NFL Off Topic

[The Kid 24]

Quote: Originally Posted by illwill10

I think they would want a good return to even consider it. I do think he is traded next offseason. Any sign of a decline and they will move onto Love the next season. They are still in a championship window as long as Rodgers is playing at this level, so no reason to move to Love until then.

Was immediately declined, said they arent moving Aaron.

Thank god!

[ImTellinTim]

Quote: Originally Posted by ggsimmonds

They've backed themselves into a corner where they almost have to have a SB appearance in the next 3 years or so. Because after this window closes, theres going to be some dark days in LA. Its like they've become obsessed with finding that one missing piece to put them over the top, and they're chasing it no matter the cost. They win a SB, the moves are absolutely worth it. If they don't? Ooooh boy. Does anyone think Stafford pushes them into SB territory? Cause they just made a huge bet that he does

Yes, and I wish my team would be in a position to do something like this. Instead they are awful most of the time and go one and done if they are lucky enough to back into the playoffs. I'd definitely take 2-3 years of an ACTUAL window and then return to what we already have over just maintaining the status quo.

[pietasterp]

I think there's no question the Rams are better with Stafford under center, and if you put him on a playoff-ready team, I think that implies they are contenders to at least make it to the NFC title game.

I don't think the Rams gave up too much to get Stafford; competitive windows are very short, and if you think you have a team that can potentially go the distance, I think you have to go all-in and forget about what happens in 2023. Also, if you believe in the Jimmy Johnson "points" system of rating draft assets and players, LA's 2 first-rounders in '22 and '23 are likely going to be somewhere around the 20th pick or worse, so that's not really much more valuable than one first-rounder that is top-10 (by some estimates).

From my perspective, there were maybe 2-3 teams that are truly 1 good QB away from being a Super Bowl contender, and LA was one of them. Perhaps San Francisco and Indianapolis are the only other teams that I can think of that are literally 1 guy away. Maybe New Orleans (much as it pains me to say that), but that's about all I can think of. If I were any one of those teams, I would mortgage everything to get a top-tier QB like Stafford and try to win now.

From the Detroit perspective? I think they did about as well as they could do, although Goff's contract is a short-term anchor. Essentially, they paid cash for draft picks (by taking on Goff's salary to make the deal work), which isn't the worst idea in the world, actually. Now the hard(er) part is drafting impact players with those draft assets, and Detroit has historically been very bad at that. But I suppose hope springs eternal for the Lions (unbelievably).

A total victory for Detroit would be if they could somehow offload Goff before the season starts to a needy/desperate team (e.g. Indy or something) for additional draft capital. That would make this deal a total win for them. But that's really unlikely to happen.

[ggsimmonds]

Quote: Originally Posted by pietasterp

I think there's no question the Rams are better with Stafford under center, and if you put him on a playoff-ready team, I think that implies they are contenders to at least make it to the NFC title game. I don't think the Rams gave up too much to get Stafford; competitive windows are very short, and if you think you have a team that can potentially go the distance, I think you have to go all-in and forget about what happens in 2023. Also, if you believe in the Jimmy Johnson "points" system of rating draft assets and players, LA's 2 first-rounders in '22 and '23 are likely going to be somewhere around the 20th pick or worse, so that's not really much more valuable than one first-rounder that is top-10 (by some estimates). From my perspective, there were maybe 2-3 teams that are truly 1 good QB away from being a Super Bowl contender, and LA was one of them. Perhaps San Francisco and Indianapolis are the only other teams that I can think of that are literally 1 guy away. Maybe New Orleans (much as it pains me to say that), but that's about all I can think of. If I were any one of those teams, I would mortgage everything to get a top-tier QB like Stafford and try to win now. From the Detroit perspective? I think they did about as well as they could do, although Goff's contract is a short-term anchor. Essentially, they paid cash for draft picks (by taking on Goff's salary to make the deal work), which isn't the worst idea in the world, actually. Now the hard(er) part is drafting impact players with those draft assets, and Detroit has historically been very bad at that. But I suppose hope springs eternal for the Lions (unbelievably). A total victory for Detroit would be if they could somehow offload Goff before the season starts to a needy/desperate team (e.g. Indy or something) for additional draft capital. That would make this deal a total win for them. But that's really unlikely to happen.

Weren't they contenders to make it to the NFCCG already though? Thats why many are saying they overpaid.

Competitive windows are only short if you mortgage the future. Draft well, and make shrewd FA signings and you can prolong the window. Rams are taking the opposite approach by making aggressive moves to enlarge the window while shortening the duration.

When we say Stafford is top tier, are we talking about compared to available free agents or top tier when including all starting QBs?

Would I make this move for Rodgers or Watson? Absolutely, because then the magnitude of that window would be large enough in my opinion to justify shortening the duration because they are true top tier QBs. I'm not so sure thats the case with Stafford.

[ggsimmonds]

An additional note on what I'll be watching for in 2021, the narrative has been that Goff has regressed but the talk hasn't been about McVay's performance and regression over the past 2 years.

The shine on McVay's reputation as an offensive genius has diminished. The narrative is that defenses figured it out and McVay has failed to adapt.

This creates an open question, with a new QB will McVay rediscover his offensive acumen?

[pietasterp]

Quote: Originally Posted by ggsimmonds

They've backed themselves into a corner where they almost have to have a SB appearance in the next 3 years or so. Because after this window closes, theres going to be some dark days in LA. Its like they've become obsessed with finding that one missing piece to put them over the top, and they're chasing it no matter the cost. They win a SB, the moves are absolutely worth it. If they don't? Ooooh boy. Does anyone think Stafford pushes them into SB territory? Cause they just made a huge bet that he does

Quote: Originally Posted by ggsimmonds

Weren't they contenders to make it to the NFCCG already though? Thats why many are saying they overpaid. Competitive windows are only short if you mortgage the future. Draft well, and make shrewd FA signings and you can prolong the window. Rams are taking the opposite approach by making aggressive moves to enlarge the window while shortening the duration. When we say Stafford is top tier, are we talking about compared to available free agents or top tier when including all starting QBs? Would I make this move for Rodgers or Watson? Absolutely, because then the magnitude of that window would be large enough in my opinion to justify shortening the duration because they are true top tier QBs. I'm not so sure thats the case with Stafford.

I don't think anyone picked LA to go to the NFC title game this year, and their QB play has been so sub-optimal, McVay went with their backup in the playoff game even though Goff could have gone (and ultimately did end up playing).

Drafting well and making good FA signings is obviously always the goal, but it's easier said than done, and history tells us that it is hard to do consistently over a long period of time (for any franchise). There are a single-digit number of franchises (and arguably a single franchise) that has accomplished that over longer than a 5-6 year period. For everyone else, if you really think you are 1 QB away from potentially winning a title (and only maybe 2-3 teams are), I think you have to make the move to try to get that guy.

The 1st round draft picks LA gave up in '22 and '23 probably will be in the 20's anyway, and if they end up winning a title, I don't think anyone will care about who they could've gotten at pick #32 in 2023.

I don't know if it will work out with Stafford in LA or not, but he has been - statistically, anyway - a top-10 QB in the league more often than not for most of his career. Granted, I probably have watched him play a lot more than most people (because who other than Lions fans watches Lions game?), but I don't see any reason he wouldn't thrive given any semblance of a running game and a quality defense (the Rams had more 100-yard rushing performances from guys last season than the Lions have had during Stafford's entire career). The Lions have just asked too much of Stafford for too long, and most of the country doesn't know much about him because the Lions are a failure as an organization, and have been since the 1950's.

I like the trade for LA, and I think they did the right thing. I like the trade for Detroit, but you could credibly argue that Carolina's 8th overall first-round pick this year is worth more than a 20-something pick next year and the year after (for those that subscribe to the Jimmy Johnson points-value table for draft assets, it's almost a wash). And Detroit had to take on a lot of salary, and a QB that does not seem like the future of the franchise and will hinder future cap flexibility for the short-term.

Re: McVay, there might be a lot of truth to that. We'll see I guess. But whatever the outcome, the Rams did what they thought they had to do to win next year. I can't fault them for that.

[illwill10]

Quote: Originally Posted by ggsimmonds

An additional note on what I'll be watching for in 2021, the narrative has been that Goff has regressed but the talk hasn't been about McVay's performance and regression over the past 2 years. The shine on McVay's reputation as an offensive genius has diminished. The narrative is that defenses figured it out and McVay has failed to adapt. This creates an open question, with a new QB will McVay rediscover his offensive acumen?

That McVay craze faded away after the Superbowl. It was crazy how Zac Taylor got a HC job because he was the QB coach for the Rams when the craze was young offensive minds for HC.


Even looking at the Rams WRs, I don't think it's an upgrade Detroit. Only upgrade for Stafford is a better Running game. Is Stafford better than Goff, you can say that. But is Stafford that "good " to transform the McVay offense? I wouldn't say that. They could benefit from getting a speedy playmaker at WR. If they could hit on Mecole Hardman type of WR in the middle rounds of draft, that could take that offense to another level.

[TheShizNo1]

Wait wait...... you're saying Kupp and Robert Woods aren't an upgrade over oft-injured Golladay and *insert whatever other WR decides to show up this week*?

The Rams are a full upgrade over the Lions, man.

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