The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

[CMH]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

Yea I don't really get all the hype for him. He might be a good coach he might not, he's a real unknown to me at this point.

At the same time, all the Rambis talk has lowered expectations. I'd pretty much be happy with anyone but him.

Agreed.

I personally like new young coaches because at least you can be 50% right.

Most teams love rehashing old coaches for whatever dumb reason. If the guy had success, sure. If he didn't, time to try someone else out.

[Jeffx]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

So according to the Daily News, Phil's running a "triangle seminar" at a secret Knicks mini-camp.

Does Phil really think A-List free agents will come here to play in this offense?

[gmac0322]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

I am completely ready for the Jackson era to be done. I never liked him. Still hold a grudge from the 90's Bulls teams lol

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[Jeffx]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

When Pat Riley came here, he knew it would be foolish to run 'Showtime'. He adjusted his style to the talent he had, but not Phil.

[gmac0322]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

The mark of a true great coach. Adapt to any talent and getting the best out them. Being able to run different systems that can work with different players. It's kind of easy to say your system is the best when you have a seasoned mj,pippin,kobe,Shaq, and prime gasol. Really easy

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[CMH]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

The mark of a true great coach. Adapt to any talent and getting the best out them. Being able to run different systems that can work with different players. It's kind of easy to say your system is the best when you have a seasoned mj,pippin,kobe,Shaq, and prime gasol. Really easy

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And those players fit the system.

The Knicks primary problem is they don't have guys capable of running the system. Melo being the biggest culprit. His game doesn't fit the style.

I like Melo but if you want to win with him, the triangle isn't the solution. It's not his game. And his surrounding teammates are mostly inept outside of Porzingis, who probably fits the system best if he's not playing the 5.

[gmac0322]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

And those players fit the system.

The Knicks primary problem is they don't have guys capable of running the system. Melo being the biggest culprit. His game doesn't fit the style.

I like Melo but if you want to win with him, the triangle isn't the solution. It's not his game. And his surrounding teammates are mostly inept outside of Porzingis, who probably fits the system best if he's not playing the 5.

I agree. So then you tweak the system to your personal. Grant isn't really a triangle guy either. Anything is better than forcing your non working system over and over again. Try something new. Be open minded. Stop living off your 11 championships as a defense.

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[CMH]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

I agree. So then you tweak the system to your personal. Grant isn't really a triangle guy either. Anything is better than forcing your non working system over and over again. Try something new. Be open minded. Stop living off your 11 championships as a defense.

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Agreed on coaches. The best coaches, as you said, adapt to their players.

I like to include Jackson in the Mt Rushmore of coaches. I think 11 rings regardless of talent level allows you that designation with Pop, Auerbach and Holzman. But Jackson's strength in creating a winning team culture opposes his weakness in adapting the offense for his talent. Jackson is a good coach for a team that's right there but not sure you can build a winning culture from the ground up. It needs to grow a bit on its own first.

[Hassan Darkside]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

I wouldn't really say that all of those guys fit the system. Phil was a firm believer in the system but a capable enough coach that he was able to get those guys to buy in to it and maximize their potential. MJ himself was quite the critic of it early on and nobody thought the Bulls would win with MJ's playstyle.

The triangle may or may not be the solution, but I wouldn't even say it's the problem either. I'm not sure if our roster would have won 40 games with any other coach or any other system last season, to be honest. The bigger problem is that we have yet to court a successful and semi-competent coach who can maximize the ability of his players in the triangle and quite frankly, Rambis/Fisher made the triangle look bad.

And for what it's worth, between two full seasons in Minny and a half season here, Rambis won 41 games. Luke Walton won 39 this season.

[gmac0322]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

If we are going to go that way. Woodson won over 50 games and a division title. Even 18 and 3 down the stretch of an injury ridden season. Anyone could've done what Walton did the first part of this year with that roster. Shoot Mark Jackson did all of the heavy lifting for the Warriors. Kerr just was there at the right time.

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[CMH]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

I wouldn't really say that all of those guys fit the system. Phil was a firm believer in the system but a capable enough coach that he was able to get those guys to buy in to it and maximize their potential. MJ himself was quite the critic of it early on and nobody thought the Bulls would win with MJ's playstyle.

The triangle may or may not be the solution, but I wouldn't even say it's the problem either. I'm not sure if our roster would have won 40 games with any other coach or any other system last season, to be honest. The bigger problem is that we have yet to court a successful and semi-competent coach who can maximize the ability of his players in the triangle and quite frankly, Rambis/Fisher made the triangle look bad.

And for what it's worth, between two full seasons in Minny and a half season here, Rambis won 41 games. Luke Walton won 39 this season.[emoji38]

Oh definitely don't think any other system gets these guys into the playoffs.

First and foremost this is a bad roster. That's just how it is.

But I think some systems and coaches would at least get more out of the guys which is what you're saying.

I think we are at the same conclusion, we just took different words there.

[Hassan Darkside]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

Yeah. I kind of side with Phil on the Triangle, but there's no Phil Jackson's out there in the coaching pool to bring in to teach it.

I think that's part of his stubbornness and refusal to go outside of his guys, because he doesn't believe Rambis has had a fair shot.

Looking into the future, do you guys think we should just tank next season?

[gmac0322]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

Maybe. It's not like Phil will be here after the contract is up

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[CMH]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

I don't know if this team can avoid tanking by accident.

Fans will be disappointed again if they expect this franchise to land major free agents this off season. It's going to be more of the same. Meetings with guys. Rejections. And settling for role players.

Probably another 30+ win season and that's it. At least they'll have a first.

[ehh]

Re: The 2016 New York Knicks: Now that we're done tanking...

I'm okay with us bottoming out again now that we have our picks. Let Melo move on and focus on building the team around Porzingis.

The only issue is that Phil is out of here in three years but he'll spend his remaining time building a team designed to run the Triangle. The regime after Phil will throw the Triangle in the trash ASAP and implement a more modern system.