CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

[King_B_Mack]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

The market has done that and it has been a failed model. Especially with bad economics and yes there should be some kind of curbing to what those guys can get. The NBA was jus fine before 100 million dollar contracts were being given out, and it would be fine without it again.

The market rate needs to be lowered, and guaranteed contracts need to be gone. Then you'll see people really work for their money, instead of only in a contract year.

Of course we will cause every player in the NFL really works for their money. There aren't any Albert Haynesworths....or any other players who only show up in contract years.

[tehova]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Disagree all you want, but there is a lockout which means there is a problem with that thinking

They cant go on forever getting pay raises no matter what when salaries are already at an all time high for players since the NBA started

If rookies can have a max cap on their salaries, and there is already a such thing as a max contract that tells me only so much is allowed anyway.Its just operating on a scale much larger than necessary to continue on as is.

Well the simple reason i said that you cant get paid too much in salary is because its a negotiation, whatever you negotiate is fair game. But as long as anyone is willing to pay that contract then yes it actually can go on forever and ever

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So owners can make as much as they can put the players can't?

[da ThRONe]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

The market has done that and it has been a failed model. Especially with bad economics and yes there should be some kind of curbing to what those guys can get. The NBA was jus fine before 100 million dollar contracts were being given out, and it would be fine without it again.

The market rate needs to be lowered, and guaranteed contracts need to be gone. Then you'll see people really work for their money, instead of only in a contract year.

Isn't it really unfair that players have to honor their end of the contract but teams don't?

Once again the market needs to dictate how much players get. The problem right now is the ratio. The owners will move the players right around 50%(probably 47-50%) which should help alot.

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

This is what WTF was trying to explain... they're going to continue to operate, is what they're going to do

If they keep bleeding, they'll fold and these players will be in Europe somewhere or on the and 1 tour

Another thing people arent taking into account is that each team is its own business...they are not all one single entity under the nba

The way ticket prices are and the high salaries getting higher, something needs to be done on both sides.

Actually, this is entirely not true. In a business sense, NBA teams are subsidiary companies under the NBA. Yes, they do operate independently BUT they do fall under the NBA umbrella.

[Yeah...THAT Guy]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So since Frank Vogel isn't under contract with any team, he can technically get the Pacers players together and have practices, can't he? If he isn't employed by the team at the moment, there's nothing they can do to stop him from getting together with the players, correct?

[The Big Squeezy]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So since Frank Vogel isn't under contract with any team, he can technically get the Pacers players together and have practices, can't he? If he isn't employed by the team at the moment, there's nothing they can do to stop him from getting together with the players, correct?

If true, that'd be hilarious.

[23]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Basically the players have been told by owners, we dont want you to work for us, so the players dont have access to anything the nba has,facilities, doctors, medicine, and they arent insured, so if they do something on their own and get hurt, they're screwed


Dice correct they fall under the nba umbrella and thats the point i was making about players getting too much. The CBA determines what is and is not too much or is and is not allowed, moreso than the market. Thats why for a long time rooks couldnt make over what was it 4 mil per year in their first contract term?


da throne... players dont want to move, thats one of the problems. They want the pay raises to continue to increase even though the BRI is not supporting that notion.

dice, after its said and done some owners or group of owners dont pocket billions to burn... check the mavs if you dont believe me..and im not talking just cuban and his side businesses... and yes the players only get what they agree to in the cba

king b.... there is no real comparison from NFL players to NBA players. First of all the contracts arent guaranteed so you take a risk in the NFL of never playing again from year to year. The NBA needs something like that badly
It would eliminate long term mistakes, beef up competition, and make the players give the fans their money's worth.

[Boge]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So what's happening with the profit sharing? Forgive me if I have no idea what I'm talking about, but I just want to see a competitive league, and if the Lakers can spend 120 million for their players, but other teams can only spend 70 or 80 million for theirs, that's not very fair.

[The Big Squeezy]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Basically the players have been told by owners, we dont want you to work for us, so the players dont have access to anything the nba has,facilities, doctors, medicine, and they arent insured, so if they do something on their own and get hurt, they're screwed


Dice correct they fall under the nba umbrella and thats the point i was making about players getting too much. The CBA determines what is and is not too much or is and is not allowed, moreso than the market. Thats why for a long time rooks couldnt make over what was it 4 mil per year in their first contract term?


da throne... players dont want to move, thats one of the problems. They want the pay raises to continue to increase even though the BRI is not supporting that notion.

dice, after its said and done some owners or group of owners dont pocket billions to burn... check the mavs if you dont believe me..and im not talking just cuban and his side businesses... and yes the players only get what they agree to in the cba

king b.... there is no real comparison from NFL players to NBA players. First of all the contracts arent guaranteed so you take a risk in the NFL of never playing again from year to year. The NBA needs something like that badly
It would eliminate long term mistakes, beef up competition, and make the players give the fans their money's worth.

I couldn't agree more

[phenom1990]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So what's happening with the profit sharing? Forgive me if I have no idea what I'm talking about, but I just want to see a competitive league, and if the Lakers can spend 120 million for their players, but other teams can only spend 70 or 80 million for theirs, that's not very fair.

I believe I understand a big portion of the revenue sharing debate. The argument is that there needs to be more revenue sharing because the current system is unfair to small market teams. Big market teams like the Lakers, Knicks, Bulls, etc can generate significantly higher money from their local television contracts than New Orleans, Oklahoma City, etc. Therefore they have more money and are in a better position to profit just because they are in a bigger market.

The belief is that since all these teams operate under the NBA, there should be increased revenue sharing to help create a more balanced landscape.

[AgentKiwi38]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

The major *** this lockout is sucking darkens the entire ****ing planet.
This is bull****.

[Court_vision]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So owners can make as much as they can put the players can't?

Way too simple bro.

Owners can also LOSE money........

Players can't. They cannot lose money no matter what. If a guy signs for $30 million, he's getting paid that even if the arena is half empty and the race for the play offs finished for his team in January.

The owners are the guys taking the risk in almost all aspects. The Mavs just won it all........Drik got $21 million and a ring.

Cuban got a championship also...but probably lost $20 million doing it. (well over the cap, fines, parades etc). Cuban can afford to lose it, but not all owners can.

The owners are the only ones in this whole thing who can lose money. I don't think it's unfair that they want a league where smaller teams can compete / all teams are reasonable equal...without having to risk losing millions.

The leagues "profits" are exagerated as it's almost all coming from big markets. Smaller markets cannot sustain the current set up.

[Court_vision]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So what's happening with the profit sharing? Forgive me if I have no idea what I'm talking about, but I just want to see a competitive league, and if the Lakers can spend 120 million for their players, but other teams can only spend 70 or 80 million for theirs, that's not very fair.

You've actually nailed it.

The smaller markets want a 'hard' cap to be able to compete equally. At the moment, the big markets can afford to go way over / the smaller markets can't.

[Court_vision]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Crazy stuff


NEW ORLEANS – Chris Paul(notes) stood on the Tulane University track Thursday morning underneath a rainbow arch made of teal and yellow balloons in the New Orleans Hornets’ colors. Paul was there to host a youth fitness event, and Dennis Rogers, the Hornets’ director of basketball communication, was helping coordinate. Hugo, the Hornets’ mascot, entertained the children while Randy Greenup, the Hornets’ security guard and a close friend of Paul’s, also worked the event.
And by the end of the day, Paul wouldn’t be allowed to speak with any of them.
With the NBA deciding to implement a lockout after failing to negotiate a new collective bargaining agreement with the Players Association, teams are now forbidden from having any contact with players. That’s why Paul planned to spend Thursday afternoon playing golf with Greenup. Paul has planned for Greenup to be in his wedding in September, but if the lockout hasn’t been lifted, Greenup will need special permission from the league to even attend.

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Chris Paul is the only player with a maximum salary on the union's executive committee.
(NBAE/Getty Images)

“The past three or four days we’ve been together all day every day because starting tomorrow I can’t talk to one of my closest friends,” Paul said.
Life promises to be awkward for Paul and most other players during the NBA’s first work stoppage since the 1998-99 lockout. The league gave team officials a long list of people connected to players that they can’t communicate with, including agents, family members, personal staff, workout guys and shoe representatives. Several sources said the league office is intent on cracking down on any violations, proposing hefty fines to teams and individuals and possibly even firings. If team officials have a chance encounter with players, they are ordered to record details of the meeting and report it.
NBA.com and team websites can’t program pictures or video of players. Employees in team ticket offices can’t mention players’ names when trying to sell season-ticket packages. One assistant coach has asked for permission for a player to be in his wedding.
“It’s crazy,” Paul said.
League and team officials can’t call, text, email or tweet players. Facebook is out, too. The league might even check phone records of team employees to ensure no contact is taking place. Spouses of team employees also have been instructed not to speak with players’ wives or girlfriends, one source said. Nor can teams help players purchase tickets to events in their arenas – like concerts – during the work stoppage.
“I told one of my coworkers that you know this is serious when we are getting briefed about it with all the vice presidents of the team in the room,” one team official said.
Many teams spent the past week working out their draft picks and free agents in anticipation of the lockout. Players aren’t allowed in team facilities during the lockout. Golden State Warriors rookies Klay Thompson(notes) and Jeremy Tyler(notes) said they planned on grabbing as much gear as possible prior to leaving.
“I’m taking everything they put in my locker,” Tyler said.
Older veteran players like Grant Hill(notes) and Jason Kidd(notes) have expressed concern about a lengthy lockout threatening the possible final seasons of their careers. But of all the players, rookies might be hurt the most. They won’t have a summer league and some of them could decide to go overseas to ensure they’re getting a check. Enes Kanter(notes) and Jonas Valanciunas(notes), who were taken by the Utah Jazz and Toronto Raptors with the third and fifth picks, respectively, have said they will consider playing overseas in a lockout.
“I’m worried about the lockout, but not to the extent where it’s overbearing and it’s weighing down on me,” said Kyrie Irving(notes), the No. 1 pick by the Cleveland Cavaliers. “I really don’t think the lockout will extend to a year. I don’t think the fans could take it. The players can’t take it. The media can’t take it. Everyone can’t take such a big hit.
“The NBA is built on tradition and that’s something that they want to hold for a while. I’m hoping that they come to an agreement soon and it doesn’t cut into my contract at all.”
Longtime NBA agent Bill Duffy said he has been telling players for 2½ years to save their money and prepare for a lockout. Duffy believes the union and players are better equipped to handle a lengthy lockout after their experience in 1998-99, when the season was shortened to 50 games. Still, Duffy also expressed concern about the hard-line stance of some owners.
“There is a new set of owners,” Duffy said. “They are more zealous in their convictions.
“The league is flourishing. It would be absurd and foolish for a long lockout.”
Paul is a member of the Players Association’s executive committee along with fellow Derek Fisher(notes) (president), Keyon Dooling(notes), Theo Ratliff(notes) and Maurice Evans(notes). He’s also the only All-Star in the group and the only player on the committee making superstar money ($16.3 million).
With endorsements from Jordan Brand and Right Guard – along with the money he’s already saved – Paul is much better positioned than most of his peers to survive a long lockout financially. Despite the financial disparity from the stars and role players, Paul said they’re still united.
Paul spent the final day before the lockout helping host a youth fitness event.
(AP photo)

“My role is very important because I give a different perspective,” Paul said. “By being the only [maximum-salaried] guy on the executive committee, I can give a perspective for Carmelo Anthony(notes), D-Wade [Dwayne Wade], LeBron [James] and stuff like that. But at the end of the day, our executive committee is a whole.”
Prior to the lockout, teams reached out to some of the noted trainers across the country like former NBA coach and player John Lucas(notes) in Houston, Chicago-based Tim Grover, Las Vegas-based Joe Abunassar and several in the Los Angeles area like Rob McClanaghan and Tony Falce. One NBA general manager said information was passed on to players about where to work out during the lockout. Lucas said about 30 players – about twice as many as usual – will work with him and other former NBA and college coaches and trainers at three sites in Houston.
“Half the league has called me asking, ‘What do you have to offer? What do you do? What players will be there?’ ” Lucas said.
Said Falce: “I’m available eight days a week out of seven.”
Some players also plan to play in pro-am leagues, including three prominent ones in Los Angeles. The Drew League in South Central L.A. currently includes Kevin Durant(notes), Ron Artest(notes), Michael Beasley(notes) and J.R. Smith(notes) among others. Rapper Snoop Dogg sometimes attends the free games at Washington Park. While the Drew League finishes play Aug. 13, commissioner Dino Smiley is considering adding a second league if the lockout hasn’t been lifted. Two other L.A. pro-am leagues (Nike Real Run and HAX Summer League) begin in mid-August. Several NBA players also play at UCLA. NBA team personnel, however, can’t attend games.
“We’re getting people cramped in the stands,” Smiley said. “Dwight Howard(notes), Zach Randolph(notes) and O.J. Mayo(notes) are supposed to play this weekend.”
One NBA GM said he spent much of Thursday speaking to his team’s players for the final time before the lockout started. He doesn’t know when he’ll talk to them again.
If the lockout lasts long, Paul plans to spend a lot of time in his hometown of Winston Salem, N.C., with his fiancé, Jada Crawley, and their young son. He might even return to Wake Forest to take some more classes toward his degree.
“It’s not just about [the owners] standing firm,” Paul said. “We’re just as firm. We’re standing together. We’re strong. We’re unified