Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

[LetsGoPitt]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

After a long absence, I'm bumping up this thread simply because we beat the living crap out of the Reds today

And some long-overdue thoughts:

1. Mac is apparently intent on playing Simon exclusively at third unless there is a lefty pitching. This means that Tony Alvarez will probably stagnate on the bench and have maybe 5 at bats as a pinch hitter. In Simon's defense, he's looked better in the two games he's started, He even walked THREE times in those two games (gasp!)

2. Moving Vogelsong to the pen is the right move. It gives the Pirates two leftys in the rotation, lets Vogelsong still see some MLB action, AND provides an extra arm in a much-overused pen. Especially with Torres serving a suspension very soon.

3. I'm afraid it's time to send Mr. Castillo off to AAA. He's looking more and more overmatched at the plate. He's great defensively, but second base is going to be very crowded once Sanchez is healthy.

4. The departure of Daryle Ward for the next few weeks should open up Tike's chance to get back the leadoff spot. Not that Mac will do this, but he should move Kendall to #3 and Tike back to #1. Having Tike bat 7th behind Simon is a total waste of his ability. Not to mention that Mackowiak is certainly NOT a #3 hitter.

5. I really like what I've seen from Burnett so far. He goes toe-to-toe with Clemens and almost matches him. The only concern for me is his walks, but an ERA under 4 for the first two MLB starts of a young kid like that is a good sign.

6. Not an observation, just a shout-out to Jason Bay for coming around with the bat. Let's hope he keeps it up.

[Karlos05]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Nice to see this bumped back up

1. Yup with Daryle gone I think we are in for a big dose of Randall Simon. He has played better the last couple games but I don't know if that makes up for the whole season. One plus from this though is that maybe we can up the stock in Simon. I'm sure there are a couple playoff teams who would like a nice lefty off the bench and if Simon playus well enough we could trade him again.

2. Vogelsong, well I have been in his corner all year and I'm not backing down now. I think he can be good and he's shown flashes of it. Being in the pen right now is the right move. Hopefully he's back in the rotation soon either because of injury of Benson being traded.

3. Speaking of Benson. With the White Sox getting Freddy Garcia Benson looks like the best pitcher out on the market. So teams could be scrambling now to put together an offer to get Benson before someone else does. I hope Littlefield is able to get something good for Benson when he's traded.

4. Yea about time for Castillo to go back. I don't think he's quite ready and in AAA he could take some time and field some balls at 3rd. Plus I want to see Freddy get a shot and with all the middle infielders we have he may not get a fair one.

5. Tike has really started to come on lately. A few more games and he should be back in number 1. I've been real wishy-washy on him but I always thought he could come back to last years form. I sure hope this is the begining of that.

6. And finally Jason Bay and Oliver Perez are making Littlefield look like a genious. Both are ready and doing extremely well. Bay is hitting everything and Ollie has been the one constant in the rotation so far including the 13K performance last night. These two look like keepers.


Nice to have some Bucco talk

[Karlos05]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Nice to see this bumped back up

1. Yup with Daryle gone I think we are in for a big dose of Randall Simon. He has played better the last couple games but I don't know if that makes up for the whole season. One plus from this though is that maybe we can up the stock in Simon. I'm sure there are a couple playoff teams who would like a nice lefty off the bench and if Simon playus well enough we could trade him again.

2. Vogelsong, well I have been in his corner all year and I'm not backing down now. I think he can be good and he's shown flashes of it. Being in the pen right now is the right move. Hopefully he's back in the rotation soon either because of injury of Benson being traded.

3. Speaking of Benson. With the White Sox getting Freddy Garcia Benson looks like the best pitcher out on the market. So teams could be scrambling now to put together an offer to get Benson before someone else does. I hope Littlefield is able to get something good for Benson when he's traded.

4. Yea about time for Castillo to go back. I don't think he's quite ready and in AAA he could take some time and field some balls at 3rd. Plus I want to see Freddy get a shot and with all the middle infielders we have he may not get a fair one.

5. Tike has really started to come on lately. A few more games and he should be back in number 1. I've been real wishy-washy on him but I always thought he could come back to last years form. I sure hope this is the begining of that.

6. And finally Jason Bay and Oliver Perez are making Littlefield look like a genious. Both are ready and doing extremely well. Bay is hitting everything and Ollie has been the one constant in the rotation so far including the 13K performance last night. These two look like keepers.


Nice to have some Bucco talk

[Karlos05]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Nice to see this bumped back up

1. Yup with Daryle gone I think we are in for a big dose of Randall Simon. He has played better the last couple games but I don't know if that makes up for the whole season. One plus from this though is that maybe we can up the stock in Simon. I'm sure there are a couple playoff teams who would like a nice lefty off the bench and if Simon playus well enough we could trade him again.

2. Vogelsong, well I have been in his corner all year and I'm not backing down now. I think he can be good and he's shown flashes of it. Being in the pen right now is the right move. Hopefully he's back in the rotation soon either because of injury of Benson being traded.

3. Speaking of Benson. With the White Sox getting Freddy Garcia Benson looks like the best pitcher out on the market. So teams could be scrambling now to put together an offer to get Benson before someone else does. I hope Littlefield is able to get something good for Benson when he's traded.

4. Yea about time for Castillo to go back. I don't think he's quite ready and in AAA he could take some time and field some balls at 3rd. Plus I want to see Freddy get a shot and with all the middle infielders we have he may not get a fair one.

5. Tike has really started to come on lately. A few more games and he should be back in number 1. I've been real wishy-washy on him but I always thought he could come back to last years form. I sure hope this is the begining of that.

6. And finally Jason Bay and Oliver Perez are making Littlefield look like a genious. Both are ready and doing extremely well. Bay is hitting everything and Ollie has been the one constant in the rotation so far including the 13K performance last night. These two look like keepers.


Nice to have some Bucco talk

[mjb2124]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Ya know, I like Vogelsong in the pen and I'd like to see him stay there. I'll explain. Most likely Mesa will be traded before the trade deadline to someone looking for bullpen help. I'd really like to see Vogelsong move into the closers role. I feel he's got the type of stuff for it (Plus fastball, plus curveball and improving changeup). I think he could make the transition like how Gagne did. Recall he was a very below average starter before he moved into the closers role.

However, if/when Benson is traded, I'm sure Ryan will take that place in the rotation. It's just a thought, but I think Vogelsong could flourish in that role.

Onto other things.... Bay is really starting to look good at the plate. I guess he just needed some time after his shoulder injury. He's still a liability in the field, but you gotta keep that bat in the lineup.

Tike is also hitting much better recently. Glad to see it. I was really getting down on him the past month or so.

Ollie is flat out nasty. This guy has all the makings to be a frontline starter for a long time. His start on Saturday was amazing to watch.

How about Fogg today? The guy has struggled all season and then pitched a heck of a game today. I'd all but given up on him and then he goes out and pitches like that. His changeup was really darting down in the strike zone today.

It looked like JJ Davis hit pretty well during his rehab stint. I know we won't see him play much unless a lefty pitches, but we still need to find out what this guy can do with consistent AB's. It's hard enough to hit at the major league level and almost impossible for a young guy like him when he gets 1-2 AB's per week.

[mjb2124]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Ya know, I like Vogelsong in the pen and I'd like to see him stay there. I'll explain. Most likely Mesa will be traded before the trade deadline to someone looking for bullpen help. I'd really like to see Vogelsong move into the closers role. I feel he's got the type of stuff for it (Plus fastball, plus curveball and improving changeup). I think he could make the transition like how Gagne did. Recall he was a very below average starter before he moved into the closers role.

However, if/when Benson is traded, I'm sure Ryan will take that place in the rotation. It's just a thought, but I think Vogelsong could flourish in that role.

Onto other things.... Bay is really starting to look good at the plate. I guess he just needed some time after his shoulder injury. He's still a liability in the field, but you gotta keep that bat in the lineup.

Tike is also hitting much better recently. Glad to see it. I was really getting down on him the past month or so.

Ollie is flat out nasty. This guy has all the makings to be a frontline starter for a long time. His start on Saturday was amazing to watch.

How about Fogg today? The guy has struggled all season and then pitched a heck of a game today. I'd all but given up on him and then he goes out and pitches like that. His changeup was really darting down in the strike zone today.

It looked like JJ Davis hit pretty well during his rehab stint. I know we won't see him play much unless a lefty pitches, but we still need to find out what this guy can do with consistent AB's. It's hard enough to hit at the major league level and almost impossible for a young guy like him when he gets 1-2 AB's per week.

[mjb2124]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Ya know, I like Vogelsong in the pen and I'd like to see him stay there. I'll explain. Most likely Mesa will be traded before the trade deadline to someone looking for bullpen help. I'd really like to see Vogelsong move into the closers role. I feel he's got the type of stuff for it (Plus fastball, plus curveball and improving changeup). I think he could make the transition like how Gagne did. Recall he was a very below average starter before he moved into the closers role.

However, if/when Benson is traded, I'm sure Ryan will take that place in the rotation. It's just a thought, but I think Vogelsong could flourish in that role.

Onto other things.... Bay is really starting to look good at the plate. I guess he just needed some time after his shoulder injury. He's still a liability in the field, but you gotta keep that bat in the lineup.

Tike is also hitting much better recently. Glad to see it. I was really getting down on him the past month or so.

Ollie is flat out nasty. This guy has all the makings to be a frontline starter for a long time. His start on Saturday was amazing to watch.

How about Fogg today? The guy has struggled all season and then pitched a heck of a game today. I'd all but given up on him and then he goes out and pitches like that. His changeup was really darting down in the strike zone today.

It looked like JJ Davis hit pretty well during his rehab stint. I know we won't see him play much unless a lefty pitches, but we still need to find out what this guy can do with consistent AB's. It's hard enough to hit at the major league level and almost impossible for a young guy like him when he gets 1-2 AB's per week.

[Karlos05]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Fogg has really come on strong over his last 5 starts or so. They have all been pretty solid. He's not doing anything amazing but somehow he keeps the Pirates in the game and keeps on winning.

I agree I think Mesa will be traded. Teams always need bullpen help and Mesa has been strong this year. Some team will take a chance on him. But when he's gone, I don't know if Vogelsong would make a good closer. The one problem he's had all year is the first inning. He always gets hit hard the first time he's out there (today no exception Dunn went deep) but after he gets comfortable he can cruise. Coming in as a closer might no be the best thing for him. He's definatly got the stuff but I don't know if that would be the best option.

As for J.J I think this would probably be his best time to get some at-bats. Move Craig into play first and have Davis or Alvarez out in right. It's a great chance to give them some constant at bats and see what they can do. But with Simon's good last couple days I expect to see him at first with Craig out in right kind of a shame because it's really time for Davis to step up and see what he's got.

[Karlos05]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Fogg has really come on strong over his last 5 starts or so. They have all been pretty solid. He's not doing anything amazing but somehow he keeps the Pirates in the game and keeps on winning.

I agree I think Mesa will be traded. Teams always need bullpen help and Mesa has been strong this year. Some team will take a chance on him. But when he's gone, I don't know if Vogelsong would make a good closer. The one problem he's had all year is the first inning. He always gets hit hard the first time he's out there (today no exception Dunn went deep) but after he gets comfortable he can cruise. Coming in as a closer might no be the best thing for him. He's definatly got the stuff but I don't know if that would be the best option.

As for J.J I think this would probably be his best time to get some at-bats. Move Craig into play first and have Davis or Alvarez out in right. It's a great chance to give them some constant at bats and see what they can do. But with Simon's good last couple days I expect to see him at first with Craig out in right kind of a shame because it's really time for Davis to step up and see what he's got.

[Karlos05]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

Fogg has really come on strong over his last 5 starts or so. They have all been pretty solid. He's not doing anything amazing but somehow he keeps the Pirates in the game and keeps on winning.

I agree I think Mesa will be traded. Teams always need bullpen help and Mesa has been strong this year. Some team will take a chance on him. But when he's gone, I don't know if Vogelsong would make a good closer. The one problem he's had all year is the first inning. He always gets hit hard the first time he's out there (today no exception Dunn went deep) but after he gets comfortable he can cruise. Coming in as a closer might no be the best thing for him. He's definatly got the stuff but I don't know if that would be the best option.

As for J.J I think this would probably be his best time to get some at-bats. Move Craig into play first and have Davis or Alvarez out in right. It's a great chance to give them some constant at bats and see what they can do. But with Simon's good last couple days I expect to see him at first with Craig out in right kind of a shame because it's really time for Davis to step up and see what he's got.

[mjb2124]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

I agree about Vogelsong. I think he needs to figure some things out before he would be thrown into that position. However, if he continues to give up 1st inning runs, he's not going to be much of a starter either.

The idea stems primarily from the fact that I don't see another guy who can take over the closer role once Mesa is gone. We just don't have that type of guy in our system right now. Corey was a closer in the minors, but from what I've seen from him so far, he won't be in the majors.

Oh well, the Pirates have time to figure this one out.

[mjb2124]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

I agree about Vogelsong. I think he needs to figure some things out before he would be thrown into that position. However, if he continues to give up 1st inning runs, he's not going to be much of a starter either.

The idea stems primarily from the fact that I don't see another guy who can take over the closer role once Mesa is gone. We just don't have that type of guy in our system right now. Corey was a closer in the minors, but from what I've seen from him so far, he won't be in the majors.

Oh well, the Pirates have time to figure this one out.

[mjb2124]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

I agree about Vogelsong. I think he needs to figure some things out before he would be thrown into that position. However, if he continues to give up 1st inning runs, he's not going to be much of a starter either.

The idea stems primarily from the fact that I don't see another guy who can take over the closer role once Mesa is gone. We just don't have that type of guy in our system right now. Corey was a closer in the minors, but from what I've seen from him so far, he won't be in the majors.

Oh well, the Pirates have time to figure this one out.

[LetsGoPitt]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

I think the two players we have in the bullpen that would make the best closer should Mesa be traded are either Salomon Torres or Mike Gonzalez.

Torres can be nasty the first time through the lineup. The only downside to him is that he sometimes loses the plate. The fact that he's pitched so much lately makes me think he could handle the workload.

Gonzalez is an interesting option. Friday's grand slam aside, he's held opponents to about a .150 average and has great K/9 and K/BB ratios. He's also a lefty who can throw the ball in the mid 90's, which is rare.

Tim Kirkjian (sp?) on Baseball Tonight made an interesting point the other night. He said that if the Pirates moved Ollie to the closer and had him go exclusively sidearm, he'd be flat-out unhittable. While I can agree with that, I don't want to lose him as a starter, since he has the potential to become the ace the Pirates badly need.

[LetsGoPitt]

Re: Official 2004 Pittsburgh Pirates GameLog/Chat

I think the two players we have in the bullpen that would make the best closer should Mesa be traded are either Salomon Torres or Mike Gonzalez.

Torres can be nasty the first time through the lineup. The only downside to him is that he sometimes loses the plate. The fact that he's pitched so much lately makes me think he could handle the workload.

Gonzalez is an interesting option. Friday's grand slam aside, he's held opponents to about a .150 average and has great K/9 and K/BB ratios. He's also a lefty who can throw the ball in the mid 90's, which is rare.

Tim Kirkjian (sp?) on Baseball Tonight made an interesting point the other night. He said that if the Pirates moved Ollie to the closer and had him go exclusively sidearm, he'd be flat-out unhittable. While I can agree with that, I don't want to lose him as a starter, since he has the potential to become the ace the Pirates badly need.