Shopmaster Interview with Ben Haumiller Part 2

[SeaTownGamer]

Quote: Originally Posted by TheBleedingRed21

The biggest thing I’ll take from this: We have the right guy finally leading franchise. Ben is a class act and his passion is something that was sorely needed. This is his first year with franchise so I’m excited to see what he brings. His work speaks for itself and I think as long as he is there, we will see real improvment.

Him being nice doesn’t mean franchise will be better. Lol. I don’t care about him being a class act or not. The big question is can he execute and give us what we want?...The guy can can be a jerk but as long as he makes a helluva franchise I would be happy.


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[briz1046]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

To be honest, Schindler's List came out 25 years ago. I cant recall a similar movie like that people "flocked to see" in probably 10-15 yrs. The numbers speak for themselves. The top video games are ones that are geared towards being fun (in the casual definition). The top movies are too.

Valid point , my point remains though that other media ( movies, tv , written forms) happily offer up more thoughtful content whilst vying for our leisure time , that's no reason video games shouldn't

To bring this back to Madden though I'm pretty sure there was never any discussion regarding introducing RPM where devs considered not doing it in case people felt it woudn't be fun , maybe I'm wrong though?
Likewise, (again I could easily be off the mark here as I've never played it) but my understanding is , in UT , it is readily accepted people will grind through various drills/ challenges to ' level up or earn rewards , but ask them to do , what would be similar activities , in a training situation in CFM wouldn't be fun

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by briz1046

Valid point , my point remains though that other media ( movies, tv , written forms) happily offer up more thoughtful content whilst vying for our leisure time , that's no reason video games shouldn't To bring this back to Madden though I'm pretty sure there was never any discussion regarding introducing RPM where devs considered not doing it in case people felt it woudn't be fun , maybe I'm wrong though? Likewise, (again I could easily be off the mark here as I've never played it) but my understanding is , in UT , it is readily accepted people will grind through various drills/ challenges to ' level up or earn rewards , but ask them to do , what would be similar activities , in a training situation in CFM wouldn't be fun

The reason is money. I'll give you an example from television because thats the industry I work in.

AMC is a network that airs one of the most popular shows "The Walking Dead". Its mindless fun entertainment that isnt centered in any realism or deep drama. Its makes AMC money hand over fist though because its somewhat cheap to produce and they charge a ton for advertising.

AMC also had a show "Halt and Catch Fire" which was an amazing show with a great plot and great acting....that had incredibly ****ty ratings. The show lasted for 4 yrs. How? Because AMC was making so much money with TWD that it could afford to air a great show like Halt and not really hurt its bottom line.

The problem is Madden is TWD in this scenario. Its an extremely popular game that at times lacks realism and feature depth that is trying to appeal to the most people possible. The second problem is that unlike TWD, Madden is the only NFL football game. Any TV network could air a hyper realistic Zombie show (as realistic as a show like that could be) if it wanted too. No one other than EA can create an NFL game.

EA uses the money generated by Madden and FIFA to fund the indy games it releases among other small titles. They cant do anything that could potentially screw up that money. So they arent likely to ever focus solely or primarily on things the sim community wants if those things arent features that casual fans really want too.

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by briz1046

Valid point , my point remains though that other media ( movies, tv , written forms) happily offer up more thoughtful content whilst vying for our leisure time , that's no reason video games shouldn't To bring this back to Madden though I'm pretty sure there was never any discussion regarding introducing RPM where devs considered not doing it in case people felt it woudn't be fun , maybe I'm wrong though? Likewise, (again I could easily be off the mark here as I've never played it) but my understanding is , in UT , it is readily accepted people will grind through various drills/ challenges to ' level up or earn rewards , but ask them to do , what would be similar activities , in a training situation in CFM wouldn't be fun

This exact point has been made repeatedly and still holds true, EA Tib does whatever they want to do and these supposed excuses are illogical reasoning after the fact, imo. For example any claim that what EA has chosen to do with Madden is justified for profit is illogical when other games are making profit, in competitive markets no less, taking different approaches. If I'm not mistaken MUT has been revealed to be the cash cow for EA, so I fail to see how Madden being a better representation of real football would make that mode less fun and lucrative.

I have wondered if "fun" was just a cheaper investment than authenticity and even though there may be something to that, when I see the seeming resources put into stuff like Longshot, I honestly don't know why EA created this divisive strawman of fun and authenticity being at odds in a sports simulation video game.

[kennypowers88]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

The reason is money. I'll give you an example from television because thats the industry I work in. AMC is a network that airs one of the most popular shows "The Walking Dead". Its mindless fun entertainment that isnt centered in any realism or deep drama. Its makes AMC money hand over fist though because its somewhat cheap to produce and they charge a ton for advertising. AMC also had a show "Halt and Catch Fire" which was an amazing show with a great plot and great acting....that had incredibly ****ty ratings. The show lasted for 4 yrs. How? Because AMC was making so much money with TWD that it could afford to air a great show like Halt and not really hurt its bottom line. The problem is Madden is TWD in this scenario. Its an extremely popular game that at times lacks realism and feature depth that is trying to appeal to the most people possible. The second problem is that unlike TWD, Madden is the only NFL football game. Any TV network could air a hyper realistic Zombie show (as realistic as a show like that could be) if it wanted too. No one other than EA can create an NFL game. EA uses the money generated by Madden and FIFA to fund the indy games it releases among other small titles. They cant do anything that could potentially screw up that money. So they arent likely to ever focus solely or primarily on things the sim community wants if those things arent features that casual fans really want too.

This is definitely true, but what frustrates me is knowing how much time was not only spent on casual features, but wasted. If they more efficiently used the development cycle, I think we could have both. Give us all the realism we want, but let the casual players turn it off or make it easier. I mean, I'd be thrilled with this years announcements if they weren't being applied to a shallow foundation. Franchise should be the one area of the game that depth is always prioritized, and it just doesn't seem to be the case. Let the other modes and aspects of the game draw in casuals.

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[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by kennypowers88

This is definitely true, but what frustrates me is knowing how much time was not only spent on casual features, but wasted. If they more efficiently used the development cycle, I think we could have both. Give us all the realism we want, but let the casual players turn it off or make it easier. I mean, I'd be thrilled with this years announcements if they weren't being applied to a shallow foundation. Franchise should be the one area of the game that depth is always prioritized, and it just doesn't seem to be the case. Let the other modes and aspects of the game draw in casuals. Sent from my SM-G960U using Operation Sports mobile app

Can you give me an example of this? I'm aware of them focusing on things that arent of interest to me or the sim community but not them wasting development time.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

This exact point has been made repeatedly and still holds true, EA Tib does whatever they want to do and these supposed excuses are illogical reasoning after the fact, imo. For example any claim that what EA has chosen to do with Madden is justified for profit is illogical when other games are making profit, in competitive markets no less, taking different approaches. If I'm not mistaken MUT has been revealed to be the cash cow for EA, so I fail to see how Madden being a better representation of real football would make that mode less fun and lucrative. I have wondered if "fun" was just a cheaper investment than authenticity and even though there may be something to that, when I see the seeming resources put into stuff like Longshot, I honestly don't know why EA created this divisive strawman of fun and authenticity being at odds in a sports simulation video game.

Its not fun vs. authenticity imo. Its care or dont care.

When adding a feature will the majority of gamers (sim or casual) care about the feature they are adding? Is this feature going to motivate past purchasers to buy the game and motivate people who dont buy Madden to buy the game.

Take Longshot. I'm not privy to Madden's numbers but I've talked to EA's devs and story modes are pretty popular. EA's data shows that. The Journey on FIFA was a success. 2k's story mode is really popular for its NBA title. Longshot didnt make a single person at OS excited about that game but it was directed at them. It was directed at the person who plays Madden casually or not at all in an attempt to give them another entry point to the game.

I have to give Madden 19 some credit so far though. They have added a few things and gone in a realistic direction from what ive seen. The reality is no one but hardcore sim players care about things like draft class edits in CFMs and they made that a focal point of their CFM improvements. RPM is an animation system that they could of gone in a completely goofy and unrealistic direction but it APPEARS that they direction they took it in a direction that this community will like.

In the end, its just a corporation being a corporation. Some choose to go in a more sim direction for sales (NBA 2k and some aspects of the Show)...some dont.

[TheBleedingRed21]

Quote: Originally Posted by SeaTownGamer

Him being nice doesn’t mean franchise will be better. Lol. I don’t care about him being a class act or not. The big question is can he execute and give us what we want?...The guy can can be a jerk but as long as he makes a helluva franchise I would be happy. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So as usual you disregarded the rest of the post that said his passion and previous work speaks for itself. Doesn’t surprise me. If you don’t agree, oh well.