The LeBron James Thread

[airjoca]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

In other news...LeBron leads the post season in 4th quarter scoring. And is tied with Ginobili for first in "clutch" scoring.

That will surely change in the Finals.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/bGJURXHF7eM?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[BringTheHeat]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

That will surely change in the Finals.

And if it doesn't people will still find something to hate on.

[KG]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Wade & James absolutely murdered Boston in the P&R tonight.

[The 24th Letter]

I was about to post this as well....

Highly efficient....

[jeebs9]

The plays that stands out to me. Are the Shane Battier 3 and the Haslem jumper. Hockey assist

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

[The 24th Letter]

Not to mention a Wade FT attempt, Wade layup, LeBron layup, and LeBron miss and immediate put back...

and almost won the game with it...

Well see if they run it more...

[jeebs9]

The Wade & LeBron pick and roll has been lethal since last year. Once you get LeBron in driving position. He is lethal. With the pick & roll if you don't trap Wade your asking for trouble. Boston needs too trap LeBron on the roll and make him give it up.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

[wwharton]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

I don't know about the best team, I think we'll have our hands full with San Antonio if we both make it there. We do have 2 of the top 5 players in the league though and I do believe they can turn it on when needed.

But I'm biased. You're probably right on the PnR thing.

Wasn't being technical but you know what I was getting at...

They ran it a couple of times last night. Thought about grabbing youtube videos (if I have a sec I will) to show you what I mean. I think the first one you see Lebron screen and seal but then pretty much watches with the defender on his back. The second one he rolls but it was like it was designed for him to get the ball no matter what and Wade made a pretty amazing pass just to get it into him and it resulted in a miss.

Now I don't care about makes and misses (especially with these two guys getting shots in the paint) so I'd call the 2nd one a success. But it really looked like it was scripted while the more natural first attempt Lebron never rolled. This pretty much sums up my feeling on it from the players perspective. Neither of them are natural "pick and roll" players. They shouldn't be as they're both wing players who are extremely talented in space. Asking Lebron to be a screen and then roll guy puts him in position to do something that's not really his strength. It's not to say he's bad at it or a liability, just there are better ways to use him to maximize what he does well. It's a good play to be used sparingly, but the many, many other screen and roll plays where James was on the wing are so much better for the overall offense and the chances of everyone on the court... and it's easier for him to get the ball to James in a good position for him to do something when he gets stuck.

This would all probably make more sense with some video so sorry, but something to look out for when they do it in the future, and how it compares to when they run PnR with Anthony/Haslem/Bosh/Battier.

Well don't me wrong, I don't think there's some supposed unstoppable play waiting to be unveiled at the end of the year like the movies...lol. I probably know the Spurs sets as much as anyone, and I know for a fact we have "money" sets we use to generate offense...I would assume every team does. Saw some stuff on O tailor fit for OKC on Sunday too...

As far as the P&R, way too much of a simplification...saying the defense will just...adjust. It's the most dynamic play in basketball for a reason. Steve Nash, Amare, the defense and everyone in the stands knew they were going to run the P&R and it worked constantly....same as Manu and Splitter the other night...it's dangerous with the right personnel...

Simply put, the LBJ/Wade P&R has l worked more than its failed...no real reason to think itd be detrimental to up its usage until proven otherwise..

That's what I'm saying, if this were as sure fire a scoring opportunity as is being presented here it would be done more often.

It's really not a simplification. Honestly, other than the triangle, princeton offense and maybe some variations it's all pretty simple. The key is in the execution. I'm not saying the defense will "adjust", they rotate in a way that makes a pass to the roller tough, and if done properly, push the dribbler to move laterally. The reason it's such an effective play is because it's hard to do that on a consistent basis when you have a good screener, something that isn't the strength of James or Wade... and it creates great opportunities for screeners who are great at sealing and then rolling, again not strengths of either of these guys.

Actually your examples of Stat and Splitter support what I'm saying. These guys set great screens and use it to create opportunities on a roll. It's a huge part of Splitter's chance to ever score so he NEEDS to be good at it. Using those examples, mismatches are created even when the PnR is defended well.

And of course, some teams just don't defend the PnR well. In which case I still wouldn't run it much with Wade and James bc it's an easy way to get Anthony, Haslem, even Howard involved in the offense while still setting up the two super stars (by using a more natural PF/C to set screens for either Wade or James).

True enough.

Wasn't comparing it to Nash and Stat In that regard, just that it's not as simple as adjusting to it....

I did the research after posting, will post it when I can...you can argue the results of overdoing it, but you can't really argue its efficiency...it's up there. Their playmaking, athleticism in the pick and roll adds a different dynamic all in its own...I bet Heat fans would take that over the amount of times LBJ and Wade are sitting at the 3 point line in possessions...

Somewhere in here this became whether or not the Heat should run PnR at all? I was calling for them to do that before they even started (and obviously the results of that are staggering). The PnR should be a staple of their half court offense. This current discussion is only about James setting screens for Wade and vice versa. I'd love to see what you found if that's what you're talking about.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

5 Years Ago Today...one of the greatest playoff game performances in NBA History:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/MzsAi1a1rog?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[The 24th Letter]

Whart we are only talking about Wade and Bron P&Rs...nothing else....I'd be glad to post it...I forgot.

I wish I had updated data with last nights performance as well, because it was effective...once again, last night.

[jeebs9]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Whart we are only talking about Wade and Bron P&Rs...nothing else....I'd be glad to post it...I forgot.

I wish I had updated data with last nights performance as well, because it was effective...once again, last night.

I remember last year finals in game 3 when they ran that play. They double teamed both Wade and LeBron (after the roll). And Bosh came out the hero with the jumper. When it's working like that. That's a scary combination.

[wwharton]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Whart we are only talking about Wade and Bron P&Rs...nothing else....I'd be glad to post it...I forgot.

I wish I had updated data with last nights performance as well, because it was effective...once again, last night.

Cool, that's what I thought. There were a couple of post from a few people mixed in there that seemed like it was talking about Wade OR James getting screened for in PnR situations which I 110% think they should continue doing and should've been doing more all along.

I remember two from yesterday (described them both earlier). I'd have to go back and watch but I THINK the first was more of a surprise while the 2nd the Celtics were prepared for. Ironically I think the 2nd worked out better than the 1st but it was bc Wade made an amazing thread the needle bounce pass while in the 1st James didn't really do anything after screening.

If you remember others let me know (even if you don't have video or anything... just seeing what I forgot).

I remember last year finals in game 3 when they ran that play. They double teamed both Wade and LeBron (after the roll). And Bosh came out the hero with the jumper. When it's working like that. That's a scary combination.

I'm not saying they should never do it or that it would never result in good things. Hell, I could draw up some plays involving these two and they could make them work, lol. I just disagree with the thought that it should be a staple in their offense bc it makes them unguardable... and think that the TEAM works much better with a PF/C screening for one of them while the other is moving without the ball when the defense is forced to rotate (pretty much what the Heat have been doing since the last 2 games of the Pacers series).

[jeebs9]

^^ Totally agree ^^

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

[BringTheHeat]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/z7BfFxRAfIs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

If Chalmers moves in a few steps, you have 3 open shots there off that PnR. More off the penetration but the PnR helped, notice Rondo stayed on James.