What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

[Bigg Cee]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

Please add Finish the Fight Submissions for all the knockdown scenarios.

or make it when you have any body part that is all red or flashing red, to make all subs go to a flash sub with 2 gates.

This way this will bring the fear into subs when your rocked, just like in real life.

[TheSouthpaw]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

It's importnat to NOT have a single leg against the cage clinch position, though.

Fighters go for singles against the cage all the time. You don't want the option to be able to shoot in for a single and then drive the opponent into the cage and finish the TD from there. Or the ability to switch from a double to a single or from a single to a double on the cage. I really hope both postions make in the game because they are both common positions irl.


Just curious why you don't want single leg cage in the game.

[Trillz]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

Fighters go for singles against the cage all the time. You don't want the option to be able to shoot in for a single and then drive the opponent into the cage and finish the TD from there. Or the ability to switch from a double to a single or from a single to a double on the cage. I really hope both postions make in the game because they are both common positions irl.


Just curious why you don't want single leg cage in the game.

SINGLE against the cage

[Phenomenal01]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

IMO the submission game needs to be transition based, which opens up a lot of positions.

I know there are high lv guys who can on occasion throw up a triangle or arm bar virtually out of no where from their guard all in one motion.

However in reality, this is typically a 4+ step process, that includes hand fighting, holding positions, peppering, occasionally switching to another submission, and eventually, actually attempting the submission.

Examples

From guard you go to rubber guard, then you pull the other leg over so that the foot you're securing rubber with rests under the knee and lock in the triangle. You're still not done, you have to push the arm across the chest, and pull down on the head, now you're attempting a triangle.

If the opponent panics and tries to escape in 1 move rather than knowing how to escape the position(s), he typically leaves his arm(s) exposed to be trapped for an arm bar. And even then fighters often escape from high lv jujitsu fighters simply by pulling out with force rather than technique.

There's also the chance you get slammed attempting submissions like this before they're secured and even when they're secured, with a greater chance of success if it is fully secured, but still the real possibility you get dumped on your head or even KO'd which has happened multiple times in the sport.

It shouldn't be a magical 1 button press attempt from any given position without any real visual indications of how to stop it without guessing or learning the opponent. Arm bar attempts from guard look exactly like Get ups which make it easier, but a lot of positions aren't so easy and the visual indications aren't enough with grapple advantages, perks, and high lv submissions and sub stats to properly time and block attempts most of the time.

Fighters end up spamming submissions at will with little to no stamina tax until the succeed, often relying on 4-5 attempts, or frustration escapes that get blocked and lowed your stamina making it more likely you'll get subbed.

The only fighters you tend to see using this type of technique are new fighters with low lv jujitsu game. They typically don't succeed and just attempt a bunch of subs dumping their own stamina and ending up in worse positions with no real advantage for attempting and failing them. This game doesn't reflect that and enables any player to spam subs.

I understand its difficult to replicate MMA because in real MMA anyone can decide to do anything at any given moment and its hard to truly reflect that at any given moment.

There needs to be a single/double on the cage where the fighter attempting sits in that position, elbows from the top fighter, as well as normal peppering shots and the ability to get it back to over under in the least.

And as I started talking about to begin with, every position of every submission, should be a position, long before its a submission attempt. You guys just sum all of this up with a stupid mini game that makes no sense practically when it comes to defending submissions.

When someone has you in a guillotine, you defend by passing to the opposite side as the arm they attempt with, so you go to their left side control if they're attempting with their right arm. This is a transition that you need to understand, if you're in their full guard, you're at risk because they can leverage better and you can't escape, if you pass or land on their right they can leverage better.

How in any way is this reflected in a mini game? It'd be a better option to make it more transition based, knowledge based, have tutorials explaining each and every submission position, where to go and where not to go to defend, a system that enable offensive fighters to control positions but need to pepper fighters and force them to make mistakes in order to finish.

Body triangle (Various positions)

This is a dangerous position to end up in and is utilized far more often in UFC today than saddle/crucifix. It can be a attained and held in various positions and is hard to get out, it wears on the opponent making it harder to regain stamina and is constant threat to peppering shots, and eventually a submission attempt. Flattened out with full body triangle is usually the end of a fight and is very hard to escape because now the fighter can throw bombs while maintaining the position and still threaten submissions at any time.

That being said, its not 2-3 strikes fight over like your game, fighters survive entire rounds in this position but they get beat up and worn down and usually eventually TKO'd or submitted.

Another good point to make is real MMA fighters don't attempt multiple chokes because it burns out the arms, makes it harder to strike and even harder to finish a future choke attempt. Then secure position, pepper, look to get the arm under the chin, then go for it. If they fail, you don't see them attempting another choke typically for a round or two because they know they don't want to burn out the arms, and if they attempt another they want a good chance at success.

Its not about spamming it until it magically works because you won a mini guessing game.

There needs to be more positions where a fighter is losing and getting peppered, but not in any real danger if he continues to defend the submission, which should be easy enough to do. And positions like full mount, and as you have it, side control and half guard postured need to be 1-2 big strikes and done. Same goes for the clinch. 99% of clinch strikes end with a break on the strike regardless of if the strike lands, is blocked, or evaded.

No one gets controlled fully in the clinch unless they're simply getting layed on and peppered which wins judges over but rarely puts anyone in any sort of real danger unless we're talking about heavyweights throwing bombs on the break and re securing position.

And you don't see fighters getting mounted over and over. It should be much harder to attain, much easier to defend, or escape, scramble, and get back to the feet. Again, you don't see guys secure this position and end the fight at will, they secure position, they pepper, maintain dominant position, and grind and wear their opponents down. Its a grueling process not an easy feat that results in a instant/dominant KO at will.

I'm not even a white belt in jujistu but I have watched MMA since UFC 1 as a child and watched pretty much every UFC, Strikeforce, Bellator, PRIDE, and every other major promotion at the time since. This is common knowledge in the sport, common sense.

My stand up fighters have max kick power/speed, and close on punches, mostly lv 4-5 techniques with a few lv 3. Yet I can't get a KO to save my life, I have to rock my opponent, then attempt to finish the fight on the ground where a grappler wants to be.

My jujitsu fighter has mostly 30 on striking stats, and I can still rock people, I still drop them in the clinch with one or a few strikes, I dominate ground positions and grappling exchanges, and reached lv 5 by cheesing everyone with the clinch and full mount and side control / saddle. Granted he can't stand with anyone, but the system allows me to fight and win with him, but with my strikers its closer to 50/50 even against grapplers with decent strikes.

If a submission artist can end fights with ease because he has max submission ratings and high lv subs why is it so much work for me to do the same on the feet without spamming 1/2 cheese. Either grappling/strikes need to be nerfed (They do), or stand up needs to be buffed (It does in certain areas)

1 spinning heal kick lands and it usually ends the fight. In the game, I can land 30 and rock the guy 20 times, drop him 10 times, and he can end the fight with 1 clinch elbow/knee, or get it to the ground and G&P or sub for an instant finish. Its unbalanced, unfair, and not fun.

People complain about spinning spam and I agree but if you're getting hit by 9/10 spinning heel kicks to the face the thing you should be thinking is how to not get hit in the face by that kick.

As dev's you need to be thinking how can we make this so that its a powerful fight ending strike, that is balanced and can't be spammed and abused. My heavyweight for example has 95 power I believe on his kicks, and I'm forced to play defense because of 1/2 spamming, and grappling. Even when I pick apart the legs to drop the hands, land parry counters with heavy kicks, I have my success too, but fighters are eating way more than is realistic.

And maybe its unrealistic that I could throw that many but I shouldn't have to. I don't spam, I pick my strikes, I avg. more significant strikes at a higher percentage in almost every fight. Typically 67% give or take on significant strikes.

Lead roundhouse doesn't seem to do anything its like a jab most of the time. Lead hook kick rarely does anything. All techniques seem to do less the more success you have with them. Probably because of spam control coding that favors techniques that aren't being abused, but if something isn't broke why fix it. If I'm finding my range and timing on leg kicks followed by head kicks, why would I stop using the techniques that I'm finding success with other than because the game won't give me a KO unless I pull out my entire arsenal of strikes, mix up spinning body kicks, throw flashy knees and spin kicks off the cage, all the while rocking the body and legs to drop the hands to make it possible, so that finally, after rocking my opponent 10-15 times, I can get a TKO because KO's only happen when the game randomly decides it so.

UT Mode is basically super CAFs vs lesser CAFs mode where people exploit the easiest and cheesiest way to win possible.

My advice would be get rid of the card system in favor for purchasing the techniques you want. Instead of getting lv 1-5 randomly, start me off with a lv 0 and allow me to level it by putting it to use and finding success with it inside the octagon. Essentially gaining XP for each individual move as its used and as I succeed with it. Make me earn it.

I realize that shines away from the money grab on buying packs to unlock moves but I'm sure you can find another system to integrate that by simply unlocking the lv 0 moves you like.

Another balance would be to make it so that perks don't exceed 15 levels, which is a lv 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. Limit each player in the least to 1 level 5, 1 level 4, and at the most, the rest lv 3, if not what I said originally.

The same concept could be applied to techniques. Having different set balances for each discipline. Again, in the least, limiting the number of level 4 and 5 techniques a fighter can have, limiting the grappling and submissions of a striker to lower level techniques in those areas, having more lv 4 and 5 available in striking. More punches less kicks for boxers, etc.

Stats should also be limited, I shouldn't be able to attain 100 submissions as a striker and they shouldn't be able to attain highest rating strikes or blocking.

[drinklime]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

IMO the submission game needs to be transition based, which opens up a lot of positions.

I know there are high lv guys who can on occasion throw up a triangle or arm bar virtually out of no where from their guard all in one motion.

However in reality, this is typically a 4+ step process, that includes hand fighting, holding positions, peppering, occasionally switching to another submission, and eventually, actually attempting the submission.

Examples

From guard you go to rubber guard, then you pull the other leg over so that the foot you're securing rubber with rests under the knee and lock in the triangle. You're still not done, you have to push the arm across the chest, and pull down on the head, now you're attempting a triangle.

If the opponent panics and tries to escape in 1 move rather than knowing how to escape the position(s), he typically leaves his arm(s) exposed to be trapped for an arm bar. And even then fighters often escape from high lv jujitsu fighters simply by pulling out with force rather than technique.

There's also the chance you get slammed attempting submissions like this before they're secured and even when they're secured, with a greater chance of success if it is fully secured, but still the real possibility you get dumped on your head or even KO'd which has happened multiple times in the sport.

It shouldn't be a magical 1 button press attempt from any given position without any real visual indications of how to stop it without guessing or learning the opponent. Arm bar attempts from guard look exactly like Get ups which make it easier, but a lot of positions aren't so easy and the visual indications aren't enough with grapple advantages, perks, and high lv submissions and sub stats to properly time and block attempts most of the time.

Fighters end up spamming submissions at will with little to no stamina tax until the succeed, often relying on 4-5 attempts, or frustration escapes that get blocked and lowed your stamina making it more likely you'll get subbed.

The only fighters you tend to see using this type of technique are new fighters with low lv jujitsu game. They typically don't succeed and just attempt a bunch of subs dumping their own stamina and ending up in worse positions with no real advantage for attempting and failing them. This game doesn't reflect that and enables any player to spam subs.

I understand its difficult to replicate MMA because in real MMA anyone can decide to do anything at any given moment and its hard to truly reflect that at any given moment.

There needs to be a single/double on the cage where the fighter attempting sits in that position, elbows from the top fighter, as well as normal peppering shots and the ability to get it back to over under in the least.

And as I started talking about to begin with, every position of every submission, should be a position, long before its a submission attempt. You guys just sum all of this up with a stupid mini game that makes no sense practically when it comes to defending submissions.

When someone has you in a guillotine, you defend by passing to the opposite side as the arm they attempt with, so you go to their left side control if they're attempting with their right arm. This is a transition that you need to understand, if you're in their full guard, you're at risk because they can leverage better and you can't escape, if you pass or land on their right they can leverage better.

How in any way is this reflected in a mini game? It'd be a better option to make it more transition based, knowledge based, have tutorials explaining each and every submission position, where to go and where not to go to defend, a system that enable offensive fighters to control positions but need to pepper fighters and force them to make mistakes in order to finish.

Body triangle (Various positions)

This is a dangerous position to end up in and is utilized far more often in UFC today than saddle/crucifix. It can be a attained and held in various positions and is hard to get out, it wears on the opponent making it harder to regain stamina and is constant threat to peppering shots, and eventually a submission attempt. Flattened out with full body triangle is usually the end of a fight and is very hard to escape because now the fighter can throw bombs while maintaining the position and still threaten submissions at any time.

That being said, its not 2-3 strikes fight over like your game, fighters survive entire rounds in this position but they get beat up and worn down and usually eventually TKO'd or submitted.

Another good point to make is real MMA fighters don't attempt multiple chokes because it burns out the arms, makes it harder to strike and even harder to finish a future choke attempt. Then secure position, pepper, look to get the arm under the chin, then go for it. If they fail, you don't see them attempting another choke typically for a round or two because they know they don't want to burn out the arms, and if they attempt another they want a good chance at success.

Its not about spamming it until it magically works because you won a mini guessing game.

There needs to be more positions where a fighter is losing and getting peppered, but not in any real danger if he continues to defend the submission, which should be easy enough to do. And positions like full mount, and as you have it, side control and half guard postured need to be 1-2 big strikes and done. Same goes for the clinch. 99% of clinch strikes end with a break on the strike regardless of if the strike lands, is blocked, or evaded.

No one gets controlled fully in the clinch unless they're simply getting layed on and peppered which wins judges over but rarely puts anyone in any sort of real danger unless we're talking about heavyweights throwing bombs on the break and re securing position.

And you don't see fighters getting mounted over and over. It should be much harder to attain, much easier to defend, or escape, scramble, and get back to the feet. Again, you don't see guys secure this position and end the fight at will, they secure position, they pepper, maintain dominant position, and grind and wear their opponents down. Its a grueling process not an easy feat that results in a instant/dominant KO at will.

I'm not even a white belt in jujistu but I have watched MMA since UFC 1 as a child and watched pretty much every UFC, Strikeforce, Bellator, PRIDE, and every other major promotion at the time since. This is common knowledge in the sport, common sense.

My stand up fighters have max kick power/speed, and close on punches, mostly lv 4-5 techniques with a few lv 3. Yet I can't get a KO to save my life, I have to rock my opponent, then attempt to finish the fight on the ground where a grappler wants to be.

My jujitsu fighter has mostly 30 on striking stats, and I can still rock people, I still drop them in the clinch with one or a few strikes, I dominate ground positions and grappling exchanges, and reached lv 5 by cheesing everyone with the clinch and full mount and side control / saddle. Granted he can't stand with anyone, but the system allows me to fight and win with him, but with my strikers its closer to 50/50 even against grapplers with decent strikes.

If a submission artist can end fights with ease because he has max submission ratings and high lv subs why is it so much work for me to do the same on the feet without spamming 1/2 cheese. Either grappling/strikes need to be nerfed (They do), or stand up needs to be buffed (It does in certain areas)

1 spinning heal kick lands and it usually ends the fight. In the game, I can land 30 and rock the guy 20 times, drop him 10 times, and he can end the fight with 1 clinch elbow/knee, or get it to the ground and G&P or sub for an instant finish. Its unbalanced, unfair, and not fun.

People complain about spinning spam and I agree but if you're getting hit by 9/10 spinning heel kicks to the face the thing you should be thinking is how to not get hit in the face by that kick.

As dev's you need to be thinking how can we make this so that its a powerful fight ending strike, that is balanced and can't be spammed and abused. My heavyweight for example has 95 power I believe on his kicks, and I'm forced to play defense because of 1/2 spamming, and grappling. Even when I pick apart the legs to drop the hands, land parry counters with heavy kicks, I have my success too, but fighters are eating way more than is realistic.

And maybe its unrealistic that I could throw that many but I shouldn't have to. I don't spam, I pick my strikes, I avg. more significant strikes at a higher percentage in almost every fight. Typically 67% give or take on significant strikes.

Lead roundhouse doesn't seem to do anything its like a jab most of the time. Lead hook kick rarely does anything. All techniques seem to do less the more success you have with them. Probably because of spam control coding that favors techniques that aren't being abused, but if something isn't broke why fix it. If I'm finding my range and timing on leg kicks followed by head kicks, why would I stop using the techniques that I'm finding success with other than because the game won't give me a KO unless I pull out my entire arsenal of strikes, mix up spinning body kicks, throw flashy knees and spin kicks off the cage, all the while rocking the body and legs to drop the hands to make it possible, so that finally, after rocking my opponent 10-15 times, I can get a TKO because KO's only happen when the game randomly decides it so.

UT Mode is basically super CAFs vs lesser CAFs mode where people exploit the easiest and cheesiest way to win possible.

My advice would be get rid of the card system in favor for purchasing the techniques you want. Instead of getting lv 1-5 randomly, start me off with a lv 0 and allow me to level it by putting it to use and finding success with it inside the octagon. Essentially gaining XP for each individual move as its used and as I succeed with it. Make me earn it.

I realize that shines away from the money grab on buying packs to unlock moves but I'm sure you can find another system to integrate that by simply unlocking the lv 0 moves you like.

Another balance would be to make it so that perks don't exceed 15 levels, which is a lv 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. Limit each player in the least to 1 level 5, 1 level 4, and at the most, the rest lv 3, if not what I said originally.

The same concept could be applied to techniques. Having different set balances for each discipline. Again, in the least, limiting the number of level 4 and 5 techniques a fighter can have, limiting the grappling and submissions of a striker to lower level techniques in those areas, having more lv 4 and 5 available in striking. More punches less kicks for boxers, etc.

Stats should also be limited, I shouldn't be able to attain 100 submissions as a striker and they shouldn't be able to attain highest rating strikes or blocking.

Exactly. By incorporating these concepts you would have something close to what Fight Night was for boxing. These changes are critical to the gameplay and realism aspects. The combination of both is what allows the game to excel.

[johnmangala]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

Guys like Edgar should feel special, some unique takedown animation variety would be ideal.


This one gif has everything people have been asking for tds against the cage, probe/post, takedown variety (knee picks), etc

[Thetruth9012]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

Please add Finish the Fight Submissions for all the knockdown scenarios.

This is a must , fighters like to sub after they rock them .

example

Rockhold vs Bisping

Wysłane z mojego LG-H525n przy użyciu Tapatalka

[Milano3093]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

I know why GPD is asking this, but isn't it like stupid to focus on grappling right now? I know it isn't fully finished, but I think it is one of the best parts of the game. The stand up, the input lag, lack of animations, fighters' individuality, fully finished and polished ofline modes with character. There are so many things that need more attention than the grappling part.

Guess I was correct when I said that EA has the focus on a lot of wrong aspects. Twice we have seen that the game isn't what it should have been, and still.....

[TheSouthpaw]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

Would be better to explain with pictures

[tissues250]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?



cage interaction takedown to back position from the back clinch.
Look at Royce Gracie's right foot. He using the cage wall. He kick at the cage wall and then success a takedown to back position on the ground. I think, this animation is really good.

[REDDy4war]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

i know this happens a lot but it's to wwe for me.

what? to wwe for you these are way better then that stupid suplex slam. we need more slams in this game period.

[tebowned777]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

Neon belly duh. My favorite position <3.

Double-under pass to side control, KOB, mount, or to a back take. I hit them in BJJ all the time.

Also sprawl to back take. I hit a sloppy one in an MMA match when I was fatigued but I hit those at a high percentage during sparring.






Edit: I ended up subbing him with a RNC 20 seconds or less after that.

[tissues250]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

I don't know whether this is relates grappling position or not. But I think, this is very important part of mma game. So, I'd like to talk about the push animation in this time. The push animation is really unrealistic and very limited in EA UFC2. Let's see attached gif. I don't know how to explain but one step.. one step.. looks very robotic and weird.

In the clinch, both fighters only attempt to tranisition or takedown on the middle octagon, right now. It needs to be revamped.
In contrast, there is a ton of push stuff and it happens way more than only attempt to tranisition or takedown in real life.

I think, the push logic is useless in this game because once one fighter attempt to transition or takedown, the other fighter have to defend it or try to other transition in that time. We needs an efficient logic for the push stuff like Undisputed 3. I think, there are three stuff in the clinch as 1) push, 2) transition, 3) takedown. For example, once one fighter attempt to transition or takedown and other fighter attempt to push at the same time. Which one has priority? I don't know exactly. but I'm sure, we needs an efficient logic about that. Can I push my opponent til the cage wall from the middle octagon? It is close to impossible in EA UFC series. That's bad.





- Let's back to the point about the push animation. Please look at Barnett's legs. He pushed Rothwell with using both legs. The both legs would moving together when you pushing someone. It is very different from EA UFC2.




- In Undisputed 3 and EA MMA, the push animation looks way more realistic than EA UFC series. It's looks pretty good.



Thank you so much!

[RuggedRuffRaw]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

Not actually a grappling position, But I would love to see a devastating Body soccer kick to opponents on the ground. Like in "The Ultimate Fighter" Episode 1.

[Bigg Cee]

Re: What grappling positions are not in EA UFC 2 that you wish were included?

There's some people online who can do this so good.

and yes it looks bad and the post you made was great!