What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

[glucklich]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

he took the corked bat by mistake, all the bats he used for the homeruns were taken man its not like they just got some bat and said sosa used it, also the translator was there to help him with any words he might now know, its not like the translator was talking for him .

For many people who learn a second language legalese and medical terminology are often the two things that give them the most problems. So yeah, its understandable that hed have someone there for that reason as you alluded to.

[glucklich]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

he took the corked bat by mistake, all the bats he used for the homeruns were taken man its not like they just got some bat and said sosa used it, also the translator was there to help him with any words he might now know, its not like the translator was talking for him .

For many people who learn a second language legalese and medical terminology are often the two things that give them the most problems. So yeah, its understandable that hed have someone there for that reason as you alluded to.

[USCTrojan83]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Bonds and Sosa Stats

Aaron in 23 Seasons hit 755 HRS
AVG = 33 HRS/YR
http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/aaronha01.shtml

Sosa (didnt consider 89-92 because he didnt have over 20 Hrs any of the years)
93-97 AVG HRS = 34
98-01 AVG HRS = 61 (WoW) Maybe he didnt take roids and it was a corked bat all the way!!! LMAO...it was roids
02-04 AVG HRS = 41

Bonds
86-89 = 21
90-94 = 35
95-99 = 37
00-04 = 51
00 and 02-04 = 45

Excluding his 73 HR season in 2001
90-04 = 39 HRS (still more than Aarons career average)

*BONDS/SOSA STATS TAKEN FROM ESPN.COM

Its just hard for me to completely negate the HRS record he will and has broken....I mean the hand eye coordination from a player like him I think is unseen in any other athelte since maybe mantle or williams....I know roids give you that extra boost but going from hitting a ball an extra 15 feet may give a player a couple more HRS a year?

Let me ask you guys. Say Bonds hits/crushes Aarons record and hits 800+ HRS do you still think its illegitimate

[USCTrojan83]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Bonds and Sosa Stats

Aaron in 23 Seasons hit 755 HRS
AVG = 33 HRS/YR
http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/aaronha01.shtml

Sosa (didnt consider 89-92 because he didnt have over 20 Hrs any of the years)
93-97 AVG HRS = 34
98-01 AVG HRS = 61 (WoW) Maybe he didnt take roids and it was a corked bat all the way!!! LMAO...it was roids
02-04 AVG HRS = 41

Bonds
86-89 = 21
90-94 = 35
95-99 = 37
00-04 = 51
00 and 02-04 = 45

Excluding his 73 HR season in 2001
90-04 = 39 HRS (still more than Aarons career average)

*BONDS/SOSA STATS TAKEN FROM ESPN.COM

Its just hard for me to completely negate the HRS record he will and has broken....I mean the hand eye coordination from a player like him I think is unseen in any other athelte since maybe mantle or williams....I know roids give you that extra boost but going from hitting a ball an extra 15 feet may give a player a couple more HRS a year?

Let me ask you guys. Say Bonds hits/crushes Aarons record and hits 800+ HRS do you still think its illegitimate

[Kashanova]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Bonds and Sosa Stats

Aaron in 23 Seasons hit 755 HRS
AVG = 33 HRS/YR
http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/aaronha01.shtml

Sosa (didnt consider 89-92 because he didnt have over 20 Hrs any of the years)
93-97 AVG HRS = 34
98-01 AVG HRS = 61 (WoW) Maybe he didnt take roids and it was a corked bat all the way!!! LMAO...it was roids
02-04 AVG HRS = 41

Bonds
86-89 = 21
90-94 = 35
95-99 = 37
00-04 = 51
00 and 02-04 = 45

Excluding his 73 HR season in 2001
90-04 = 39 HRS (still more than Aarons career average)

*BONDS/SOSA STATS TAKEN FROM ESPN.COM

Its just hard for me to completely negate the HRS record he will and has broken....I mean the hand eye coordination from a player like him I think is unseen in any other athelte since maybe mantle or williams....I know roids give you that extra boost but going from hitting a ball an extra 15 feet may give a player a couple more HRS a year?

Let me ask you guys. Say Bonds hits/crushes Aarons record and hits 800+ HRS do you still think its illegitimate

dont you think players have primes im talkin bout sosa, he hit those homeruns in his prime, thanks for the stats it clearly proves it,

hank aaron the same age sosa had, avg 47.25 almost 50 obviously higher then his avg of his career there isnt a susprise while in ur prime u excel

[Kashanova]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Bonds and Sosa Stats

Aaron in 23 Seasons hit 755 HRS
AVG = 33 HRS/YR
http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/aaronha01.shtml

Sosa (didnt consider 89-92 because he didnt have over 20 Hrs any of the years)
93-97 AVG HRS = 34
98-01 AVG HRS = 61 (WoW) Maybe he didnt take roids and it was a corked bat all the way!!! LMAO...it was roids
02-04 AVG HRS = 41

Bonds
86-89 = 21
90-94 = 35
95-99 = 37
00-04 = 51
00 and 02-04 = 45

Excluding his 73 HR season in 2001
90-04 = 39 HRS (still more than Aarons career average)

*BONDS/SOSA STATS TAKEN FROM ESPN.COM

Its just hard for me to completely negate the HRS record he will and has broken....I mean the hand eye coordination from a player like him I think is unseen in any other athelte since maybe mantle or williams....I know roids give you that extra boost but going from hitting a ball an extra 15 feet may give a player a couple more HRS a year?

Let me ask you guys. Say Bonds hits/crushes Aarons record and hits 800+ HRS do you still think its illegitimate

dont you think players have primes im talkin bout sosa, he hit those homeruns in his prime, thanks for the stats it clearly proves it,

hank aaron the same age sosa had, avg 47.25 almost 50 obviously higher then his avg of his career there isnt a susprise while in ur prime u excel

[SPTO]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Here's a pic of Sosa with the Rangers. Now I've seen some other pics of him with the Rangers where he looked like a stick but this pic makes it concievable that he bulked up through legit means (probably HGH which wasn't illegal back then?)

[SPTO]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Here's a pic of Sosa with the Rangers. Now I've seen some other pics of him with the Rangers where he looked like a stick but this pic makes it concievable that he bulked up through legit means (probably HGH which wasn't illegal back then?)

[Pared]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Bonds and Sosa Stats

Aaron in 23 Seasons hit 755 HRS
AVG = 33 HRS/YR
http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/aaronha01.shtml

Sosa (didnt consider 89-92 because he didnt have over 20 Hrs any of the years)
93-97 AVG HRS = 34
98-01 AVG HRS = 61 (WoW) Maybe he didnt take roids and it was a corked bat all the way!!! LMAO...it was roids
02-04 AVG HRS = 41

Bonds
86-89 = 21
90-94 = 35
95-99 = 37
00-04 = 51
00 and 02-04 = 45

Excluding his 73 HR season in 2001
90-04 = 39 HRS (still more than Aarons career average)

*BONDS/SOSA STATS TAKEN FROM ESPN.COM

Its just hard for me to completely negate the HRS record he will and has broken....I mean the hand eye coordination from a player like him I think is unseen in any other athelte since maybe mantle or williams....I know roids give you that extra boost but going from hitting a ball an extra 15 feet may give a player a couple more HRS a year?

Let me ask you guys. Say Bonds hits/crushes Aarons record and hits 800+ HRS do you still think its illegitimate

Hand eye coordination is def. key... look at Tony Gwynn! The key is POWER.. and the stats show that Bonds' power increased in 00-05 by an average of 20 more HR's... you can't "ignore" his freak season, b/c it happened. But Steroids increases individual power, and this combined with his AGE (something you keep ignoring) are factors as well.

No one "ignores" Williams' .406 BA when compiling his stats.

[Pared]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Bonds and Sosa Stats

Aaron in 23 Seasons hit 755 HRS
AVG = 33 HRS/YR
http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/aaronha01.shtml

Sosa (didnt consider 89-92 because he didnt have over 20 Hrs any of the years)
93-97 AVG HRS = 34
98-01 AVG HRS = 61 (WoW) Maybe he didnt take roids and it was a corked bat all the way!!! LMAO...it was roids
02-04 AVG HRS = 41

Bonds
86-89 = 21
90-94 = 35
95-99 = 37
00-04 = 51
00 and 02-04 = 45

Excluding his 73 HR season in 2001
90-04 = 39 HRS (still more than Aarons career average)

*BONDS/SOSA STATS TAKEN FROM ESPN.COM

Its just hard for me to completely negate the HRS record he will and has broken....I mean the hand eye coordination from a player like him I think is unseen in any other athelte since maybe mantle or williams....I know roids give you that extra boost but going from hitting a ball an extra 15 feet may give a player a couple more HRS a year?

Let me ask you guys. Say Bonds hits/crushes Aarons record and hits 800+ HRS do you still think its illegitimate

Hand eye coordination is def. key... look at Tony Gwynn! The key is POWER.. and the stats show that Bonds' power increased in 00-05 by an average of 20 more HR's... you can't "ignore" his freak season, b/c it happened. But Steroids increases individual power, and this combined with his AGE (something you keep ignoring) are factors as well.

No one "ignores" Williams' .406 BA when compiling his stats.

[USCTrojan83]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

You know what though, neither have you... where have all these names you mention ever had any sort of suspicion of drug use? Performance-enhancing drug use? You mention Griffey... well, imagine what he would be hitting if he WERE on Steroids....?

Bonds did not start averaging OVER 40 HR's until 2000, around the time many believe all this started. You're right how a player can have a freak season... but look at your examples! Williams? A career .344 hitter? Maris? Who never hit over 39 HR's but hit 61 in his FIFTH season? You're arguing an individual all off a sudden, in their late thirties-early forties, has a HUGE upslide in their HR output, never hitting less than 45 in a season (again in the last 5 years), is doing so naturally? Barring the 73 HR season, you can honestly sit there, with a straight face and argue this? The facts?

Bonds HR avg his first 14 yrs: 31.78
In the last 5 years: 51.6

And this, all from (again) an aging player where at the same age, others are contemplating retirement..? An increase of 20 HR's A SEASON, when prior to these 5 seasons, he's never seen more than 46 HR's?

You've made a lot of great arguments in this thread, but you're seriously delusional here. It's not a shock you're from Cali, either...

Pared if you would read maybe 10 pages back this discussion has been ongoing...I would suggest reading back a little to the beginning and maybe you would have a greater knowledge to the discussion between us...

1st What does Cali have to do with the fact of anything...Im not even a Bonds Guy...I hate the Giants...(Not a dodger guy either) Padre and Angel fan

2nd) The reason I bring up griffey is becuase he was well on his way to breaking aarons record without the use of roids showing the fact there is the possiblility of the record being broken...The other names I bring up had huge years maris 61 HRS...willians .409 AVG year... he called bonds 73 HRS all based on roids which it is not....Many players over the years have had random years with great stats where that type of production wasnt seen...IE maris AVG 39hrs a yr and then hits 61...

Might i remind you BONDS hit 46 HRS in 1993 so I dont think its not possible to do it again in the late 2000's...I think bonds is on roids but i dont think a significant # of HRS were the cause of his roid usage...the guy is a beast and was a great hitter before the steroid controversy...OCE again Pared im nopt arguing the usuage of roids ...

This entire discussion between him and I were because I was arguing in my first ost that there are a lot more to do with increase in hrs IN GENERAL that roid usage
1) smaller parks
2) better fitness (supplements, workouts are taken more seriousl because in the 50-60's working out was somewhat taboo based on the assumed notion that working out would slow you down ie, running and bat speed....
3) Pitching is watered down
4) there were others in my previous posts

Im not delusional but seriously Pared...look back in this thread and read some of the stuff...

My main arguement is NOT THAT bonds didnt take steroids...Im pretty sure he did....But IMO i wont look back and say he tainted the game just based on the fact that he was one of the greatest players iver ever SEEN play roids or not....His hand eye coordination even at his age now is still amazing...Roids do not increase hand eye coordination...strength and possibly bat speed yes not hand eye coordination

My other arguement was that HR increased across the board were due to the above things 1-4 yada yada....please keep that in mind....

I know there are a lot of wild tangets but thats what ive been saying maybe not so clear at times so sory to those of you reading most of it

[USCTrojan83]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

You know what though, neither have you... where have all these names you mention ever had any sort of suspicion of drug use? Performance-enhancing drug use? You mention Griffey... well, imagine what he would be hitting if he WERE on Steroids....?

Bonds did not start averaging OVER 40 HR's until 2000, around the time many believe all this started. You're right how a player can have a freak season... but look at your examples! Williams? A career .344 hitter? Maris? Who never hit over 39 HR's but hit 61 in his FIFTH season? You're arguing an individual all off a sudden, in their late thirties-early forties, has a HUGE upslide in their HR output, never hitting less than 45 in a season (again in the last 5 years), is doing so naturally? Barring the 73 HR season, you can honestly sit there, with a straight face and argue this? The facts?

Bonds HR avg his first 14 yrs: 31.78
In the last 5 years: 51.6

And this, all from (again) an aging player where at the same age, others are contemplating retirement..? An increase of 20 HR's A SEASON, when prior to these 5 seasons, he's never seen more than 46 HR's?

You've made a lot of great arguments in this thread, but you're seriously delusional here. It's not a shock you're from Cali, either...

Pared if you would read maybe 10 pages back this discussion has been ongoing...I would suggest reading back a little to the beginning and maybe you would have a greater knowledge to the discussion between us...

1st What does Cali have to do with the fact of anything...Im not even a Bonds Guy...I hate the Giants...(Not a dodger guy either) Padre and Angel fan

2nd) The reason I bring up griffey is becuase he was well on his way to breaking aarons record without the use of roids showing the fact there is the possiblility of the record being broken...The other names I bring up had huge years maris 61 HRS...willians .409 AVG year... he called bonds 73 HRS all based on roids which it is not....Many players over the years have had random years with great stats where that type of production wasnt seen...IE maris AVG 39hrs a yr and then hits 61...

Might i remind you BONDS hit 46 HRS in 1993 so I dont think its not possible to do it again in the late 2000's...I think bonds is on roids but i dont think a significant # of HRS were the cause of his roid usage...the guy is a beast and was a great hitter before the steroid controversy...OCE again Pared im nopt arguing the usuage of roids ...

This entire discussion between him and I were because I was arguing in my first ost that there are a lot more to do with increase in hrs IN GENERAL that roid usage
1) smaller parks
2) better fitness (supplements, workouts are taken more seriousl because in the 50-60's working out was somewhat taboo based on the assumed notion that working out would slow you down ie, running and bat speed....
3) Pitching is watered down
4) there were others in my previous posts

Im not delusional but seriously Pared...look back in this thread and read some of the stuff...

My main arguement is NOT THAT bonds didnt take steroids...Im pretty sure he did....But IMO i wont look back and say he tainted the game just based on the fact that he was one of the greatest players iver ever SEEN play roids or not....His hand eye coordination even at his age now is still amazing...Roids do not increase hand eye coordination...strength and possibly bat speed yes not hand eye coordination

My other arguement was that HR increased across the board were due to the above things 1-4 yada yada....please keep that in mind....

I know there are a lot of wild tangets but thats what ive been saying maybe not so clear at times so sory to those of you reading most of it

[Pared]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Oh, and yes, others have said it as well as published reports... Many believe when (not if) he breaks Aaron's record it will be another stain on one of the most cherished records in MLB.

Aaron holds the record while having a steady DECLINE in stats... that's saying something, especially compared to (ugh) Bonds.

I was never a Bond *****, but all I have to go by are what I've researched and their stats... and they don't favor Bonds in light of the allegations.

[Pared]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Oh, and yes, others have said it as well as published reports... Many believe when (not if) he breaks Aaron's record it will be another stain on one of the most cherished records in MLB.

Aaron holds the record while having a steady DECLINE in stats... that's saying something, especially compared to (ugh) Bonds.

I was never a Bond *****, but all I have to go by are what I've researched and their stats... and they don't favor Bonds in light of the allegations.

[USCTrojan83]

Re: What is your take on the Congress and MLB?

Hand eye coordination is def. key... look at Tony Gwynn! The key is POWER.. and the stats show that Bonds' power increased in 00-05 by an average of 20 more HR's... you can't "ignore" his freak season, b/c it happened. But Steroids increases individual power, and this combined with his AGE (something you keep ignoring) are factors as well.

No one "ignores" Williams' .406 BA when compiling his stats.

I agree they dont...but the fact is pared you still have to see the ball hit the ball peroid....and if you want to say that Bonds needed the extra strength for the 20 HRS and steroids give an increase of 20HRS then that is ludicrous...studies have shown 10-15 feet maybe gained in useing steroids...(ESPN article few months back) I would agree 7-10 HRS but 20 i cant....

Im not ignoring age...i know hes 40+...you decline when skills decline...right? Age is only a number in which we justify why guys stats decline....the real reason is because their skills diminish in part sue to old age and the body wearing down....IMO