**The Official New York Yankees Thread**

[DamnYanks2]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

Was just coming back to edit my post a bit since I figured maybe I was being a bit harsh saying they should just release him but they should definately at least stick him in the bullpen next year assuming he will still be playing. Maybe he would be better coming of the pen for an inning or two at this point. Seems like the Yankees refuse to put him in the bullpen though.

No I don't like the idea of C.C coming out of the pen. Unfortunately, it's just gonna be a tough year to improve pitching wise, unless they trade a glut of prospects for a starting pitcher, or get one of the garbage pitchers in free agency.

I don't wanna give up on Sev but I think it's best to just put him in the pen for a while, he's had limited success, but he has much better stuff then Shreve, or Swarzak.

You know it's sad when R.A Dickey and Doug Fister are some of the best names available next year.

I could see next year's rotation looking like this.

Tanaka
Pineda
Sabathia
(Insert fa innings eater)
Green

Mitchell will get opportunities, Enns. And I could see Warren get a few looks at sp.

Yep it looks ugly.

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[CMH]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

They should eat Sabathia's last year. He's done less for this team than Alex but they'll probably invite CC to old timers day next spring.

He's a bum. Always hated that contract though I won't ignore we got a couple good years out of it. Mostly 2009 is the only reason that spending spree is forgiven. If you really look at it, it was a giant pile of crap.

The 2014 spree isn't looking any better.

[DieHardYankee26]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

hesalsodonemuchlessdamagetotheteamandtothegameofba seballandtothelivesofcountlesschildrenacrossameric aandtheworld

If I'm understanding his deal right though, we have a buyout for 5 million. So just write the man a check and tell him thanks.

[CMH]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

hesalsodonemuchlessdamagetotheteamandtothegameofba seballandtothelivesofcountlesschildrenacrossameric aandtheworld

If I'm understanding his deal right though, we have a buyout for 5 million. So just write the man a check and tell him thanks.

LOL. Yes please.

[DamnYanks2]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

They should eat Sabathia's last year. He's done less for this team than Alex but they'll probably invite CC to old timers day next spring.

He's a bum. Always hated that contract though I won't ignore we got a couple good years out of it. Mostly 2009 is the only reason that spending spree is forgiven. If you really look at it, it was a giant pile of crap.

The 2014 spree isn't looking any better.

I think Sabathia was well worth his contract, nobody can live up to these massive contracts completely, you knew he would fall off at some point.

But, in a age where pitchers just don't last very long, and fall off quickly, Sabathia did the opposite, he logged over 200 innings in his first five seasons in the bronx, was a 19 game winner twice, and had a 21 win campaign, and had an era under 4 his first 4 seasons, and was a huge, huge performer in The 2009 title chase.

He's aged now, lost his velocity, and dealt with alchoholism, but he gave us some damn good years.

It's almost impossible to find a workhorse like C.C anymore, I think he earned that check.



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[DieHardYankee26]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

09 is much easier to justify.

14 is a ****ing mess. 09 was basically 3 for 3, we got exactly what we paid for, if only for a few seasons before declines and injuries. 14 is 2 for 4 at best IMO. Ellsbury deal is terrible (we're on the hook for 5 more years at 21 mil, his production was immediately down from the prior year which was unsustainable from the beginning, worth 4 WAR in year 1, no reason to think he'll even break 2 for the rest of the deal). There's no justification for that deal. Just none. Not that signing Cano for 10 years would've been better, but just wow.

McCann is a swing and a miss as well, though not nearly as bad. He can help Gary learn the ropes and whatnot, but that's a ton of money for a DH that may or may not be a positive at the plate. Hes got another 2 guaranteed years and then an option year which vests based on playing time, so that should be dead. "90 games caught in 2018" is out of the question, he won't even get that many next year with Gary up.

Tanaka is an ace, I was going to say this deal was a success but looking further I may have to say this was a fail as well, he's got an opt out after next season. So he'll take that and either get us or somebody else for anotber long term deal and call it a day. I'm so sick of these opt outs (A-Rod, CC, this). If we offer 100+ mil and that's not enough, go somewhere else. Beltran stayed an elite hitter.

Honestly you could argue none of these moves were smart as none of them actually put us on a much different level, other than Tanaka.

Random other stuff, on A-Rod's role going forward, Hal said him signing with another team next year doesn't preclude him being an advisor, he could do both. Then thinking about it, we have a AA team in Tampa right now with 2 middle infield prospects that we hope are the future of our organization. If only there were a couple of Yankee legends with experience up the middle who live in Florida... This could really be great.

I'll just never like Hal. Just the way he talks, he's such a suit. "Our fans want marquee players" No, YOU want marquee players, we just want good ones. We don't give a **** if their name soundsg good on YES in front of "... And the Yankees", we just want guys that can play. And A-Rod needs to be on YES, get rid of Ken Singleton, can't stand him.

[DamnYanks2]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

Ellsbury was a disaster deal, Ellsbury has been absolutely worthless.

Ellsbury has just fallen off year after year, I'm still amazed that this guy hit 32 HR's in Boston.

McCann's been solid, not worth that contract, but solid. They probably could have gone the cheaper route, and signed Russel Martin, but whatever.

Arod I'm 50/50 on, production wise during the season, he delivered, but with mediocre playoff numbers, and his steroid use, among other things, I wish they just let him opt out. Of course maybe we don't win in 09, arod's legacy in NYY is a double
edged sword.

Tanaka was worth every penny in my eyes, he falls in line with C.C.
He's given the Yanks three years of ace level pitching, his arm might fall off at any time, but you have to overpay for great pitchers.

You tell me there's another Tanaka out there, I'd say sign him to a long drawn out contract right now. These guys are too rare.



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[DieHardYankee26]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

If he dips out next year and signs with another team on an 8 year deal, nothing he did with us matters is my point. His deal basically can't be evaluated until we see how that pans out, he can just leave.

For the record, I wasn't saying anything about A-Rod's deal other than the fact that putting an opt out in gives the player a bonus while putting the team at a disadvantage, A-Rod's first deal is probably the most worth it in the history of sports among big contracts, up with Pujols first extension. It's the opt-out and subsequent resigning for the same contract 8 years later that screwed us.

[DamnYanks2]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

Nah, I wasn't criticizing you Diehard, I was just adding that I'm actually ok with most of the signings other then Ellsbury, that was stupid.

Looking back now, Yankees should have just signed Cano to a monster contract. Sure it will probably be a albatross nearing the end. But without even looking at the numbers. I imagine Cano, has been worth more then McCann and Ellsbury combined. Plus we would have gotten to see one of the sweetest swings in baseball for years to come, I miss that kind of production.



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[DieHardYankee26]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

I guess this comes back to Cashman criticism (or maybe Hal told him go get some guys I don't know) but basically Tanaka was the only contract that made sense, even at the time. We missed the playoffs in 2013, and our answer was sign an old Of to a 3 year deal, a leaving his prime catcher to a 5 year deal, an injury prone outfielder to an 8 year deal... Just why? None of those moves were going to put us over the top, we need to stop signing guys just so we can have some "stars" on the team. Cano, at least was a Yankee, I agreed with not giving a 31 or so year old second baseman a 10 year deal... but not when the alternative is signing an outfielder who has never been as good, the same age, injury prone, and already declining to a long term deal, just doesn't make sense. Hopefully being forced to build from within will make them a little more cautious with their money. Like CMH said, the 09 championship was amazing (and to me worth it ot) but we're still paying dudes off now, then they cut our left leg off and tried to put a band aid on it. Need to be much more forward thinking going forward.
Having said that, I'm torn on trading our prospects for a pitcher. It would depend heavily on the deal both ways and who it is, but free agency is rough, we don't have guys in our system ready to come up, and we do have somewhat of a surplus of prospects. I'm very interested to see what the plan to bring our rotation back to life is. I wouldn't be surprised if they keep CC to eat innings and give Tanaka whatever he wants. He's going to have us over a barrel next year, ace pitcher hitting free agency and our second best pitcher will be who? Pineda?

[Rocket32]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

Nah, I wasn't criticizing you Diehard, I was just adding that I'm actually ok with most of the signings other then Ellsbury, that was stupid.

Looking back now, Yankees should have just signed Cano to a monster contract. Sure it will probably be a albatross nearing the end. But without even looking at the numbers. I imagine Cano, has been worth more then McCann and Ellsbury combined. Plus we would have gotten to see one of the sweetest swings in baseball for years to come, I miss that kind of production.



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I agree. They should have passed on on Ellsbury and McCann and just given Cano what he wanted. I'll never understand why they gave a huge contract with 7 years on it to a guy who's biggest asset is arguably speed, espeacilly an injury prone guy. Even though it's unlikely Cano will still be out there manning 2B in the final years of his deal with Seattle I'm willing to bet he ages better then Ellsbury does. Plus Cano would probaly perform better in his later years even if only slightly better in his later years in Yankee Stadium too. I would prefer to still have Cano around right now and for years to come then Ellsbury and McCann. McCann's deal isn't too bad years wise but it's still big money. I would have been fine with them letting Cano walk because they were trying to avoid big long contracts but then they go sign Ellsbury and McCann? Makes no sense.

[DamnYanks2]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

That was the biggest mistake the Yankees made. Either you give the guy whatever he wants. Or, you trade him for valuable assets. Yankees sat on their thumbs, and botched the whole thing. I don't know if it was on Cash, or Hal. But yea, that royally pissed me off when I look back at it.

We knew what the back end of those contracts were gonna look like, we sacrificed the future for that title, that's the way it is. Yankees had a garbage farm
system, and the few guys that were highly touted didn't pan out.

Plus, the Yankees didn't want to pay top dollar for Yoan Moncada, which will probably hurt down the line, maybe less significantly now, because we have Mateo and Torres, but still you have to get that done.

So, Ellsbury,Moncada, weak development, and The Robby Cano situation were all terrible blunders.

Hopefully Hal, and Cash have learned that. It looks that way, but I don't think it's wrong to be disappointed in the overall leadership.

Everybody makes mistakes, but those were some terrible decisions, and really handicapped this team, and we should expect more.



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[DamnYanks2]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

All things considered, all we can do is move on though. When you look at all the major contracts coming off the books before 2018, the farm system (arguably the best in baseball), and the monster 2018 free agent class, it's really a perfect storm for the Yankees.

Obviously not every prospect is going to pan out, but you know alot of these guys will at the least will give us some productive years.

The key theme for 2017 will be patience. At least it will be fun to watch the kids develop.


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[DieHardYankee26]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

I really hope there's a highly regarded college pitcher available wherever we draft next year, we need guys in the rotation in our system in the worst way.

[DamnYanks2]

Re: **The Official New York Yankees Thread**

I really hope there's a highly regarded college pitcher available wherever we draft next year, we need guys in the rotation in our system in the worst way.

It's getting better Enns and Sheffield have been turning heads. Kap stays healthy, he's obviously a very possible future starter for the Yankees.

Enns keeps dominating we could see him next year, he's been lights out so far. And he's in AAA now.

I'm not against trading some prospects for a good pitcher if it can be done. Depends who of course.

But I think Cash has a plan, and sooner or later a Yankee pitching prospect is gonna pan out lol.

So it's coming along

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