Lamar Odom re-signs with Lakers

[Cebby]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

Glad this nonsense is settled. Now we just need Brown and Farmar to turn into real PGs, and for either Vujacic or Morrison to find their shot.

No you don't.

You need nothing.

You took a championship team and added a top 5 perimeter defender. Nobody except Fisher is getting old and nobody appears to have done anything stupid.

If one of Brown, Farmar, Machine, or Walton decides to stop sucking it will just be the difference between a 6 game Finals and a 5 game Finals.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

According to Bill Simmons, the Artest/Ariza switch is an upgrade for Houston, and a loss for LA...

Besides, who doesn't like for their young players to continue to develop?

[Stumbleweed]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

I would actually kinda agree in the sense that Artest is older, more expensive, needs the ball in his hands more often to be effective, isn't as good of an outside shooter... the Lakers team needs someone who doesn't take the ball away from Kobe/Gasol/Odom, all of whom are much more efficient scorers than Artest. But yeah, the defensive aptitude (which admittedly has been on the decline the past few seasons) and the rebounding/toughness that Artest brings is an upgrade. And just having another vet on the team (even a semi-crazy one entering the last leg of his prime) makes them a little more dangerous in the playoffs.

If they hadn't gotten Lamar back, it would've been a BIG downgrade overall, but now it's basically a lateral move IMO, with the advantage going to Houston long-term... just comparing the contracts/players. Maybe Ron will prove me wrong and really fit in well with their team concept, but I can just see the eye rolling from Phil and Co. coming when he isolates for 10 seconds and launches a contested 20-footer (that's Kobe's job, and he's MUCH better at it than Ron-Ron).

Another underrated aspect of Ariza's game is his ability to run the floor and finish with power... Artest simply isn't that kind of player. He can bowl people over or back them down to create his own shot, but I don't see him running the floor and catching alley-oops...

[Cebby]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

I would actually kinda agree in the sense that Artest is older, more expensive, needs the ball in his hands more often to be effective, isn't as good of an outside shooter...

I believe they have the exact same contract and Artest is a FAR better outside shooter.

I don't think Ariza is every going to develop into a great player, so a very good player in Artest right now is worth more than a decent and possibly good in 3 years player. With Artest's defense, you have to do this if you're the Lakers (and any other team that isn't in serious, serious rebuilding). Indiana, Phoenix, and maybe New Jersey are the only teams I can think of who might actually want Ariza over Artest.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

So how do you think the Houston series would have gone had we swapped Artest and Ariza last year?


People who think Ariza is better than Artest kind of baffle me. Artest has improved every team he has gone to. And I didn't know that 29 was the "last leg of your prime", lol. Big, strong defensive players are usually effective up to age 33 and Ron looks to be in excellent condition.

[Stumbleweed]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

Ron was in the absolute basement in terms of 2PT% while being the 2nd or 3rd option for a lot of the year in Houston. If he didn't have Yao sucking up all the defenders down low, that would've been even worse. His 3PT%s were better than Ariza last season, but if the playoffs were any indication, Ariza's shooting will at least meet Ron's career numbers (34%) and probably exceed it. Ron should get a lot of nice looks in LA, but I think the 40% he shot least season was a bit of a fluke. Maybe he'll keep it similar due to all the attention that the rest of the starting 5 attracts (no Fish), but I doubt it.

Anyway, a lot of the value of the deal for Houston was Ariza's future development, and he showed a lot of progress last season. Maybe it's a Kleiza situation where he just plateaus, but I don't think that will happen for quite a few years. But yeah, that's all speculation on my part... I just think this acquisition isn't the world-beating one that some people think it is. Getting Odom back was far more important to their team... not even close.

You're right on the contract... I forgot Ron went to LA on the cheap.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

Offensively, the Lakers are at the top of the league without Ariza or Artest. Offense hasn't been a problem in LA in...actually I can't remember when the last time they were a struggling offensive team.

Defensively, the closest thing they had to a defensive small forward was Kobe. He's 6'6 220 defending people two inches and thirty to forty pounds heavier than him. Ron makes it so they never have to do that again. Trevor wasn't strong enough to even slow those guys down. Now Kobe will be on the 2nd best perimeter player, or PG, which makes the Lakers a legitimately better team.

[Stumbleweed]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

Yeah, I don't dispute that at all... Kobe will appreciate the break too, especially since he has more mileage on his legs than almost anyone (more than anyone his age for sure). I just think role-wise that Ariza is a better fit in basically every other aspect. Artest won't help their transition game like Trevor did, he'll take shots away from their more efficient players, and his defense has been on a steady slide since his Indiana days (especially against quicker SFs). We'll see how it goes I guess. Talent upgrade (especially right now), but I'm not sure it's an overall upgrade, especially long-term.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

Yeah, I don't dispute that at all... Kobe will appreciate the break too, especially since he has more mileage on his legs than almost anyone (more than anyone his age for sure). I just think role-wise that Ariza is a better fit in basically every other aspect. Artest won't help their transition game like Trevor did, he'll take shots away from their more efficient players, and his defense has been on a steady slide since his Indiana days (especially against quicker SFs). We'll see how it goes I guess. Talent upgrade (especially right now), but I'm not sure it's an overall upgrade, especially long-term.

The Lakers don't really have a "long term". They have 4 years. After that, they'd have major changes to make anyway, and I highly doubt that a 28 year old Ariza will be enough of a game changer that they'll regret not having him on the roster. If he was going to turn into Brandon Roy in four years, then sure. But he'll still just be a role player with no handle who can't create his own shot and isn't strong enough to defend the increasing number of larger SFs in the league.

Still, even if the crux of this debate is that the Lakers got better defensively, but worse offensively, that's still in the best interest of the Lakers. Now I don't think they got worse offensively, because Artest give them another guy who can create shots for himself and others when Kobe sits. He also isn't the chucker that people make him out to be. Ron has no problem turning his offense down and turning his defense up. If he wasn't crazy, he'd be a coach's wet dream.

[BiggD]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

Dammn lakers...

oh well,on paper it looks like they will be returning to the finals in 2010

[Cebby]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

The Lakers don't really have a "long term". They have 4 years. After that, they'd have major changes to make anyway, and I highly doubt that a 28 year old Ariza will be enough of a game changer that they'll regret not having him on the roster. If he was going to turn into Brandon Roy in four years, then sure. But he'll still just be a role player with no handle who can't create his own shot and isn't strong enough to defend the increasing number of larger SFs in the league.

That's how I see it.

Ariza's peak is what, 12 efficient points a game? Granted, due to Houston's injury situation this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't put up 18+, but it'll be on 40% shooting or below.

He is a solid player, but any team would have traded him for Artest.

Pau, Kobe, and Odom are all between 29 and 31. There is no time that can be spent developing a guy who's never going to be more than a third or fourth option.

So what if Artest isn't going to run the floor? A set offense containing 3 or 4 of Kobe, Gasol, Odom, Bynum, and Artest doesn't need to run to score.

The Lakers are the best run team in the NBA by the widest of margins, especially when it comes to transitioning from one era to the next. I think they know what they're doing.

[Gibbz]

Re: Lamar Odom re-signs with Lakers

Chalk up another title for LA.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Lamar Odom re-signs with Lakers

The only thing I'm worried with losing Trevor is his willingness to move without the basketball. He would always get a couple easy baskets just by staying active and catching his defender napping. And someone already mentioned that Trevor can run the floor very well.

Ron I don't see him doing too much running or too much moving around without the ball.

Other than that Ron is going to accept a toned down role offensively and I don't foresee him not making the right passes at the right times.

[B-Wills]

Re: The Lamar Odom Saga

2005?

yea but 05 seems like so long ago, lol.

[rckabillyRaider]

Re: Lamar Odom re-signs with Lakers

back to back baby. If the Lakers play like they should and dont underachieve for some crazy reason, they will give us another parade next June.