CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

[Drewski]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So who are we to believe and who's lying?

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap..._Times_Article

Well, interesting. But at the end of the day, I don't think there's any fabrication. Just think Forbes had some inaccuracies in their numbers, and the league obviously has the data to back their claims. I highly doubt the players union would let the owners say what they are in regards to losses if they never were provided data to back the claims the owners were making (Metrics vs. The Eye anyone, lol. Stats matter see!). It's interesting but I'm not losing any sleep over Forbes having different numbers than what the Association had come up with. Or maybe I'm just an ostrich with my head buried in the ground.

[WTF]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

That's what I'm saying Drewski. I'm sure the owners brought all of their documents to the table to support their claims.

And lol at the unemployment. Seriously? Where did you hear that?

I had never thought about it. But if you go on strike, you can't draw unemployment (I don't believe), and that's very similar to what's going on here. But since the NBA initiated the lockout and not the Player's Union, who knows.

[mkharsh33]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

from what i've read, there is NO universal benchmark to how teams report their income. When the players ask for the owners to show their books, the owners won't because they don't know which books to show. it's a moving target...

...hence, a LONG lockout. again, no basketball in 2011-2012. the owners will dig their heels in deep. it will be to the players to cave in, which eventually they will reach a compromise. but wyc grousbeck of the celtics has stated he's ready to lose a year's worth of income. the owners, i believe, are staunch in this.

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Can't Forbes get in a LOT of trouble posting that stuff? I mean, if the players union and NBA have the same accounting firm looking at their books, shouldn't they be able to know that the Board isn't lying?

Since NBA teams aren't publicly traded, we don't know the actual numbers. Forbes basically does estimations with some of the data they can get. Like the can take numbers from publicly traded companies that does business with the NBA and use those numbers to make their calculations. OR they can take the numbers when a team is sold and use those numbers as a starting point. They do it every year when they do their survey of 'Most Valuable Sports Franchises". From my understanding, there are some numbers that some franchises freely give to Forbes to calculate their numbers. BUT Forbes does say that most of it is all calculations.

The only real numbers that can be obtained outside of the team accounting report is their tax filings. If someone can request the numbers from the IRS, then you'd get a closer outlook of their real financial situation. AND if the NBA(or it's teams) are lying, then look for some repercussion from the IRS for lying on it's taxes.

[HMcCoy]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

The whole idea that owners need an agreement to protect themselves from their own incompetence is simply laughable.

Winning!

[King_B_Mack]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

David Alrdridge continuing to be on point. His open letter to both parties.

Follow the link for the full article and letters.

http://www.nba.com/2011/news/features/david_aldridge/07/04/morning-tip-labor-update/

Owners want the players' union to agree to a new system where the players give back hundreds of millions of dollars in projected salary over the next decade in order to ensure that teams keep salaries in line and have a chance to make a profit. Players balk at this, saying the owners have to take more responsibility for the business decisions that they make via their general managers and basketball people.
We're caught in the middle here at NBA.com. You have no doubt noticed the scrubbing of both this website and those of the league's teams of all images and videos of the players. This was done, we were told, not to try and make people "forget" the players during the lockout, but because -- and I am quoting league spokesman Mike Bass here -- "We do not think it is appropriate to be using video and photography of current players at this time."
(The NFL, apparently, has a different philosophy, which is why you still see videos and highlights of current players on the NFL Network and NFL.com.) But we can show and write about players who are directly involved in the labor talks, like NBPA union president Derek Fisher.
What the Tip will evolve into -- whether there will be one at all, at least weekly -- is under consideration as you read. I can't write about the lockout every week; I'll get as bored writing about it as you are reading about it.
A "pox on both their houses" columns during such times are facile manipulations, designed to get you, the fan, to make an easy choice. The truth is, the owners are right, and the players are right. There wouldn't be an NBA without owners fronting the payrolls of 30 teams, covering players' salaries, assuming all of the financial risks, often going into debt. And there wouldn't be an NBA without the players, whose amazing athletic feats, and emotional and intellectual endurance, compel you every night -- compel you to buy tickets and swag, and watch on TV, and give a damn about the sport.
Having said that, both sides could stand to remember some things as the lockout commences.

Dear Owners ...

[mkharsh33]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

nba.com should put videos up of CLASSIC NBA games. The game was better years ago anyway... Elite players only made around $3 or 4 million dollars 25 years ago, and it was a better product. I know some will label me an old fuddy duddy, but the players have been WELL paid and many of them are overpaid anyway. A lot of players say they play for "the love of the game" until a new CBA needs to be agreed upon. Well, I'm pulling for the owners this time. Salaries have skyrocketed and if the NBA has to lose a season (or two) I'm all for it...

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I’m not pulling for either side. I just want basketball. However, I do have a problem when owners lay the blame of the financial problems of the NBA at the feet of the players. NBA players cannot own franchises while playing so why are the owners looking at the players like it was their fault?

Now this is not to say that the players don’t need to budge on this because they do. They actually need to make some concessions on this next CBA even though the mess that the NBA is not their fault. I actually don’t like the hardliner stance that the players are making as well. Because when the players(and owners) build this fortresses and make them stronger, then it’s the fans that actually get locked out.

Concessions on the next deal should be made EVENLY. Owners shouldn’t be asking the players to take off their pants and bend over without using Vaseline. BUT at the same time, players should not be folding their arms like kids telling them, “NO!” Some mini-deals will have to take place before the big deal is in place. And that’s not going to get done when the negotiation sessions have 20 people on one side and 30 people with ‘Unity’ tee-shirts on the other side. Both sides need to stop showboating for the media and just have two(or maybe three) representatives from both sides hammer out the deals. Take out David Stern and Billy Hunter out of the negotiating sessions. And when the session is done, present them with the options. But leave those two out of it because they’re the ones who’s dragging this thing too far.

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So now that Deron Williams will play in Turkey if the lockout is not over, they're also looking to get Kobe Bryant over there as well. Does anybody see a mass exodus of players taking their talents over seas? And if so, does that take away some leverage that the owners have?

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So now that Deron Williams will play in Turkey if the lockout is not over, they're also looking to get Kobe Bryant over there as well. Does anybody see a mass exodus of players taking their talents over seas? And if so, does that take away some leverage that the owners have?

Being discussed in the off season thread

[Altimus]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

So, if there is no season and a solid number of players go overseas, who is streaming international hoops to get their fix?

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Being discussed in the off season thread

Thanks. I was wondering why I'm surprised no one was talking about this.

[23]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Nobody really believes that crap thats why

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I don't think it's as far fetch as you may believe it is.

[joyi2011]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

News and discussion of the impending discussions and lockout go here.

This league needs fixing. Whether that fix comes from this upcoming bloodbath or not remains to be seen.

This website BBS of design is very like, the feeling is not rude