Offensive rebounding

[iceberg0982]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Majority of all my losses have been the result of Off rebounds.

Online Match
Bulls vs Bucks(me)
I lost with 18 second chance points given up. 14 Off rebounds resulted to that.

MyTeam
Lets just say, I had 1 rebound with 2mins left in the 2nd quarter.
I got them to miss, but they got to the ball higher and faster than my guys with the POE set to Crash Def Rebounds.

And the key defensive stops you get is all eliminated when there team gets the OFF rebounds and you're yelling at the screen saying to yourself.....
REBOUND DA BALLLLLL!!!!!!!!

I'm still adjusting to 2k15. The game hasn't slowed down for me yet to really see whats going on but what I do see is that the CPU has the advantage all the time. You literally have to shove ppl in the paint to grab those boards.

[2_headedmonster]

Re: Offensive rebounding

i think its a matter of boxing out because i play the center on defense, box out and have no problem.

if a persons cpu teammates aren't boxing out, i could see where there could be a problem.

[Oldhead80]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Every missed shot seems like a battle. Feels organic and fair. I would hate to see it changed or significantly tweeked. Don't do too much to this Czar...I like the fact I can be punished on the glass for being out of position going for blocks or giving help. I like that put-backs in traffic aren't automatic. I'm playing on Superstar/Sim and this is the best experience I've ever had playing 2k b-ball from a rebounding standpoint.

[Klayups]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Peace Big Czar,

Im playing on SS/Sim

I think the offensive rebounding is OK actually. Just a lot of the times (in real life) players don't always go back up after getting offensive rebounds they usually kick it out. So in the game it becomes kind of frustrating losing an offensive board and then conceding two points, immediately right after.

The rebounding battles feel fair, especially with respect to who is grabbing them over who, it's just usually my defensive players are out of position afterwards and its always two points.

I think sliders can fix it, but thats my overall beef.

[Klayups]

Re: Offensive rebounding

I will also say this about Offensive rebounding.

There are never any Long offensive rebounds. They are always gathered right AT the rim and I think this may be the root cause.

[Real2KInsider]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Czar I'm sure we have discussed this before.

One of the biggest problem with offensive rebounds pertains to rim physics.

Shots do not miss realistically. Threes don't lead to long rebounds. The reason 3pt cheesing has been so successful over the years isn't just that players were draining unrealistic shots but they weren't being penalized for doing so - in fact they were benefitting from it. Since rebounds don't go long, 3pt spammers don't have to deal with fastbreaks, and they get plenty of high percentage offensive rebounds down low because the defensive breakdowns leading to that 3pt shot likewise destroyed any semblance of box balance. Further, it seems like teams are helpless after ORBs to do anything except give up an uncontested shot (players with the highest ORB ratings also have the highest Standing Dunk ratings).


FWIW it does not seem like the rebound ratings are a problem this year, they were slightly unbalanced in favor of ORBs last season but it seems fair now. I don't know enough about 2K15 to say if athleticism ratings (new or otherwise) are a significant factor, this is just what I observed over 3 games.

Average reb rate by pos Off/Def
PG: 42/42
SG: 44/42
SF: 57/61
PF: 75/78
C: 82/81

[Real2KInsider]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Just remembered one more factor - The Badges System

Last year we only had one tier, this year we have three tiers which has lead to tons of players getting badges. I'll go down the list but I'm sure there are a ton more players with some level of "Tenacious Rebounder" and "Hustle Points" than there were last year.

Hustle Points - Adept at making shots immediately following offensive rebounds near the basket.
GOLD - John Henson, Joakim Noah, Tristan Thompson
SILVER - Ersan Ilyasova, Jabari Parker, Kevin Love, Anderson Varejao
BRONZE - Nerlens Noel, Henry Sims, Larry Sanders, Taj Gibson, Shawn Marion, Shane Edwards

Tenacious Rebounder - Will most often win boxout battles and can more easily knock the ball loose from opposing rebounders.
GOLD - Joakim Noah, Taj Gibson, Kevin Love, Tristan Thompson, Anderson Varejao
SILVER - Larry Sanders
BRONZE - Nerlens Noel

This is just four teams in.

It seems very likely to me that this abundance of badges is breaking the game more than ever. The ratings might be balanced but when you give half the bigs in the league these skills/badges it destroys that.

This is obviously a very difficult problem as 2K is obviously very invested in this badge system and also took great lengths to fix their rosters and ratings. Yet their ambitions here are seemingly canceling out their efforts.

Ratings make the game balanced, badges make the game arcadey yet are surely in high demand. I'm not saying they should go away (in fact I happen to like them quite a bit), and it's still early, but this is probably a situation where "more" is not "better".

(I should note that I haven't observed any issues w/ other badges, but in this case it magnifies an existing problem).

[MikeGSW]

Re: Offensive rebounding

I haven't seen any "balance" issues with the rebounding in terms of the opponent getting more or whatever.

What I have noticed though is the opponent nearly always makes their put backs.

Playing on All star/sim and superstar/sim

[Boilerbuzz]

Offensive rebounding

These are my stats over the past 5 games using the Spurs on Superstar\Sim



Played 5 games in a row with my Spurs, made sure to make sure of my rebounding totals



Superstar\Sim



vs. Cavaliers

Spurs: 41 (13 offensive)

Cavaliers: 40 (11 offensive) almost all K. Love, lol



vs. Pelicans

Spurs: 44 (12 offensive)

Pelicans: 39 (13 offensive)



vs. Bulls

Spurs: 41 (13 offensive)

Bulls: 46 (14 offensive)



vs. Rockets

Spurs: 43 (12 offensive)

Rockets: 36 (9 offensive)



vs. Pistons

Spurs: 42 (13 offensive)

Pistons: 45 (12 offensive)

Personally and in my opinion, the only person that provided stats show stats that look pretty damned good. I say leave it alone. I will see a couple of dudes overcoming boxouts or skying for a rebound. But nothing more than the anomalies you'd see in real life. If folks want to argue putback success, cool. But rebounds in of themselves seem just fine. I've seen people yell and cry about "getting killed" on the glass only to finish the game on the plus side of the rebounding battle. In this day of ps4 and Xbox one, I'm stunned no one has video. There are MANY YouTube videos. I watch Smoove vids a lot, for example, and have yet to see an issue. Someone complained about the Bulls and feeling Noah didn't have an impact, yet didn't mention his final totals. Another person said he was beaten on the glass in an online game. So what was the perception of the guy he played? The loser will complain and the winner will be silent. So all you will here is the complaining even if it was perfectly played.

Threads like these are driven SO much by the heat of the moment and are normally emotional rants than real issues. I'm not saying there isn't an issue. But just giving personal testimony (which is normally a slanted opinion) with the occasional circumstantial evidence isn't getting us anywhere.

I haven't seen any "balance" issues with the rebounding in terms of the opponent getting more or whatever.



What I have noticed though is the opponent nearly always makes their put backs.



Playing on All star/sim and superstar/sim

And I feel this is valid but a shot success conversation. It extends to all shots and not just putbacks in the higher skill settings.

[Vni]

Re: Offensive rebounding

To me it is the lack of boxing out by your bigs that hurt the offensive rebounding. Overall I think they are a little too passive on defense when it comes to help defense and boxing out. I would like to see a little more physicallity.

[BrickAssist]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Outside of the user team's AI teammates being extremely ineffective at boxing out, the other main issue I've had is if it is a tightly contested rebound and gets poked down to mid level, neither the player controlled character or your teammates seem to know what to do with that ball. They just stop moving while the cpu grabs it quickly. I've actually seen the ball bounce off players chests/arms and they never make any effort to pick it up.

[swac07]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Have you guys played around with the boxout assist strength slider in the controller option screen? If so any results(good or bad)?

[Kaanyr Vhok]

Re: Offensive rebounding

I'm toying with sliders and I think offensive awareness and hands might have more to do with guys snatching blocked shots like shortstops than rebounding. I eliminated that stuff but I'm not sure what slider did it.

[Kaanyr Vhok]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Czar I'm sure we have discussed this before.

One of the biggest problem with offensive rebounds pertains to rim physics.

Shots do not miss realistically. Threes don't lead to long rebounds. The reason 3pt cheesing has been so successful over the years isn't just that players were draining unrealistic shots but they weren't being penalized for doing so - in fact they were benefitting from it. Since rebounds don't go long, 3pt spammers don't have to deal with fastbreaks, and they get plenty of high percentage offensive rebounds down low because the defensive breakdowns leading to that 3pt shot likewise destroyed any semblance of box balance. Further, it seems like teams are helpless after ORBs to do anything except give up an uncontested shot (players with the highest ORB ratings also have the highest Standing Dunk ratings).


FWIW it does not seem like the rebound ratings are a problem this year, they were slightly unbalanced in favor of ORBs last season but it seems fair now. I don't know enough about 2K15 to say if athleticism ratings (new or otherwise) are a significant factor, this is just what I observed over 3 games.

Average reb rate by pos Off/Def
PG: 42/42
SG: 44/42
SF: 57/61
PF: 75/78
C: 82/81

^^ True. There have been a lack of long rebounds since the Dreamcast. Its not just the rim physics. Guys cant control tip rebounds.

[Vni]

Re: Offensive rebounding

Just had a game where the Pistons got 19 off rebounds and 10 in the fourth of a tight game. Not saying it can't happen and I know that Drummond is good on the boards but it felt kind of cheap. I had the bucks and Sanders myself.