Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

[sirdez]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

I'm 100% convinced it's a bug now anyway. I had the game playing pretty decent for a few days. Can't explain how or why, but it was playing like the videos 24 posted. It was actually to the point where I was finding that it needed more contact and was upping said sliders, which is an astonishing change. Then, like an idiot, even though I said I'd wait until Tynoles was finished with his roster, I hopped online and grabbed his update and now my game is pure trash again. Every defender is psychic and there are soooo many warping and sliding animations forcing contact and "good defense". Defenders will warp from 5 feet behind me to actually get in front of me at the rim. No matter what roster or slider set I use now everyone is prime GP who happens to be twice as fast as everyone on the court and he's also a mind reader, and the CPU literally never misses a single uncontested jump shot. Not a single one. It has to be a bug.

Are you using his sliders? He has CPU perimeter defense set extremely high (87 I think) and has pass accuracy set to like 1. I tried his sliders for a bit but found even the most basic passes would trigger awkward and slow catch animations.

[topwater]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Are you using his sliders? He has CPU perimeter defense set extremely high (87 I think) and has pass accuracy set to like 1. I tried his sliders for a bit but found even the most basic passes would trigger awkward and slow catch animations.

Yes, and no. I use his sliders but turn human body up sensitivity to 0 and it plays really awesome. Now that the game is back to the way I've been complaining about in this thread, I'd have to turn all of the defensive sliders to 0 and honestly it won't fix much at all, if anything. When the game is playing well (like in 24's videos) the on ball defense set that high isn't an issue. It's actually quite good. There's very little warping and when it does occur it's honestly easy to forgive. It seems as though each defender is a lot less perfect and a lot less frantic with crazy sped up animations. You won't see a defender who's in front of you with his back turned forcing you all over the court at max sprint speed. Worst animation in the game, easily.


I don't mind the pass accuracy low because there aren't enough turnovers in the game. I'm not saying it's great, and there are a bunch of crappy passes/animations, but with it that low I can get 12-18 turnovers per team which I am happy to see. I think I eventually turned up the sliders for both to 15. It eliminated (most, not all) the errant pass from 10 feet away/juggling catch animation, but also every player wasn't needle threading 85 foot TD bombs, and there were an ok amount of to's. If I'm being honest I really think that aspect of the game is just bad and we have to settle for what we individually deem acceptable. If nothing else I think adjusting (lowering primarily) individual pass ratings would be a better fix than the global slider.

[topwater]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

I'm okay with guys like Brooks sticking to me (even though the mechanics aren't realistic). I get annoyed when it's Jordan Poole or Colin Sexton sticking to me all over the court though.

Haha, yeah. Or seeing James Harden stick to Giannis like glue then make him pick up his dribble by slamming into him. It happens against the cpu too. My AI defenders will full on lock a cpu player down and it's terrible to watch. I watched my Spurs AI (I played off ball) essentially shut down everyone on the Grizzlies every other play. And the Spurs were one of the worst defensive teams in years last year.

[howardphillips214]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

No denying they are good, but c'mon. Brooks isn't that good and I highly doubt either one are gonna lock Ja down. Brooks would die trying to keep up with him. Full disclosure - I hate Ja but he's a very tough defensive assignment.


I'm 100% convinced it's a bug now anyway. I had the game playing pretty decent for a few days. Can't explain how or why, but it was playing like the videos 24 posted. It was actually to the point where I was finding that it needed more contact and was upping said sliders, which is an astonishing change. Then, like an idiot, even though I said I'd wait until Tynoles was finished with his roster, I hopped online and grabbed his update and now my game is pure trash again. Every defender is psychic and there are soooo many warping and sliding animations forcing contact and "good defense". Defenders will warp from 5 feet behind me to actually get in front of me at the rim. No matter what roster or slider set I use now everyone is prime GP who happens to be twice as fast as everyone on the court and he's also a mind reader, and the CPU literally never misses a single uncontested jump shot. Not a single one. It has to be a bug.

Then there's the whole "He's old." Thing Brooks said against Bron. Then Bron decided to kill Brooks reputation as a "great" defender. I like having him on my team, but he was my 3rd and only trade request that went thru this season.

[NYJin2011tm]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Then there's the whole "He's old." Thing Brooks said against Bron. Then Bron decided to kill Brooks reputation as a "great" defender. I like having him on my team, but he was my 3rd and only trade request that went thru this season.

Curry toasted Brooks recently too lol. It was great!

No one would even know who Brooks is if it wasn’t for his mouth. His bark is bigger than his bite.

[howardphillips214]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Curry toasted Brooks recently too lol. It was great!

No one would even know who Brooks is if it wasn’t for his mouth. His bark is bigger than his bite.

Terrible player in real life... Awesome in 2k!

[LongRoad19]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Right now I'm exactly at the same point where I was with NBA 2k20 and NBA 2k23 (I didn't play 21 and 22). I can choose to cheese the CPU (with inside scoring) and win most games on All Star or even Superstar difficulty. Or I play how I think the game should be played and get blown out. There is no in between.

I played a game today against the Raptors in my Lebron Era Magic Season on All Star difficulty. I dominated the whole game, but only inside. The perimeter defense was incredible, almost every shot was contested, every defender played like prime Gary Payton or Kawhi Leonard. I finished 100 - 84, from my 100 points came 72 from inside and 8 from free throws, I was 4/24 from three and somewhere 4 shots from mid range went in. That's 8 made shots in the whole game (and because I was leading I tried a lineup with only good shooters on the floor, but that didn't help)

It's so sad, because it is no fun to play like this. Is there a way out of this misery and get back the most basic thing that is in this wonderful game of basketball: (open) shooting

[m29a]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

I also would say I don't have a problem with true good defenders playing very solid -- but I think this year there isn't enough separation from a player with say, 85+ lateral quickness, and a player with 70-75 lateral quickness. There should be more noticeable step downs in defensive recovery. Some previous years had that balanced better IMO.

Edit: Yeah, the above post about forcing inside shots resonates with me. I can play that way too -- 2K bully ball -- but it lacks variety and sometimes the game just plays so far from the modern NBA in terms of 3s/open shot frequency that it is jarring. I just tell myself this must be early 2000s style basketball.

[NYJin2011tm]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Right now I'm exactly at the same point where I was with NBA 2k20 and NBA 2k23 (I didn't play 21 and 22). I can choose to cheese the CPU (with inside scoring) and win most games on All Star or even Superstar difficulty. Or I play how I think the game should be played and get blown out. There is no in between.

I played a game today against the Raptors in my Lebron Era Magic Season on All Star difficulty. I dominated the whole game, but only inside. The perimeter defense was incredible, almost every shot was contested, every defender played like prime Gary Payton or Kawhi Leonard. I finished 100 - 84, from my 100 points came 72 from inside and 8 from free throws, I was 4/24 from three and somewhere 4 shots from mid range went in. That's 8 made shots in the whole game (and because I was leading I tried a lineup with only good shooters on the floor, but that didn't help)

It's so sad, because it is no fun to play like this. Is there a way out of this misery and get back the most basic thing that is in this wonderful game of basketball: (open) shooting

This is exactly it! Sure I can spam score like the CPU and win on Superstar but if I run plays and play like a team should I’ll get blown out. It’s just not fun.

[alabamarob]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Moving jumpers and right stick jumpers are easier to get off and have a much lower contest rate. These 2 things are the only things that allow me to get realistic 3 point numbers.

However, if you call plays and then beat the cpu off the dribble you can get a decent amount of drive and kick 3's. You won't get very many off the pnr though.

[howardphillips214]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Every game is the Harden Rockets. 3s and dunks. Layups are dreadful and the midrange is a wash.

It's crazy that the entire league no matter if it's Giannis or Russ. Leave them and it's a make.


How is anyone's ISO game?

I can't ISO Mason Plumlee or DeAndre Ayton as a PG.

[topwater]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

Every game is the Harden Rockets. 3s and dunks. Layups are dreadful and the midrange is a wash.

It's crazy that the entire league no matter if it's Giannis or Russ. Leave them and it's a make.


How is anyone's ISO game?

I can't ISO Mason Plumlee or DeAndre Ayton as a PG.

Porzingas just locked me up (Lillard) 3 times in a quarter on switches while he was defending the PNR. I shut the game off.

[sirdez]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

I pass to my point guard on the perimeter. Fox gambles on the steal but is too late, leaving him completely out of position. I try to take advantage of this and drive, but the game throws me into a slow catch animation which allows Fox to miraculously get back into position and prevent the drive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xygf1jl3Y4M

Some of this isn't even subtle haha.

Then down the other end, I trap him on the baseline. He is then able to magically pass through the body of my defender to set Sabonis up for the bucket.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dK3mmVbT2w

I know this is a clipping/collision issue but it's pretty annoying when the CPU can body you and recover to the extent they do, and you just get cheesed when you establish good position.

[topwater]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

I pass to my point guard on the perimeter. Fox gambles on the steal but is too late, leaving him completely out of position. I try to take advantage of this and drive, but the game throws me into a slow catch animation which allows Fox to miraculously get back into position and prevent the drive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xygf1jl3Y4M

Some of this isn't even subtle haha.

Then down the other end, I trap him on the baseline. He is then able to magically pass through the body of my defender to set Sabonis up for the bucket.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dK3mmVbT2w

I know this is a clipping/collision issue but it's pretty annoying when the CPU can body you and recover to the extent they do, and you just get cheesed when you establish good position.

It's pure cheese. It seems like it's playing faster again which started last night. Played a game and then rematched and immediately I noticed that there was a pretty noticeable speed difference.


I haven't had a drive to the lane where someone doesn't slide into position or warp from behind and full on smash me in three days now. I get the layup where the guy comes from behind and floats around me to in front of me about 8 times a game. It's a foul every time too. Pushing the ball forward/turbo results in actually going slower more often than not now too. I press it and I get a split second of speed and sometimes the pushout animation only to just almost instantly the slowed down jogging animation where you stand more upright. It's just plain awful.


The prime directive of 'contest any and all shots or layup attempts and get in front of anyone with the ball regardless of the situation or physics' is painful to endure. It even looks terrible. Seeing guys just warp around the court frantically defying physics 'making plays' and 'clamping' is kinda pathetic. It looks and plays like an eight year with ADHD old who's never actually seen or played basketball described it from a book with the utmost of enthusiasm to a programmer who's also never seen or played basketball.


I go to see how the online crowd is playing it and what they say about it but usually within the first two minutes I lose interest. It's just arcade dribble spam. Even guys who are "sim" just exploit horrible animations and the laser accurate passing. But, they must be happy in general, because they are the ones making 2K all the money and all changes are made to appease them. Good for them, I guess, but it's cost me a basketball title to enjoy.

[Johnnythelegend]

Re: Perimeter Defense Seems Way Too Tight - Smothering

I pass to my point guard on the perimeter. Fox gambles on the steal but is too late, leaving him completely out of position. I try to take advantage of this and drive, but the game throws me into a slow catch animation which allows Fox to miraculously get back into position and prevent the drive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xygf1jl3Y4M

Some of this isn't even subtle haha.

Then down the other end, I trap him on the baseline. He is then able to magically pass through the body of my defender to set Sabonis up for the bucket.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dK3mmVbT2w

I know this is a clipping/collision issue but it's pretty annoying when the CPU can body you and recover to the extent they do, and you just get cheesed when you establish good position.

Animations, animations, animations, I think there's too many of them and it hurts some fundamental stuff like foot planting/skating, players tend to travel on offense or ridiculous recover like in these situations, clipping etc. Animations look good but they take away control and hurt stuff mentioned above.