Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

[Von Dozier]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Interesting to see this topic, after putting a couple of my first hours into 2k24, I don't know if it's because I have 200 hours in 2k23, but something about the control just feels off, just a sort of janky feel in the hands. I was switching between 23 and 24 last night to test, and the gameplay in 23 just feels smooth like butter, whereas I can barely get across midcourt in 24 without there being a lot of weird warping and wonky animations playing out that sort of stutter. Even just passing the ball inbounds after an opponent's bucket feels like there's a lot of unnecessary animation delay in it compared to 23, and I still don't think I've seen a layup that doesn't involve a distracting amount of ice skating. It's sort of driving me crazy, and I think I have to go back to 23.

It just feels like 24 isn't finished baking yet. Maybe I'll try again in a couple more months. I bought 23 last year around the Christmas sale, and maybe I should have waited then.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Pretty obvious you say we have to look for the warping. I'm in the middle of a game right now. I'll keep playing the game, and keep trying to criticize what I feel is unrealistic.

You do t have to squint and look hard for the warping and the unrealistic aspects of the game. They're glaring ugly spots.

I've put up video evidence of pure cheese and you guys say I'm crying. So whatever.

Didn’t say that either, lol

I know I personally don’t have to look for warping, I see it all the time…especially since I’m always looking in replays.

[topwater]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Interesting to see this topic, after putting a couple of my first hours into 2k24, I don't know if it's because I have 200 hours in 2k23, but something about the control just feels off, just a sort of janky feel in the hands. I was switching between 23 and 24 last night to test, and the gameplay in 23 just feels smooth like butter, whereas I can barely get across midcourt in 24 without there being a lot of weird warping and wonky animations playing out that sort of stutter. Even just passing the ball inbounds after an opponent's bucket feels like there's a lot of unnecessary animation delay in it compared to 23, and I still don't think I've seen a layup that doesn't involve a distracting amount of ice skating. It's sort of driving me crazy, and I think I have to go back to 23.

It just feels like 24 isn't finished baking yet. Maybe I'll try again in a couple more months. I bought 23 last year around the Christmas sale, and maybe I should have waited then.

I get that on inbounding passes also. It's like whatever way I choose to go is the opposite way the game wanted me to go, so there's an odd few seconds where it looks and feels like the ballhandler has sprained knees and his uniform is made of metal and the world's biggest magnets are on the sidelines.

There's lots of very odd momentum-killing, almost out of sync animations that only make the remarkably capable defense even more difficult. Trying to pass to a teammate 15 feet away while just standing still shouldn't take half a second to initiate and then another ridiculous animation that takes another second to play out. Especially when a defender on the nail can effectively defend the entire court under the three point line. That's not an exaggeration either. A lone defender on the nail can predict, warp and slide his way to any player receiving a pass in a profoundly formidable way in such that said defender will probably be able to cut off a drive, alter a drive and defend the layup or alter a shot. It isn't realistic. It's even a bit too arcade for arcade standards.

[FixEverything2k]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

I’ve turned down Driving Contact Shots in the sliders to 5, put inside at 100.

I’ve turned down ball handler - defender collision to 10

I’ve turned down on-ball defence to 30, jumpshot gather defence strength to 15, layup takeoff to 15. I’ve turned down the jumpshot release and layup release sliders a little too to about 35 and 40, but I don’t know what this does fr yet.

This has slightly toned down the NHL effect. And perimeter defence stickiness.

[edaddy]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

As far as the conversation, You’re frustrating yourself. You skimmed my post, gathered that it wasn’t aligned to what you were saying, and went from there.

I never said “all is well, move along”

I literally said in my post that the elimination of warping isn’t something a dev would ever have claimed because it’s something that clearly exists and will exist to varying degrees for the foreseeable future.

Like I’ve said many times before, OS isn’t for mindless ranting. There are plenty of spaces for that. It’s for conversation. Like what sirdez is doing. See how his last post noted that he understood the other poster point, but still had thoughts of his own without veering off into a rant? There’s room for nuance. Learn this.

I haven’t said much on this topic recently, I’m in my “enjoy the game, let you guys have at it” phase of this years cycle. I was just correcting the misinformation regarding ProPlay.

Man do you realize your actually getting about warping and pro play exact words in a videgame!! you took words out of context they literally said pro play helps introduce realistic outcomes and animations and would help with smoother transitions and warping!! warping wil never be eliminated in any sports game but based on my play and the positive response to pro play initially it was a different experience. That patch or patches just reintroduced warping animations and ridiculous outcomes at a greater rate. Thats my opinion my man. You have your own experience great enjoy what apparently some of see. As we say cmon man!!

[ggsimmonds]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

That's fair. I find that when the CPU sends a double, you don't have a lot of time to react before they lock you up for a jump ball (which is good), so I instinctively just hit pass thinking it would be an easy bucket.

The point was more that there's no scenario where the guy sprinting out to double like that should be able to then get back to contest inside. I get that the sliding and warping is an unavoidable by-product of an animation-based system, but the superhuman recoveries and the way the CPU doesn't ever give up on a play or shot contest are a bit exhausting.

Slow catch animations can get in the bin too - they genuinely feel like a penalty for finding an open man or running a good play.

I'd actually love to see there just be more natural inconsistencies with shooting rather than the suffocating D, but then the online community chucks a fit if they don't make every shot they time well.

Agree on all points (with a minor disagreement on slow catch animations, I don't think the catch animation is the culprit as much as it is movement can still be a bit jerky at times, many times that first step being a jerky hitch step screws me out of a easy layup too).

Double teams and help defense in general are one of my biggest gripes with the game. The double team in your video is one I see frequently and is inexcusable imo. I'm surprised we don't see more people calling out 2k for that scenario where the double comes from the dunker or lob defender and there is zero rotation. And yeah to make up for it 2k gives defenders indestructible ACLs lol

[sirdez]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Yeah it's funny because if the CPU doubles you on the block, they also rotate around the perimeter to try and cover the open guys really well and quickly, so if you don't make the right pass you lose the advantage. But if they double you on the perimeter, they often use an inside player as the doubler which leaves a wide open man inside.

[m29a]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Playing default All-Star and I'm noticing that laying off turbo and just using basic movements can work well to create some open jumpers and also makes it feel like the defenders are less magnetic. That's nice.

[ggsimmonds]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Playing default All-Star and I'm noticing that laying off turbo and just using basic movements can work well to create some open jumpers and also makes it feel like the defenders are less magnetic. That's nice.

Its kind of similar to how Madden seemingly has defenders insta-shed blocks if you hold turbo in the backfield

[jclazaris84]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

i'm thinking about picking up 2k24 on a BF sale but this perimeter smothering issue is turning me off from it. this is still an issue, correct? is it an issue in 2k23 as well?

[rudyjuly2]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

i'm thinking about picking up 2k24 on a BF sale but this perimeter smothering issue is turning me off from it. this is still an issue, correct? is it an issue in 2k23 as well?

Defenders do hip ride and play very physical on the perimeter in 24 vs 23. It’s too much and at the same time it doesn’t change my opinion of the game. Sliders help reduce defence being too strong. It’s a really good game so buy it.

[topwater]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

i'm thinking about picking up 2k24 on a BF sale but this perimeter smothering issue is turning me off from it. this is still an issue, correct? is it an issue in 2k23 as well?

It's pretty unrealistic. Defenders in this game, in general, are far too aggressive, overly physical and too competent. It very often leads to them getting in foul trouble in a really unrealistic manner. For example, with 8 minutes left in the first quarter guys who already have 1 foul will warp into you from just about anywhere to contest a shot and end up on the bench, when in reality they quite literally couldn't have physically got to you and even if they could have they wouldn't be that physical. Especially a starter that's needed to contribute for another 3+ quarters. It also suffers from very herky jerky movement with lots of odd animation speed changes with an absurd amount of warping and sliding. It's typical 2K in that there seems to be no middle ground and not much is subtle. Stuff needs to be dialed back a few notches.

I genuinely believe it's one of the worst NBA 2K titles released, yet at the same time it has the most potential to be (arguably) the best for offline sim hum vs cpu. I've been playing 23 recently just so I can cross half court without being assaulted by some average, run of the mill, can barely play defense bum who lives in my hip pocket. The freedom of movement alone in 23 is leaps and bounds better. There's spacing and you are actually permitted to move. Long rebounds exist in 23 and they straight up do not in 24, which I think is profoundly stupid. There's no real fast break game in 23 to speak of, and when 24 dropped it was actually pretty awesome, but they removed it for some odd reason.

If the ridiculous defense, movement and a few little things are patched/tweaked a bit I think 2K24 will be fantastic, if not the best 2K title to date, but until then it'll just be a disappointing mess.

[NYJin2011tm]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

It's pretty unrealistic. Defenders in this game, in general, are far too aggressive, overly physical and too competent. It very often leads to them getting in foul trouble in a really unrealistic manner. For example, with 8 minutes left in the first quarter guys who already have 1 foul will warp into you from just about anywhere to contest a shot and end up on the bench, when in reality they quite literally couldn't have physically got to you and even if they could have they wouldn't be that physical. Especially a starter that's needed to contribute for another 3+ quarters. It also suffers from very herky jerky movement with lots of odd animation speed changes with an absurd amount of warping and sliding. It's typical 2K in that there seems to be no middle ground and not much is subtle. Stuff needs to be dialed back a few notches.

I genuinely believe it's one of the worst NBA 2K titles released, yet at the same time it has the most potential to be (arguably) the best for offline sim hum vs cpu. I've been playing 23 recently just so I can cross half court without being assaulted by some average, run of the mill, can barely play defense bum who lives in my hip pocket. The freedom of movement alone in 23 is leaps and bounds better. There's spacing and you are actually permitted to move. Long rebounds exist in 23 and they straight up do not in 24, which I think is profoundly stupid. There's no real fast break game in 23 to speak of, and when 24 dropped it was actually pretty awesome, but they removed it for some odd reason.

If the ridiculous defense, movement and a few little things are patched/tweaked a bit I think 2K24 will be fantastic, if not the best 2K title to date, but until then it'll just be a disappointing mess.

Def a head scratcher “toning down” long rebounds. Long rebounds happen in the NBA but now your bigs in the game grab like 25-30 a game smh.

24 was perfect(for me anyway) when it first came out. Shooting pcts were spot on, long rebounds, fast breaks. But it all changed. The unrealistic close outs/contests are killers. Contests are considered just by being in the area, not even really on the shooter.

[loso_34]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Interesting to see this topic, after putting a couple of my first hours into 2k24, I don't know if it's because I have 200 hours in 2k23, but something about the control just feels off, just a sort of janky feel in the hands. I was switching between 23 and 24 last night to test, and the gameplay in 23 just feels smooth like butter, whereas I can barely get across midcourt in 24 without there being a lot of weird warping and wonky animations playing out that sort of stutter. Even just passing the ball inbounds after an opponent's bucket feels like there's a lot of unnecessary animation delay in it compared to 23, and I still don't think I've seen a layup that doesn't involve a distracting amount of ice skating. It's sort of driving me crazy, and I think I have to go back to 23.

It just feels like 24 isn't finished baking yet. Maybe I'll try again in a couple more months. I bought 23 last year around the Christmas sale, and maybe I should have waited then.

I hate that wonky animation you get when bringing up the ball its just not as smooth as last year. Also if you just point your LS left/right you get this sprint animation which can be wonky.

[topwater]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Def a head scratcher “toning down” long rebounds. Long rebounds happen in the NBA but now your bigs in the game grab like 25-30 a game smh.

24 was perfect(for me anyway) when it first came out. Shooting pcts were spot on, long rebounds, fast breaks. But it all changed. The unrealistic close outs/contests are killers. Contests are considered just by being in the area, not even really on the shooter.

Found a (not awesome) solution to some of the close outs and some defense in general. Rookie. Obviously it isn't particularly challenging (although with Tynole's rosters it's surprisingly ok) but I noticed while messing with sliders and settings in my perpetual quest to make 24 better than pewp, defenders on Rookie are less robotic and much less aggressive. You can drive and kick sometimes without having someone defy physics to contest literally every single thing. You can even occasionally drive to the rim and not have defenders try to end your life! Refreshing to not have a defender hit you with the Bradshaw Clothesline From Hell while you try to lay it up, but it's not a legit solution.