2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

[kjtrippe]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

B.J. has to play better next season, if not then he needs to go. Maybe hold off on Bethancourt til after the all star break, unless he's needed before then. The Braves need someone who can just get on base at 2B. I'm a little open minded about the David Price signing cause I don't believe they'll do it

[DonkeyJote]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

I don't know if he is, but man, I DO NOT want Arroyo. Derek Lowe 2.0 for us IMO.

Now, I am reading that the Braves are going to make inquiries into what it would take to get David Price from the Rays. I have no idea what that would cost us, but I would LOVE it ONLY if we could sign him long term.

IMO, the Braves really do need a top of the line starter. Minor, Medlen, and Teheran (at this point anyway) are really #2's who can be a #1 on a given day. We need that guy that other teams are afraid to face and we just don't have that right now.

And all 3 had better ERA's and WAR than Price this season.

Medlen isn't a #2 that can be a #1 on a given day. He's a #1 who will occasionally have bad starts. He's dominant more often than not. IF you take out three consecutive starts in July, dude has a 2.66 era this year. After having a 1.57 last year. He has a 2.95 era for his career. There aren't too many guys with sub-3.00 career ERA's. In fact, among those with 1000 career innings, there are two: Mariano Rivera and Clayton Kershaw. To be fair, he doesn't have the best postseason track record so far, but he's also only had two starts.

I thought it was pretty obvious Minor got tired at the end of the year. Career high in innings and all that. But he turned in a very good performance against the Dodgers. And he's only 25 years old, and had a 3.21 era this year after a 2.16 post all-star break last year. Over the last 15 months, he has a 2.90 era.

Teheran started off shaky, and then got tired late. Both to be expected of a 22 year old. Now in his second season, I'd expect more of what he did May-August, which was have a 2.57 ERA.

Price has a career 3.19 ERA, including 3.33 last year. His postseason prowess has been greatly exaggerated as well, as he has posted a 5.81 career playoff era as a starter. There isn't any one of the four between Medlen, Minor, Teheran, or Beachy that I'd trade straight up for Price. So you could very well be giving up a good prospect for your fifth starter. Who would also be older than your other 4 starters. I'd rather just resign Hudson or Garcia.

[Sportsforever]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

And all 3 had better ERA's and WAR than Price this season.

Medlen isn't a #2 that can be a #1 on a given day. He's a #1 who will occasionally have bad starts. He's dominant more often than not. IF you take out three consecutive starts in July, dude has a 2.66 era this year. After having a 1.57 last year. He has a 2.95 era for his career. There aren't too many guys with sub-3.00 career ERA's. In fact, among those with 1000 career innings, there are two: Mariano Rivera and Clayton Kershaw. To be fair, he doesn't have the best postseason track record so far, but he's also only had two starts.

I thought it was pretty obvious Minor got tired at the end of the year. Career high in innings and all that. But he turned in a very good performance against the Dodgers. And he's only 25 years old, and had a 3.21 era this year after a 2.16 post all-star break last year. Over the last 15 months, he has a 2.90 era.

Teheran started off shaky, and then got tired late. Both to be expected of a 22 year old. Now in his second season, I'd expect more of what he did May-August, which was have a 2.57 ERA.

Price has a career 3.19 ERA, including 3.33 last year. His postseason prowess has been greatly exaggerated as well, as he has posted a 5.81 career playoff era as a starter. There isn't any one of the four between Medlen, Minor, Teheran, or Beachy that I'd trade straight up for Price. So you could very well be giving up a good prospect for your fifth starter. Who would also be older than your other 4 starters. I'd rather just resign Hudson or Garcia.

I agree that Price isn't a Verlander/Kershaw type starter, but I can't agree about Medlen/Minor/Teheran being #1's.

First off, Price's stats are being put up in the AL playing in the AL East. He faces the Red Sox/Yankees/Orioles (12 of his 27 starts this year) a lot every year and faces a lineup with the DH every night. You can't compare ERA's or rate stats directly to Medlen/Minor fairly IMO.

Now, Medlen/Minor are very good and both are getting better. Heck, Medlen started 1-6 (with tough luck) and then went 14-6 after that. We know he's a good pitcher. What I'm talking about is a pitcher that the other team knows they are in trouble when they face them in a playoff game. Neither Medlen or Minor give you that.

Furthermore, we don't have one guy who can give you a complete game. The Braves had ONE all year (and Minor only went 8 innings in that one since he lost) while Price led the AL in CG's. Now, I know part of that is having a great pen with Kimbrel, but honestly, our guys just can't go deep into games on most nights. Medlen only pitched into the 8th in his last start and Minor only did it once.

Is David Price the be all/end all of starting pitchers? No, but he would most certainly bring more value than any pitcher we have in our rotation right now. The caveat I'll give to that is that Teheran very well could blossom into a legitimate #1, but he's a few years away IMO.

[DonkeyJote]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

B.J. has to play better next season, if not then he needs to go. Maybe hold off on Bethancourt til after the all star break, unless he's needed before then. The Braves need someone who can just get on base at 2B. I'm a little open minded about the David Price signing cause I don't believe they'll do it

I just don't see how they can unload him. I'd almost rather give him another shot than eat that contract. And he was still a top-10 second baseman just last year. Is he worth the money? Absolutely not. And Altuve is terrible. Dude had a .316 obp last year; Uggla had .309, and that was the worst of his career. Money not being an object (which is really isn't, because we're paying Uggla whether he plays or not), I'd rather take my chances on Uggla, whose worse career season is comparable to Altuve's average.

[kjtrippe]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

I just don't see how they can unload him. I'd almost rather give him another shot than eat that contract. And he was still a top-10 second baseman just last year. Is he worth the money? Absolutely not. And Altuve is terrible. Dude had a .316 obp last year; Uggla had .309, and that was the worst of his career. Money not being an object (which is really isn't, because we're paying Uggla whether he plays or not), I'd rather take my chances on Uggla, whose worse career season is comparable to Altuve's average.

The best scenario for Uggla is to get with a hitting coach and stop swinging for the fences so many times. He's a disciplined hitter that always guesses fastball it seems

[DonkeyJote]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

I agree that Price isn't a Verlander/Kershaw type starter, but I can't agree about Medlen/Minor/Teheran being #1's.

First off, Price's stats are being put up in the AL playing in the AL East. He faces the Red Sox/Yankees/Orioles (12 of his 27 starts this year) a lot every year and faces a lineup with the DH every night. You can't compare ERA's or rate stats directly to Medlen/Minor fairly IMO.

But you can compare WAR. And Medlen/Minor/Teheran all had a higher WAR than Price this season.

Now, Medlen/Minor are very good and both are getting better. Heck, Medlen started 1-6 (with tough luck) and then went 14-6 after that. We know he's a good pitcher. What I'm talking about is a pitcher that the other team knows they are in trouble when they face them in a playoff game. Neither Medlen or Minor give you that.

And Price does? As a starter, he's 0-4 with a 5.81 ERA in the playoffs. That's bad.

Furthermore, we don't have one guy who can give you a complete game. The Braves had ONE all year (and Minor only went 8 innings in that one since he lost) while Price led the AL in CG's. Now, I know part of that is having a great pen with Kimbrel, but honestly, our guys just can't go deep into games on most nights. Medlen only pitched into the 8th in his last start and Minor only did it once.

While I think that's an okay point, I'll say there's a variety of factors at play here. One is Freddie's philosophy. He likes to lean on his bullpen. He figures "why leave my starter out there when I have Avilan, Carpenter, and Kimbrel in the pen all with crazy low ERA's?" I get that (though I think he relies on it too much sometimes). Especially in the playoffs. Medlen is never going to give you big innings. But Minor and Teheran both gave career high performances in innings this year. They'll both be held back a little less next year.

Is David Price the be all/end all of starting pitchers? No, but he would most certainly bring more value than any pitcher we have in our rotation right now. The caveat I'll give to that is that Teheran very well could blossom into a legitimate #1, but he's a few years away IMO.

Price is also 28. In a vacuum would I want Price? Sure. He's a good pitcher. But it isn't a vacuum. Minor is 25 and had a 3.21 era this season. Teheran is 22 and had a 3.20 era. And Price will be entering his age 29 season. Which is when you generally begin to see the decline in a starter's production (which we already see, as his fastball velocity went down 2 mph this season from last). I'd still trust one of those guys to have a stronger year than Price. Medlen will have a good year too, but will never give you a ton of innings. But I don't want a 28 year-old pitcher on a 1 year, $13 million deal, and I certainly don't want to give up prospects for him. And I will never get on board giving a starting pitcher at that age any kind of significant long term deal.

This team, as constructed, is good enough to make the playoffs. We know that because they did, and they have 3 of the last 4 years. The next step is winning in the playoffs. And a $13 million pitcher with a career 5.81 era as a starter in the playoffs doesn't help that goal one tiny bit.

[kjtrippe]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

Andrelton Simmons won his first Gold Glove award. First of many, many more in his career.

[kjtrippe]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

I'm starting to only want the Braves to only sign McCann for trade bait. If he even take the QO.

[LowerWolf]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

No way he takes the QO. He'll get more money for multiple years on the open market.

I hope he goes to an AL team other than the Yankees or Red Sox so I can still root for him.

[kjtrippe]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

No way he takes the QO. He'll get more money for multiple years on the open market.

I hope he goes to an AL team other than the Yankees or Red Sox so I can still root for him.

It seems like him signing to the Rangers is a giving. But oh well, I just want fresh young faces in the lineup. Bethancourt may not be ready but I see him developing into a huge rbi guy and gold glover

[TheMatrix31]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

As long as he doesn't go to Boston.

[aukevin]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

It's going to be sad to change my Hudson avatar after all these years if he doesn't resign. I've had a Hudson avatar in some fashion for a long time. The day he signed with Atlanta was one of my favorite days in baseball. I got to see him play in college, in the minors, and then again when he came to Atlanta.

[TheMatrix31]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

Well, we traded for Huddy. But yeah, I remember where I was when I heard the news about the trade. Love Huddy. One of my favorite athletes ever.

[thefakeJTS]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

I don't know about you guys, but I wouldn't mind seeing Kimbrel traded for a pretty big return. There is no way that we're going to resign him when he's a free agent. We might as well sell high on him.

[kjtrippe]

Re: 2013 Atlanta Braves Thread

I don't know about you guys, but I wouldn't mind seeing Kimbrel traded for a pretty big return. There is no way that we're going to resign him when he's a free agent. We might as well sell high on him.

Until that day, how bout no. Good point though.