ELLY DE LA CRUZ

[The Kid 24]

Quote: Originally Posted by StonewallTexan

Why all the starry eyes for this kid in particular? I mean, it is certainly possible he is the real deal, but there have been a bunch of physically gifted guys that make a rookie splash as the next five-tool sure-thing hall of famer, only to fizzle out. Remember Domonic Brown or (on the pitching side) Matt Moore? For that matter, people talked about JD Drew with a lot of hyperbole in his day. While we did not wash out and a career .873 OPS is above average, he never lived up to the rookie year hype, either.

None of the guys mentioned come close to the skills ELDC has. He is once in a generation type talent.


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[Cod]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Kid 24

None of the guys mentioned come close to the skills ELDC has. He is once in a generation type talent.

I think part of the problem is that we're too quick to label these guys "generational talents" (or pick your buzzword). There are many examples of this backfiring badly:

• Shawn Abner was a multi-sport athlete taken with the first pick of the 1984 draft and was touted as an athletic Adonis.
• Kris Benson was the next great pitcher supposedly. Other than his wife, he didn't do very well for himself.
• Matt Anderson was the first overall pick in 1997 and scouts called him the next Nolan Ryan.

I'm not against Elly De La Cruz as I think he has the tools to be a great player. He went from Cincy's #4 prospect at the beginning of last season to their #1 prospect and the second best in all of baseball. He is by far the best athlete on the field for Cincy. Remember though, the guy had one of the highest strikeout percentage rates in the minor leagues. He hit over .300 while managing to strike out over 30% of the time. Like I said previously, I just don't want his rating to be overly inflated after less than a week in the majors.

The question for this thread is, who are comparable players that can help guide his ratings? In my opinion, right now, De La Cruz is a better version of O'Neill Cruz.

[StonewallTexan]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Kid 24

None of the guys mentioned come close to the skills ELDC has. He is once in a generation type talent.

The Statcast era seems to be warping people's perceptions. We have only been measuring things like exit velocity, field throw speed, etc. for a few years. We really have nothing to compare it to in the past.

Additionally, while physical abilities are necessary, baseball is not a sport where physical abilities alone will get you the Hall of Fame (or anywhere else). All the physical skills in the world will not if Major League pitchers figure out something like you cannot hit a slider. The numbers he has posted so far in AAA and in the few games in the MLB have been matched or exceeded by other rookies over even longer periods of time.

The Statcast era began less than 10 years ago, and accurate measurements in some categories are newer than that. If we are comparing throw speed or exit velocities difference of 1 or 2 mph (so ~1%-3% differences), we really have no idea what players 15 or 20 years ago were doing.

[djflock]

Quote: Originally Posted by StonewallTexan

Why all the starry eyes for this kid in particular? I mean, it is certainly possible he is the real deal, but there have been a bunch of physically gifted guys that make a rookie splash as the next five-tool sure-thing hall of famer, only to fizzle out. Remember Domonic Brown or (on the pitching side) Matt Moore? For that matter, people talked about JD Drew with a lot of hyperbole in his day. While we did not wash out and a career .873 OPS is above average, he never lived up to the rookie year hype, either.

Is this a troll? Lol

He’s 6-5 , hits the ball harder than anyone on the field, throws harder than anyone, and is the fastest. Sky is the limit.

God forbid ppl love an exciting young player.

[djflock]

Quote: Originally Posted by StonewallTexan

The Statcast era seems to be warping people's perceptions. We have only been measuring things like exit velocity, field throw speed, etc. for a few years. We really have nothing to compare it to in the past. Additionally, while physical abilities are necessary, baseball is not a sport where physical abilities alone will get you the Hall of Fame (or anywhere else). All the physical skills in the world will not if Major League pitchers figure out something like you cannot hit a slider. The numbers he has posted so far in AAA and in the few games in the MLB have been matched or exceeded by other rookies over even longer periods of time. The Statcast era began less than 10 years ago, and accurate measurements in some categories are newer than that. If we are comparing throw speed or exit velocities difference of 1 or 2 mph (so ~1%-3% differences), we really have no idea what players 15 or 20 years ago were doing.

Generational “talent”. He didnt say he was a guaranteed hall of famer.

[Cod]

Quote: Originally Posted by djflock

He’s 6-5 , hits the ball harder than anyone on the field, throws harder than anyone, and is the fastest. Sky is the limit. God forbid ppl love an exciting young player.

You can be excited for a younger player, but to say he hits the ball harder than anyone else when he's only made contact with the ball a total of 5 times is disingenuous. For reference, Aaron Judge's average EV is only 2 mph slower than EDC's; however, Judge has 110 more batted ball events.

And don't say he's throwing harder than anyone when he's not even the hardest thrower on the Reds. Jose Barrero and Jake Fraley both have harder throws ON AVERAGE than EDC's hardest recorded throw.

Again, be excited for a kid that brings electricity to the game. But don't let your eyes and feelings deceive you...trust the data. Hopefully he'll get better, adapt, and put up wonderful numbers and help the Reds get back to The Big Red Machine era.

[djflock]

Quote: Originally Posted by Cod

You can be excited for a younger player, but to say he hits the ball harder than anyone else when he's only made contact with the ball a total of 5 times is disingenuous. For reference, Aaron Judge's average EV is only 2 mph slower than EDC's; however, Judge has 110 more batted ball events. And don't say he's throwing harder than anyone when he's not even the hardest thrower on the Reds. Jose Barrero and Jake Fraley both have harder throws ON AVERAGE than EDC's hardest recorded throw. Again, be excited for a kid that brings electricity to the game. But don't let your eyes and feelings deceive you...trust the data. Hopefully he'll get better, adapt, and put up wonderful numbers and help the Reds get back to The Big Red Machine era.

Bro your information is TERRIBLE.

https://www.mlb.com/news/reds-elly-d...rom-third-base

Elly has thrown 99.2 mph this season, thats the fastest from any fielder in AAA and Mlb this season

https://sports.yahoo.com/elly-de-la-...002512929.html

Elly has the hardest hit ball for a Red since 2019, 4th hardest ever by a red.

https://nypost.com/2023/06/08/reds-p...ng-scouts/amp/

Elly has recorded the fastest time for a triple this season.

These are all measurables. And he is top 1% in all of them . You do realize that they can measure these things in the minor leagues too right??

[Redsdude]

Quote: Originally Posted by djflock

Bro your information is TERRIBLE. https://www.mlb.com/news/reds-elly-d...rom-third-base Elly has thrown 99.2 mph this season, thats the fastest from any fielder in AAA and Mlb this season https://sports.yahoo.com/elly-de-la-...002512929.html Elly has the hardest hit ball for a Red since 2019, 4th hardest ever by a red. https://nypost.com/2023/06/08/reds-p...ng-scouts/amp/ Elly has recorded the fastest time for a triple this season. These are all measurables. And he is top 1% in all of them . You do realize that they can measure these things in the minor leagues too right??

Lol thank you. This guy was playing ball in AAA and recording insane stat cast #s. And yeah, they are relatively new so allow for variance, but it’s obvious he is usually going to be the fastest runner, hardest thrower, and have more raw power than anybody on any field.