CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

[OSUFan_88]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

@OSU Not really getting the idea of a flex cap... how would that affect the nba in a positive way?

It is my understanding that it would be much the same as it is now, only there is a cap floor and a cap ceiling. And a team must always be inbetween. There is still a cap *I believe it would be $65 million* but if forces all owners to be responsible. I'd also assume that getting rid of the MLE would be a key to this, making Bird Rights more important. I think it appeases the players by not having a real solid cap and making teams spend money, but it also appeases owners by limiting to how much they can spend.

The as is offer does sound pretty solid. Maybe a miracle will occur tomorrow.

No chance. The players think they can break the owners and will try, the owners are losing money and are almost universally demanding change. I think the NFL lockout was pretty marginal in terms of solidarity and everything. But this one, the players and owners both have very strong opinions on the health of the league and how it should progress in the future. The two sides are so radically far apart in their approaches that it's going to take a very long time for either to budge.

To put it this way, I don't think we see the NBA this calendar year, and would be lucky if we saw any before next year. IMO, the earliest game that could be played would be the All-Star game.

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Honestly, I don't think a hard cap is going down whenever operations resume. I'm putting it on record now, if the NBA cancels the season I'm willing to bet you that most of the demands the owners are asking for WILL NOT be in the new CBA.

I'm already watching a parallel situation happening with this labor dispute just like the baseball labor dispute in 1994-1995. If any of you remember that one, you had the same background scenario. Inflated players salaries. Small Market vs Big Market Team argument. Over half of the teams in the league loosing money. And what was the owners demanding at that time for baseball? A hard salary cap. And as a result of the new CBA they signed in 1995, no hard cap was agreed upon. And to this day, there is still no hard cap in baseball.

I'm starting to see that the NBAPA is taking it's cue from MLBPA. They have the mentality of: *Listen! if we stick together, we'll get what we want. We'll be ridiculed by the press and public opinion. Will loose a lot of money. We might even have a season or two cancelled. But in the end, they'll succumb to our demands*

And in a way it makes sense. Because in the short term it'll hurt the players. BUT in the long run, it'll be the owners and their franchise who'll be loosing the most money. Yes, the owners are prepared for the lockout right now. BUT what's going to happen when a whole season is gone and the players are still not budging?

[Altimus]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

It is my understanding that it would be much the same as it is now, only there is a cap floor and a cap ceiling. And a team must always be inbetween. There is still a cap *I believe it would be $65 million* but if forces all owners to be responsible. I'd also assume that getting rid of the MLE would be a key to this, making Bird Rights more important. I think it appeases the players by not having a real solid cap and making teams spend money, but it also appeases owners by limiting to how much they can spend.



No chance. The players think they can break the owners and will try, the owners are losing money and are almost universally demanding change. I think the NFL lockout was pretty marginal in terms of solidarity and everything. But this one, the players and owners both have very strong opinions on the health of the league and how it should progress in the future. The two sides are so radically far apart in their approaches that it's going to take a very long time for either to budge.

To put it this way, I don't think we see the NBA this calendar year, and would be lucky if we saw any before next year. IMO, the earliest game that could be played would be the All-Star game.

Don't ruin my miracle dreams!

Deep down inside I know a lockout is coming and I know it might be long. But still, miracle FTW!

[Marino]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Personally, I think the lockout is good for the league in the long run. I could see there being no NBA next year. And I would be okay with that.

[da ThRONe]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Flex cap is the best middle ground. It all depends where they put the ceiling though. As long as it doesn't exceed 75 mil it's a really good thing. It's what I thought would happen not a hard cap, but much more solid than the current cap.

[Dice]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Personally, I think the lockout is good for the league in the long run. I could see there being no NBA next year. And I would be okay with that.

I don't see how a lockout will in anyway shape or form be good for the league. Whenever operations resume, they'll loose profits. They'll loose popularity. They'll loose TV ratings, which means they may loose some advertising money. And yes, fans will come back BUT not for a couple of years. Which is why those items I just mentioned will happen in the event of a cancelled season.

And I'm not okay with a canceled NBA season. I love watching all sports BUT NBA basketball is the first sport I fell in love with as a kid. Other sports gradually fell in line afterwords. Everybody had this 'missionary zeal' to save the NFL from their inevitable lockout. I say, **** 'em! I like football BUT if the NFL cancels their season, I'd be fine with that.

And the lunacy of the NFL labor dispute is really crazy. How are owners and players in that league going to argue over a good situation where they're making a profit. At least in the NBA, you do have claims that the league is loosing money. The NFL doesn't even make it a secret that they made $9 billion. BUT I guess the only times you have problems is when your either loosing money or making too much money.

[Marino]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

They lose less money if they don't have a season. This lockout goes deeper than just salary.

[da ThRONe]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I don't see how a lockout will in anyway shape or form be good for the league. Whenever operations resume, they'll loose profits. They'll loose popularity. They'll loose TV ratings, which means they may loose some advertising money. And yes, fans will come back BUT not for a couple of years. Which is why those items I just mentioned will happen in the event of a cancelled season.

And I'm not okay with a canceled NBA season. I love watching all sports BUT NBA basketball is the first sport I fell in love with as a kid. Other sports gradually fell in line afterwords. Everybody had this 'missionary zeal' to save the NFL from their inevitable lockout. I say, **** 'em! I like football BUT if the NFL cancels their season, I'd be fine with that.

And the lunacy of the NFL labor dispute is really crazy. How are owners and players in that league going to argue over a good situation where they're making a profit. At least in the NBA, you do have claims that the league is loosing money. The NFL doesn't even make it a secret that they made $9 billion. BUT I guess the only times you have problems is when your either loosing money or making too much money.

This^

Can't understand why anybody would be pro-lockout/cancelled season. What would cancelling the season solve that they can't fix tomorrow? The only issue here is revenue and how it's shared every other issues the league can solve on it's own.

[bigfnjoe96]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

According to NBA executives familiar with the league’s strategies, once the lockout is in place, the owners will push for a hard salary cap of $45 million, the elimination of guaranteed contracts and ask that the players swallow a 33 percent salary cut.

The concessions made in recent weeks, including the “flex cap” of $62 million and a guarantee of $2 billion in annual player payroll, will be off the table.

If this seems certain to guarantee the loss of the entire 2011-12 season, it is because there are owners who think it is necessary for the long-term viability of the league.

[SPTO]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I don't think it's a bluff. Let's face it, the NBA "cap" is a broken system and it's done more harm than good. When the league's economic outlook is on a par with the NHL's then you know you got some huge problems. The NHL's bacon has been saved by the Canadian clubs and the NBA's been saved by their TV deal and very good ratings.

Charles Barkley was at the Jays game yesterday (playing in the Joe Carter charity golf tourney today) and he was invited to the booth for a half inning. He was asked about the labor situation and basically said while he's always on the side of the players it's time that some accommodations to be made. He made the point that there's a huge recession going on and that consumers are losing money while player salaries are still going up, up, up and that it's time to even things out a bit.

Barkley then noted how screwed up the cap system is by noting in very simple and plain terms how there's a cap but in reality it's not really a cap because teams can overpay to keep their own players and how every team in the league is probably over the cap right now.

If a guy like Barkley is calling for austerity measures you know the owners have all the power in the negotiations right now.

[NYJets]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

I'll think we'll get a lockout, and there's a good chance the season won't start on time, but I don't think it gets much worse than a shortened season. I don't think the players can hold out that long.

[Marino]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Players will accept that flex cap, it'll max out around 75 million, and they will call it a day.

[tehova]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

Personally, I think the lockout is good for the league in the long run. I could see there being no NBA next year. And I would be okay with that.

Maybe i love basketball too much but i was immediately upset at this post, i mentally called you out to fight in the middle of the street in the honor of my fair lady "Ye' Nba"

[Drewski]

Players will accept that flex cap, it'll max out around 75 million, and they will call it a day.

They should. Realistically. Owners would be crazy to want that flex cap though I really don't see where that assists them. Unless they're lowering max salary guidelines but that seems like an odd way to handle things aside from making it a joke to stay "under" the cap. 75 million and non guaranteed contracts, that's a good start for both sides don't you think?

Sent from the free throw line

[da ThRONe]

Re: CBA/Lockout Discussion Thread

They should. Realistically. Owners would be crazy to want that flex cap though I really don't see where that assists them. Unless they're lowering max salary guidelines but that seems like an odd way to handle things aside from making it a joke to stay "under" the cap. 75 million and non guaranteed contracts, that's a good start for both sides don't you think?

Sent from the free throw line

It's middle ground for both owners. Not all owners want a hard cap. Teams like the Lakers, Celtics, Mavs, etc. need to have a great team to make their money.