HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

[coreyhartsdaughter]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Kind of off topic, but how does an increase in difficulty affect the CPU's playing ability? I want to increase difficulty to HoF, however I just finished perfecting my sliders, and don't really feel like having to spend forever tuning them up again. The human sliders are no big deal, because I already have a good idea of what to do there, but I was wondering if you guys noticed any thing the CPU does better/more of on the higher difficulty, that would result in me having to modify their sliders.

For example, if the CPU hits more home runs on HoF, or something like that.

Thanks in advance.

It's my opinion that HUM bats feel 'heavier' in HOF+, that's to say physics seems to have more of an effect on the ball off the bat for both the CPU/HUM.

I think Hero's explanations are pretty good - however, I'd add that the CPU's AI / Pitcher's approach also is improved in terms of sequences. On lower levels, it's more common-place to see a pitcher get behind and try to come back with fastballs over the plate, whereas on higher levels, a 2-0 count against a slugger, the CPU pitcher will still try for corners or bring their best / highest confidence pitches, allowing a walk rather than a big play.

The opposite is true as well. The CPU hitters pick up on 'patterns' more easily at HOF+. A HUM player needs to greatly vary pitch speed, location, and sequences on the higher difficulties. This brings me to a technique that many guys fail to apply - pitching well out of the strike zone and intentionally missing the yellow line on the pitching meter.

As this video shows:

http://www.operationsports.com/news/...tricks/?page=4

You can place the ball marker in one spot, but intentionally leave the ball higher or low. This is just one more effective way to vary pitch location / sequencing.

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

It's my opinion that HUM bats feel 'heavier' in HOF+, that's to say physics seems to have more of an effect on the ball off the bat for both the CPU/HUM.

I think Hero's explanations are pretty good - however, I'd add that the CPU's AI / Pitcher's approach also is improved in terms of sequences. On lower levels, it's more common-place to see a pitcher get behind and try to come back with fastballs over the plate, whereas on higher levels, a 2-0 count against a slugger, the CPU pitcher will still try for corners or bring their best / highest confidence pitches, allowing a walk rather than a big play.

The opposite is true as well. The CPU hitters pick up on 'patterns' more easily at HOF+. A HUM player needs to greatly vary pitch speed, location, and sequences on the higher difficulties. This brings me to a technique that many guys fail to apply - pitching well out of the strike zone and intentionally missing the yellow line on the pitching meter.

As this video shows:

http://www.operationsports.com/news/...tricks/?page=4

You can place the ball marker in one spot, but intentionally leave the ball higher or low. This is just one more effective way to vary pitch location / sequencing.

Absolutely.

CPU pitching pattern variability and CPU pitching pattern recognition are the most noticable changes as difficulty increases.

On AS, you will generally see starters focus on 2-3 strike zone areas per at bat. And repetitive patterns from CPU pitchers are easier to identify on AS than HOF.

As far as User Pitching is concerned, the same approach of mixing patterns (in order to be sucessful) is more crucial. The AI intelligence is more advanced on HOF and seems to have a longer memory for repetition (example: up up, down down, up...whereas on AS, it may top out at up up, down down....again, just a fictitious example)...

Which leads to my broader point. The bump in difficulty is more complex than the current sliders allow us to alter.

Oh, welcome back CHD (tips cap).

[Bobhead]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Thank you H&V and CHD, that's exactly what I needed to know.

And yeah I'm not trying to make the difficulty easier or anything like that. I was just worried that, for example, and hypothetically speaking, if I already had the sliders set for the perfect number of CPU home runs, and switching to HoF increased the number of home runs by the CPU, then I'd end up with a significantly higher, and thus, unrealistic amount.

[coreyhartsdaughter]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Thank you H&V and CHD, that's exactly what I needed to know.

And yeah I'm not trying to make the difficulty easier or anything like that. I was just worried that, for example, and hypothetically speaking, if I already had the sliders set for the perfect number of CPU home runs, and switching to HoF increased the number of home runs by the CPU, then I'd end up with a significantly higher, and thus, unrealistic amount.

The great chicken and egg problem!

For my slider set this year I'm going HOF/HOF from the start, not beginning my franchise until I'm consistent in my play, confident I've eliminated any 'user skill' variables.

Come July, you'll see a lot of guys come back looking to increase the difficulty or make the game harder already 50 games into their franchise... as they're now consistently better at the game than they were 2 months prior...kinda defeats the purpose in my humble opinion.

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

The great chicken and egg problem!

For my slider set this year I'm going HOF/HOF from the start, not beginning my franchise until I'm consistent in my play, confident I've eliminated any 'user skill' variables.

Come July, you'll see a lot of guys come back looking to increase the difficulty or make the game harder already 50 games into their franchise... as they're now consistently better at the game than they were 2 months prior...kinda defeats the purpose in my humble opinion.

Ahhh...the good ol' "user skill increase."

There's nothing worse than questioning your entire franchise, based on the gut feeling that you've recently found a brand new ability plateau.

50 games is an ideal number to flatten/level out user ability. At right around that point for me, basically crunch time, I had just started to see my analog pitching improve. Almost like the snap of a finger.

I couldn't tell you how happy I was to have seen that in myself, literally a matter of days before Knight's rosters released. Stat tracking, and abundance of "practice" franchise games, really payed off for me. I shaved off a couple of clicks on the User consistency, I started my franchise, and I'm fairly certain my skills have peaked. Hopefully to never look back (minus possibly pitch speed, or a global here and there).

The process is time consuming (notebooks, research, etc), but the bounty is huge.

[coreyhartsdaughter]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Ahhh...the good ol' "user skill increase."

There's nothing worse than questioning your entire franchise, based on the gut feeling that you've recently found a brand new ability plateau.

50 games is an ideal number to flatten/level out user ability. At right around that point for me, basically crunch time, I had just started to see my analog pitching improve. Almost like the snap of a finger.

I couldn't tell you how happy I was to have seen that in myself, literally a matter of days before Knight's rosters released. Stat tracking, and abundance of "practice" franchise games, really payed off for me. I dropped a couple of clicks on the User consistency, I started my franchise, and I'm fairly certain my skills have peaked. Hopefully to never look back (minus possibly pitch speed, or a global here and there).

The process is time consuming (notebooks, research, etc), but the payoff is huge.

I'm holding out for the Opening Day set.

Are you using the new analog pitching control?

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

I'm holding out for the Opening Day set.

Are you using the new analog pitching control?

Oh my goodness. Abso-freaking-lutely! LOL! It's so much fun, I can't even contain myself.

While the mechanic is not perfect, it's the truest to life mechanic of any sort I've ever used in a simulated baseball game.

In years to come, I tend to believe SCEA will continue to refine it, mainly because fastballs seem a tad easier to place than anything else in the repertiore. But hurling a curve with a sub-par control pitcher is incredibly realistic. And dominating with aces...a feature that I personally think SCEA needed to make a bit more frequent...is just that. More frequent.

Example: After dominant performances from C.C. (well, minus one inning), and that rare nearly no-hit outing from A.J., Minnesota literally demolished me for 12 runs in a game with Ivan Nova last night. The game variance, and starter variance (the bridge between aces and scrubs) is incredible with analog.

Note: Consistency seems to be tied into the stick sensitivity this year...which I am grateful to have discovered. If you're hitting your upstroke too well, generally, dropping that (mine is at 3) makes the ace/journeyman divide that much greater.

Best of all, which I loathed last year, dropping consistency hasn't pillaged my ability to hurl that 10+, a couple of times per season, K game.

It's truly a thing of beauty. Remember, this coming from a guy that would strictly play MOM if that was the ONLY way to see realistic stats (as I was afraid Analog would be too user dependent, and not ratings based).

Hitting, on the other hand, I'm using that mode we DREAMED about last year. A true, ratings based, timing mode: Timing only hitting. We got our wish CHD! LOL!

But, yeah, with Analog pitching, SCEA hit it out of the park. My BB/9 ratio and K/9 ratio are very realistic. As are my H/9 (below 1 per inning...finally, as last year, less than a one per inning was impossible with good and conpetitive sliders), and my ERA (constantly over 4.00).

I'm using the slider on page 1, minus pitch speed.

[skow05]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

So I faced my first "ace" in this game. Clayton Kershaw was on the bump for the Dodgers who visited the Friendly Confines of Wrigley Field.

Kershaw was the story in this game, taking a perfect game into the 7th inning. His chase for history escaped him though, as he fed Marlon Byrd a fastball down the heart of the plate on a 2-1 count, resulting in a sharp line drive single to left field. Kershaw didn't let it faze him as he continued to dominate until Darwin Barney dribbled a single up the middle with 1 out in the 9th, and then Castro broke out of his slump with a double down the left field line.

Marlon Byrd came up with men on 2nd and 3rd and Kershaw challenged him with a fastball up in the zone. I was right on it but ultimately it fell just short of the wall into Matt Kemp's glove, Marlon probably could have used an extra shipment from Balco on this day. This was enough to drive in Barney from 3rd base, erasing the goose egg that had hung up on the scoreboard for 8.2 innings.

The Dodgers decided to play it safe with Aramis Ramirez coming to the plate and the tying run (Pena) on deck. MacDougal came out in relief of Kershaw and closed the door on any shimmer of hope I had of a miraculous comeback.

Randy Wells left the game in the 4th inning due to shoulder stiffness, allowing Samardzija to come in and win back his manager's (my) trust. He pitched 2.2 innings of clean sheet baseball, picking up 2 k's along the way.

The Cubs fall to 8-11 on the season, and stick at 4th place in the NL Central, 9.5 games back of the 18-2 St.Louis Cardinals.

I can't believe how hot the Cardinals are, especially with the fact that I put Wainwright on the DL for the entire season. NUTS!

EDIT: I accidentally switched up the Cubs and Dodgers stats in the box score, my bad!

<link href="http://dynasties.operationsports.com/css/osdyn.css" rel="stylesheet" type="text/css"><table class="osdyn" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="575"><tbody><tr class="masthead"><td colspan="13" align="center">LAD at CHC - Wrigley Field</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="40%">Apr 1, </td><td align="right" width="5%">1</td><td align="right" width="5%">2</td><td align="right" width="5%">3</td><td align="right" width="5%">4</td><td align="right" width="5%">5</td><td align="right" width="5%">6</td><td align="right" width="5%">7</td><td align="right" width="5%">8</td><td align="right" width="5%">9</td><td align="right" width="5%">R</td><td align="right" width="5%">H</td><td align="right" width="5%">E</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Los Angeles Dodgers ()</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">0</td><td class="active" align="right">4</td><td align="right">11</td><td align="right">0</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Chicago Cubs ()</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td class="active" align="right">1</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">0</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="13" align="center">W: Clayton Kershaw L: Randy Wells S: Mike MacDougal</td></tr></tbody></table><table class="osdyn spacer" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="575"><tbody><tr class="masthead_alt"><td colspan="9" bgcolor="#005a9c">Los Angeles Dodgers</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">HITTERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">AB</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">RBI</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">AVG</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">28</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">9</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">
</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9">BATTING:
2B: Castro (4)
RBI: Byrd (11)
SF: Byrd
GIDP: Soto</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9">BASERUNNING:
SB: Byrd (4)</td></tr></tbody></table><table class="osdyn spacer" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="575"><tbody><tr class="masthead_alt"><td colspan="9" bgcolor="#005596">Chicago Cubs</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">HITTERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">AB</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">RBI</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">AVG</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">36</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">11</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">
</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9">BATTING:
2B: Kemp (3), Barajas (2)
RBI: Uribe (10), Ethier 2 (18), Kemp (16)
SAC: Kershaw
GIDP: Barajas</td></tr></tbody></table><table class="osdyn spacer" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="575"><tbody><tr class="masthead_alt"><td colspan="9" bgcolor="#005a9c">Los Angeles Dodgers</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">PITCHERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">IP</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">ER</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">ERA</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Wells (L, 1-2)</td><td align="right">3.1</td><td align="right">6</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td class="active" align="right">5.66</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td>Samardzija</td><td align="right">2.2</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">0</td><td class="active" align="right">2.53</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Grabow</td><td align="right">1.0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td class="active" align="right">3.24</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td>Mateo</td><td align="right">2.0</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td class="active" align="right">4.00</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">9.0</td><td align="right">11</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">4.00</td></tr></tbody></table><table class="osdyn spacer" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="575"><tbody><tr class="masthead_alt"><td colspan="9" bgcolor="#005596">Chicago Cubs</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">PITCHERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">IP</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">ER</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">ERA</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Kershaw (W, 1-1)</td><td align="right">8.2</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">9</td><td align="right">0</td><td class="active" align="right">4.78</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td>MacDougal (S, 1)</td><td align="right">0.1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td class="active" align="right">4.05</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">9.0</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">9</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">
</td></tr></tbody></table>

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Skow, after your 20th game, would you care to post your team (don't worry about player stats) stats? Like, team average, HR's, BB, 2B, Pitching ERA, SO, BB, etc.

As well as your slider changes, if there are any additional?

Great stuff Skow. Your boxes look very life like. I've enjoyed reading them.

[Bobhead]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

You hit the nail on the head h&V, I absolutely love analog pitching in this game, at least I did until about 5 minutes ago when I blew a 4 run lead in the 9th inning. But anyway I completely agree and its definitely the most realistic type of pitching I've ever used in any game.

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

You hit the nail on the head h&V, I absolutely love analog pitching in this game, at least I did until about 5 minutes ago when I blew a 4 run lead in the 9th inning. But anyway I completely agree and its definitely the most realistic type of pitching I've ever used in any game.

I'd like to see the strike zone at the top shrink based on control/walk ratings, personally (not my idea, thanks QB), in a perfect world, but it's nothing a little consistency can't cure. Again, I'm so thrilled that consistency impacts analog in it's current matter.

Not to mention, the meter can also be shrunk!!! I suck just enough to not have to do this, however.

Analog pitching is practically perfect. I even lose nearly perfectly, like you said above.

It's really a thing of beauty.

[skow05]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Skow, after your 20th game, would you care to post your team (don't worry about player stats) stats? Like, team average, HR's, BB, 2B, Pitching ERA, SO, BB, etc.

As well as your slider changes, if there are any additional?

Great stuff Skow. Your boxes look very life like. I've enjoyed reading them.

I've probably played 11 of those. After my first 2 series I decided to go with a little bit of a sim schedule. I pitched with Dempster to wrap up the D-Backs series and then simmed past Dempsters next start to play Z's next. Allows me to pitch with all of my starters but progresses the season at the same time. I'm a bit erratic with it as I've decided to play this whole Dodgers series since we're struggling a bit.

Still want me to post team stats?

[skow05]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

So after 21 games in my franchise these are my stats. Keep in mind that I played 11 of these and simmed 10.

Sliders I have changed from the set on the first page (what I currently have them at)
Hum Solid Hits (3)
Hum Pitch Consistency (2)
CPU Solid Hits (3)
Pitch Speed (2)

BA - .240 (25th ranked)
Runs - 73 (23rd ranked)
Hits - 153 (27th ranked)
2B - 27 (26th ranked)
3B - 4 (T-6th ranked)
HR - 19 (T-20th ranked)
SB - 14 (9th ranked)
BB - 55 (22nd ranked)
K's (Hitting) - 162 (30th ranked)
Errors - 7 (T-1st ranked)
ERA - 4.07 (22nd ranked)
HR Allowed - 16 (4th ranked)
BB Allowed - 54 (T-7th ranked)
K's (Pitching) - 118 (T-22nd ranked)

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

So after 21 games in my franchise these are my stats. Keep in mind that I played 11 of these and simmed 10.

BA - .240 (25th ranked)
Runs - 73 (23rd ranked)
Hits - 153 (27th ranked)
2B - 27 (26th ranked)
3B - 4 (T-6th ranked)
HR - 19 (T-20th ranked)
SB - 14 (9th ranked)
BB - 55 (22nd ranked)
K's (Hitting) - 162 (30th ranked)
Errors - 7 (T-1st ranked)
ERA - 4.07 (22nd ranked)
HR Allowed - 16 (4th ranked)
BB Allowed - 54 (T-7th ranked)
K's (Pitching) - 118 (T-22nd ranked)

I'm going on a sim schedule too. Thought I was the only one.

I'll play my first 11, sim 1, play 2, sim 1, etc.

Yeah, it's nice to see the stats regardless man, so thanks.

Where would you guess your personal AVG, ERA, and HR's to be? Pretty spot on?

[coreyhartsdaughter]

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

I'm going on a sim schedule too. Thought I was the only one.

I'll play my first 11, sim 1, play 2, sim 1, etc.

Yeah, it's nice to see the stats regardless man, so thanks.

Where would you guess your personal AVG, ERA, and HR's to be? Pretty spot on?

Some comments/questions, as I attempt to dial my set in:

You're on pace for 54 errors, the RL Cubs committed 126 last season, and the lowest in the NL was 72. A bump in throwing errors?

Human K's (batting) are right on the money. Although it seems the other teams CPU simulated may be a little low.

You're on pace for 416 BB allowed. Last years cubs gave up 605, while the Phillies surrendered 416. I'd assume the majority of those are also from the simmed games. Curious, how many hits have you allowed in played games? What are your average total pitch counts? Also, whats a typical K:BB ration, and how many CPU fouls per game? HUM pitching always seems to be the toughest (and most frustrating) to dial in.

What's you OBP, and how many pitches are opposing pitchers averaging against you.

Your extra base hits seem low (assuming many of the triples came with simmed games) Have you considered lowering Fielder speed, but raising Reaction (to cut down on infield singles)?

What's the CPU's typical K:BB ration in games played?