotten way off topic-
The question remains- what IS the status of the potential TO patch?

I mean, I see JUST how far down the cracks that post at the ESPN boards has fallen.

(I just bumped it.)

Madden's graphics are fine. It's football, not a beauty pageant. The players look like football players, and function just fine.

Not to be an EA lover, even though I've played their games forever, but I purchased NFL 2K5 this year, and NBA as well. Also bought ESPN Baseball.

I'd much rather have what was changed in Madden's franchise mode this year than "The Crib". I'm also glad that I can have a clipping penalty in Madden and not have it so I can't use "The Crib". I mean, you're selling a FOOTBALL game - you aren't selling "The Crib". Most sports gamers play sports games for two reasons - to either have fun with their friends, or online - or to play some kind of franchise/dynasty/career simulation with great stats. I'm sure we'd all attest to that. I'm sure no one ran out and bought NFL 2K5 because it had "The Crib". I know I didn't, and I'm sure you didn't either. I guarantee that almost every gamer on this site, and I dare say the country, would have rather had that clipping bug in NFL not there, than to have had The Crib at all. Because if you wanted one, you couldn't have both because of the ******** "Oh, gotta play with default penalty levels to gain crib points" rule.

OK, so we have to play with default penalty levels - SO MAKE SURE THEY WORK. I shouldn't run a 75 yard run, and have my RB lose 90 yards on his stats. That's simply ridiculous and the PROGRAMMING FOR THIS IS NOT HARD. I'm sure if there are any programmers on this forum, they'd tell you it'd be simple. All you need is a routine that grabs the yardage value, checks to see if there is a penalty, and if there isn't - then it adds the yardage to the stats. If there is a penalty - the value is thrown out and no stats are modified. Probably could be written in BASIC to where it would work.

What these software companies need to do is hire the main slider guru's from these forums. Obviously we do an amazing job finding bugs, and making sliders that everyone usually claims "saves their games".

In a nutshell - we as consumers just keep buying the game, so they keep just adding fluff because they think we like it. I mean, who here REALLY can't do without 24/7. They probably take more time in those damn street courts than they do focusing on how real basketball should be played. So in essence, the minigame is nearly perfect, while the REAL NBA game we purchased has obvious flaws. I think this is why the bug causes such an uproar, because it's obvious - and it's major. The game isn't well enough done for the computer to use smart AI and CALL A TIMEOUT, but good Lord, we've got 24/7 mode!

I dunno why I posted this rant, mainly because I'm sick of people sticking up for the software companies who continue to force-feed us crap because WE CONTINUE TO BUY IT. Why would they make a concerted effort to get better when they know you'll buy it, then bitch about it, but still buy it the next year. Write the game companies, tell them to quit putting bull**** in games, and sending them out untested - and tell them you WON'T BUY if they don't.

Hit em where it hurts - in the wallet. That's the only way any of you are ever going to get your point across to anyone except yourselves. Look at this - 33 pages of threads, and many of them are you people bitching at each other. "Oh, Sega's right - Oh NO - WE'RE RIGHT."

Well guess what - we're ALL WRONG. And EA & Sega & VC, etc, etc. You know what they are?

Filthy rich.

[jayjackson]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

I think the mantra of "Better Graphics Or Else" was specifically aimed by gamers at the Madden series. I mean, who can blame anyone who has grown tired of the Madden 2001 engine with minimal makeup tossed on it for FIVE years now.

I think even the biggest Madden supporter has to concede that EA has done a little too much milking out of the Madden 2001 engine and the Madden 2002 commentary. So I think that there is a specific graphics complaint about one EA product series. That does not mean that it should be inferred that nearly every sports gamer is willing to say "GRAPHICS BEFORE ALL ELSE! EVEN BEFORE BUGS!"

If that's the message VC got from the Madden complaints, then they are -in my opinion- making a huge mistake.

Regardless, I know we have gotten way off topic-
The question remains- what IS the status of the potential TO patch?

I mean, I see JUST how far down the cracks that post at the ESPN boards has fallen.

(I just bumped it.)

Madden's graphics are fine. It's football, not a beauty pageant. The players look like football players, and function just fine.

Not to be an EA lover, even though I've played their games forever, but I purchased NFL 2K5 this year, and NBA as well. Also bought ESPN Baseball.

I'd much rather have what was changed in Madden's franchise mode this year than "The Crib". I'm also glad that I can have a clipping penalty in Madden and not have it so I can't use "The Crib". I mean, you're selling a FOOTBALL game - you aren't selling "The Crib". Most sports gamers play sports games for two reasons - to either have fun with their friends, or online - or to play some kind of franchise/dynasty/career simulation with great stats. I'm sure we'd all attest to that. I'm sure no one ran out and bought NFL 2K5 because it had "The Crib". I know I didn't, and I'm sure you didn't either. I guarantee that almost every gamer on this site, and I dare say the country, would have rather had that clipping bug in NFL not there, than to have had The Crib at all. Because if you wanted one, you couldn't have both because of the ******** "Oh, gotta play with default penalty levels to gain crib points" rule.

OK, so we have to play with default penalty levels - SO MAKE SURE THEY WORK. I shouldn't run a 75 yard run, and have my RB lose 90 yards on his stats. That's simply ridiculous and the PROGRAMMING FOR THIS IS NOT HARD. I'm sure if there are any programmers on this forum, they'd tell you it'd be simple. All you need is a routine that grabs the yardage value, checks to see if there is a penalty, and if there isn't - then it adds the yardage to the stats. If there is a penalty - the value is thrown out and no stats are modified. Probably could be written in BASIC to where it would work.

What these software companies need to do is hire the main slider guru's from these forums. Obviously we do an amazing job finding bugs, and making sliders that everyone usually claims "saves their games".

In a nutshell - we as consumers just keep buying the game, so they keep just adding fluff because they think we like it. I mean, who here REALLY can't do without 24/7. They probably take more time in those damn street courts than they do focusing on how real basketball should be played. So in essence, the minigame is nearly perfect, while the REAL NBA game we purchased has obvious flaws. I think this is why the bug causes such an uproar, because it's obvious - and it's major. The game isn't well enough done for the computer to use smart AI and CALL A TIMEOUT, but good Lord, we've got 24/7 mode!

I dunno why I posted this rant, mainly because I'm sick of people sticking up for the software companies who continue to force-feed us crap because WE CONTINUE TO BUY IT. Why would they make a concerted effort to get better when they know you'll buy it, then bitch about it, but still buy it the next year. Write the game companies, tell them to quit putting bull**** in games, and sending them out untested - and tell them you WON'T BUY if they don't.

Hit em where it hurts - in the wallet. That's the only way any of you are ever going to get your point across to anyone except yourselves. Look at this - 33 pages of threads, and many of them are you people bitching at each other. "Oh, Sega's right - Oh NO - WE'RE RIGHT."

Well guess what - we're ALL WRONG. And EA & Sega & VC, etc, etc. You know what they are?

Filthy rich.

[Court_vision]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

[QUOTE=jayjackson]

In a nutshell - we as consumers just keep buying the game, so they keep just adding fluff because they think we like it. I mean, who here REALLY can't do without 24/7. They probably take more time in those damn street courts than they do focusing on how real basketball should be played. So in essence, the minigame is nearly perfect, while the REAL NBA game we purchased has obvious flaws. I think this is why the bug causes such an uproar, because it's obvious - and it's major. The game isn't well enough done for the computer to use smart AI and CALL A TIMEOUT, but good Lord, we've got 24/7 mode!
QUOTE]



****Claps****

[Court_vision]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

[QUOTE=jayjackson]

In a nutshell - we as consumers just keep buying the game, so they keep just adding fluff because they think we like it. I mean, who here REALLY can't do without 24/7. They probably take more time in those damn street courts than they do focusing on how real basketball should be played. So in essence, the minigame is nearly perfect, while the REAL NBA game we purchased has obvious flaws. I think this is why the bug causes such an uproar, because it's obvious - and it's major. The game isn't well enough done for the computer to use smart AI and CALL A TIMEOUT, but good Lord, we've got 24/7 mode!
QUOTE]



****Claps****

[kaydigi]

Re: CPU Timeout problem, reason inside

I'd much rather have what was changed in Madden's franchise mode this year than "The Crib". I'm also glad that I can have a clipping penalty in Madden and not have it so I can't use "The Crib".
Filthy rich.

They don't call Passing Interference in this years madden. I've played 80 games with th elsider maxed out, no dice.