CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I'm definitely not on the Owner's side.

And I'm not on Billy Hunter nor Derek Fisher's side. Derek Fisher really sounded ignorant talking about how the players aren't dumb and they have educations. That sounded so stupid.

I think of it from the perspective of a business owner. If you don't forecast and budget correctly, multiple times a year, you will operate at a loss. It boils down to inept financial management.

I do support revenue sharing, but fair revenue sharing.

I think more should be done to allow small market teams to compete with larger markets and keep their own players...BUT...that comes with fiscal responsibility and fiscal responsibility is not part of any CBA. So the owners should stop trying to use that as a crutch.

I think the Bird Rule should stay...but up to a limit of how much over they can spend (flex cap).

I think there should not be guaranteed contracts.

I think the maximum contract should be 5 years.

I think there should be no player options or team options.

I think rookie salaries should be lowered.

I think the 1-year (college) rule and any age rule is unethical (although I would prefer if every player had one year in college- just my preference).

[LiveAllDaWay]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Players all they think about is money money money money money money. Its like,they don't care about the game anymore,just how much they get paid. I think it's greed and selfish and babies crying over money. Money is their god or something. I mean an average person would'nt be making this much they have to work hard for their money while these guys just get paid millions of dollars just for bouncing ball and shoot. I'm a big NBA fan but greed is not the answer. U go there to play ball,not to think about money. But the NBA players are still young and still doesn't understand life yet. Let me rephrase that,they haven't seen life yet. Just get whatever money they paid you and just play the game,gosh,sports is whack when it comes to something like this.

[Court_vision]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I think the players saying "we generate the revenue" is not really true overall.

The game over decades has built up to make it what it is. The game.

Even allowing for 'stars', yes they contribute a lot. Yes, if we look at Miami with LeBron and Wade, LA with Kobe...Dirk...Duncan...KG, Pierce...Chris Paul...Dwight...etc...those guys are huge and generate tonnes of $$$ as people want to see them......

But no one gives a crap if Eddie House or Juwan Howard or Sasha Vujaic or Kwayme Brown or 50% of the players are in the league. Half the guys are journeymen who come and go and are replacebale.

Those guys should be eternally greatful that the game has given them an incredible living...even one year on $5million and you are set for life.

Yet the players union is saying we need to hijack the whole thing and protect "the middle class"...why should those guys be "protected" and given 5 year $35 million type deals? What's wrong with those guys being maxxed at $4 million on short term deals and having to prove themselves yearly to get another shot at the big $?

The game owes them nothing........they owe the game everything.

And, for what it's worth, I am a big time...left wing...Union guy. But Unions were set up to protect REAL working class people on $40 000 a year with families to feed.

NOT guys on $5 million a freaking year.......the idea of a Union of MULTI- Milionaires is absolutely ridiculous.

[tehova]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I think the players saying "we generate the revenue" is not really true overall.

The game over decades has built up to make it what it is. The game.

Even allowing for 'stars', yes they contribute a lot. Yes, if we look at Miami with LeBron and Wade, LA with Kobe...Dirk...Duncan...KG, Pierce...Chris Paul...Dwight...etc...those guys are huge and generate tonnes of $$$ as people want to see them......

But no one gives a crap if Eddie House or Juwan Howard or Sasha Vujaic or Kwayme Brown or 50% of the players are in the league. Half the guys are journeymen who come and go and are replacebale.

Those guys should be eternally greatful that the game has given them an incredible living...even one year on $5million and you are set for life.

Yet the players union is saying we need to hijack the whole thing and protect "the middle class"...why should those guys be "protected" and given 5 year $35 million type deals? What's wrong with those guys being maxxed at $4 million on short term deals and having to prove themselves yearly to get another shot at the big $?

The game owes them nothing........they owe the game everything.

"the games owes them nothing.... they owe the game everything"

what does that mean in terms of negotiations?

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

"the games owes them nothing.... they owe the game everything"

what does that mean in terms of negotiations?

If they're not happy with their low-balled contract offer or minimum salary...go play in Israel or somewhere.

Look at that bum Josh Childress...came running back to the NBA and he's still garbage.

I don't fully agree with monkey but I hear him and he makes great points.

Herm Edwards (former head coach of the Jets) addressed the NFL rookies and said something that stuck out to me.

He said, "You're not bigger than that shield." (referring to the NFL logo)
"That jersey with your name on it is rented."

[tehova]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I'll go ahead and put my CBA proposal out there:

No Mid-Level Exception - if you are over the cap and cant sign players for the league minimum play with whatever number you got 10,9,8...not my problem

Contract Maximum of 3 years - The concept of a player being a "franchise player" is why the owners overspend to retain just "ok" players. They think once they get that one player they are set and can just eat off his name and talents for years and years to come...nah homie. Build a whole team and go for a championship right now, not in year 6.

[Titans4lyfe]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

If the NBA does just so happens to lose the whole 11-12 season, then how will they determine the draft order for the 2012 draft?

[Drewski]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

If the NBA does just so happens to lose the whole 11-12 season, then how will they determine the draft order for the 2012 draft?

VIA Larry Coon, CBA guru

If the lockout lasts an entire season, what will happen with the 2012 draft? How will the draft order be determined?

If the season is canceled and the sides come to an agreement by next June, the 2012 draft should go on as planned. The draft order will be a little tricky. There will be no season upon which to determine the order, and they can't just repeat the 2011 draft order -- that would "reward" teams twice for the same bad season in 2010-11.



The NHL was faced with this dilemma when it lost its 2004-05 season to a lockout. The league settled on a weighted lottery that included all 30 teams. The weighting was based on playoff appearances over the previous three seasons and first overall picks over the previous four seasons.


The NBA would likely adopt a similar system should the 2011-12 season be canceled. It would be a one-time occurrence -- the league would revert to its usual system the following year.

[23]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

The players rejected a flex cap even when owners said they'd be willing to so called "protect" the mid level players

By the way, I thought this was HILARIOUS

After Kevin Garnett(notes) delivered an inspired sermon in the NBA players union meeting a week ago, declaring his willingness to sit out the season and forfeit $18.8 million in salary, a far more measured voice spoke up with 60 rank-and-file players in a New York hotel ballroom.

Shane Battier’s(notes) question, directed to Players Association executive director Billy Hunter, was simple: The NFL’s union leader, DeMaurice Smith, had agreed to take $1 in salary for the length of the NFL lockout.

Will you do it too, Billy?
The mere suggestion seemed to offend Hunter, players witnessing the exchange privately told Yahoo! Sports. After Hunter told Battier he hadn’t given it much thought, members of the union’s executive board came to Hunter’s defense. Hunter had taken the union from the red to the black in his term, done a good job, they said. Hunter never did give Battier a firm answer, nor would he answer the question for Yahoo! Sports on Wednesday.

This is still a sore spot for some agents and players, but several union board members felt Battier was grandstanding with his question. Nevertheless, there are those in the rank-and-file who think Hunter and his executive board members have a habit of getting too snippy, too defensive with dissenting voices. If a lockout endures, these will be questions that Hunter has to answer within his union. Eventually, the players will stop getting checks in November, and if Hunter’s still getting paid … well, Battier’s voice won’t be alone.

[da ThRONe]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Why is it so many people feel like players are some how disrespecting "the game" because the want to gain the largest piece of the pie possible? Isn't that the very samething the owners want to do? At the end of the day enough people(us fans) feel passionately enough about this game and the "people who play it"(not the owners) to give up our hard eard revenue to them til it's a multi-billion dollar industry.

So right now for whatever reason the player piece of the pie is hurting the game. So this is why I'm on the owners side, because it happens to be for the advancement of the game. But I wouldn't dare call out people who most of which will have to live of this money for life trying to get as much as they can. We can say what we want, but if we were in their shoes we wouldn't just be "OK" with a 33% decrease in salary. Reguardless of what the average salaries are for firefighter or teachers. The sad reality is for most of these players especially the middle and bottom players are your life stlye reflects your pay. Some are too far along in that life stlye to take drastic cuts over night.

It's a cluster**** of everybody hurting the game. The league isn't doing a good enough job of teaching young men about their finances, Players aren't learning from past players mistakes. Owners use to own teams as a status symbol, now they want to turn profits. Players reps aren't getting on players about being smarter with their resources. PR's clearly don't have the balls or smarts to understand this pay cut is coming and the longer this plays out the less leverage they have of making that cut reasonible.

[23]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I dont think anyone can disagree these guys make too much money and there is no reason for player salaries to continue to increase more and more regardless of how much BRI is not available

[da ThRONe]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I dont think anyone can disagree these guys make too much money and there is no reason for player salaries to continue to increase more and more regardless of how much BRI is not available

I disagree with this wholeheartly. The market should dictate how much they make. Are we going to tell Warren Buffett he makes too much? There's going to be so much money generated the player should get a % of that not just a capped amount.

[23]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

The market has done that and it has been a failed model. Especially with bad economics and yes there should be some kind of curbing to what those guys can get. The NBA was jus fine before 100 million dollar contracts were being given out, and it would be fine without it again.

The market rate needs to be lowered, and guaranteed contracts need to be gone. Then you'll see people really work for their money, instead of only in a contract year.

[tehova]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I dont think anyone can disagree these guys make too much money and there is no reason for player salaries to continue to increase more and more regardless of how much BRI is not available

I would also like to disagree, no such thing as a salary being too much

[23]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Disagree all you want, but there is a lockout which means there is a problem with that thinking

They cant go on forever getting pay raises no matter what when salaries are already at an all time high for players since the NBA started

If rookies can have a max cap on their salaries, and there is already a such thing as a max contract that tells me only so much is allowed anyway.Its just operating on a scale much larger than necessary to continue on as is.