Boxing Off-Topic

[sheredia]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Yeah, Oscar just had to wait for the PBC to fold to become an even better promoter!!! What a guy!!!

and to be honest, to have a retired legend (going for 50-0) against a UFC fighter (in his pro debut) to be as big as it was, should say quite a bit about the state of boxing right now.....cotto deserves a shot at the winner for his last fight. he deserves to get paid. then after that, maybe a canelo-GGG rematch.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

It's his promotion. Get Lemieux and Cotto together, are try to get a Golden Boy fighter versus someone else. Get it done and sell it-that's promoting. Take yourself to a level above Mayweather-Conor which you've (Oscar) been griping about for months.

Cotto just fought three weeks ago, against Kamegai on the same night as Mayweather-McGregor. Not possible.

Lemieux would be a good, fan-friendly addition to the card. He hasn't fought since May. But who would you pair him against in the Golden Boy stable that wouldn't be a blowout?

And how does me not caring about Oscar's business plan ring hollow?? I REALLY REALLY REALLY don't care about his business plan unless I'm getting a share. It is what it is. I don't care that his plan is predicated on not having quality name fighters in his stable. Start promoting them or get new fighters. Ring Hollow!!!??? Give me a break.

It rings hollow because you're bitching about a supposedly poor undercard without noticing that Golden Boy has a shallow stable of elite fighters, one of whom (Cotto) isn't available for a fight tomorrow night. Plus Cotto -- whose ego is enormous, even by boxing standards -- still considers himself a main event PPV fighter. He never would fight as a B-side on a PPV. Ever.

Oscar is promoting Canelo, who arguably is the biggest box office star in boxing now that Mayweather supposedly has retired. Problem is, his stable is shallow right now, and that's exactly why he's promoting his best prospects on a big stage Saturday night. Smart business. And what's wrong with us seeing an emerging star at the ground level?

"Get new fighters" is a quaint idea. It's also naive. It's not that easy, especially when Haymon is paying fighters big bucks not to fight as part of his PBC Ponzi scheme.

Boxing and business are intertwined, especially due to the turf wars between the three major promoters. You're not really following the sport if you don't at least pay some attention to its business landscape.

This isn't UFC, where one man controls everything. Dana White can call all of the shots and order any fight he wants, with no competition and little resistance. That's why elite MMA fighters make peanuts compared to elite boxers: There's no competition among promoters.

Great for MMA fans, no doubt. But lousy for the fighters, and it's why you hear more and more grumbling about a fighters' union or a rival sanctioning body in MMA.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Yeah, Oscar just had to wait for the PBC to fold to become an even better promoter!!! What a guy!!!

Haymon is paying his top guys big money to ... wait for it ... not fight. It's tough for any other promoter, who doesn't have $450 million of Waddell & Reed investment cash to burn, to compete with that.

It's not just Oscar, either. Arum and Top Rank also have lost fighters to the PBC chicanery.

The $450 million slush fund is almost burned to the ground. So the PBC house of cards will fold soon.

If you want to rip a promoter, rip Haymon and PBC. They have done NOTHING to promote or grow boxing. They have foisted crap fights -- with a few exceptions -- on a slew of garbage networks. Hans Zimmer music, solo ring walks and referee head cam aren't cutting it when you match your fighters soft once or twice per year, Al.

True boxing fans can see through the smokescreen.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

and to be honest, to have a retired legend (going for 50-0) against a UFC fighter (in his pro debut) to be as big as it was, should say quite a bit about the state of boxing right now.....cotto deserves a shot at the winner for his last fight. he deserves to get paid. then after that, maybe a canelo-GGG rematch.

I'm down with that plan!

Cotto has said he has one more fight and wants to fight in San Juan before the end of the year. But I bet he would delay that finale for a few months if he could get the winner of Saturday night's fight early in 2018 in Vegas or Madison Square Garden.

One problem, though: It probably wouldn't be a very good fight. Cotto always has been a blown-up welterweight. Golovkin is a true middleweight, and Canelo is growing into that weight class very nicely. Combine his smaller size and fading skills, and I think Cotto gets blown out by either fighter in the ring Saturday.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Prediction time for GGG-Canelo:

This is a true 50-50 fight.

GGG has more power, but he has shown increasing vulnerability to getting hit when fighting stiffer foes. Canelo is an excellent counterpuncher with solid power, which could deter GGG from constantly attacking.

Canelo looks HUGE for this fight. He really has bulked up. I don't think he's jacked up because he thinks a knockout is the only avenue to victory. He probably added muscle because he knows this could be a brutal, inside fight. GGG throws a lot of punches for a middleweight and rarely relents in his attack. He's happy to hit arms, shoulders and hips to break down a man before dropping TNT on his jaw.

One big plus of this fight: Both guys are TREMENDOUS body punchers who love to throw upstairs-downstairs combinations. Don't be surprised to see this fight end on a paralyzing liver shot. You will see two of the most skilled practitioners of body punching in the Sweet Science Saturday night.

The difference in this fight to me is the lead hand of both guys, not their power hand. Golovkin has a jackhammer left jab; Canelo has a tremendous lead left hook. I think GGG will be able to use that jab as an offensive weapon, not just a range finder, more often than Canelo can get off lead left hooks, which could be decisive.

One more fact to consider, sadly. This is a Golden Boy card. Canelo is the franchise fighter for Golden Boy. So expect the judges to side with Canelo in any close decision, as promoters inexplicably pay judges in boxing, not the state commissions.

More ominous news for GGG if the fight goes the distance and is close: Dave Moretti and Adelaide Byrd are among the three judges from the Nevada commission working the big bout tomorrow night.

Byrd is unbelievably inept. She has a history of head-scratching, wide decisions favoring the losing fighter. She's so bad that Top Rank has requested that she doesn't work its top fights.

Moretti has a history of going with the house fighter in nearly every close bout. That would be Canelo, Golden Boy's franchise, in this fight.

Sad reality. But keep an eye on the scores from these two judges late tomorrow night if the fight is close and the outcome is disputed. A split decision favoring Canelo in which Moretti and Byrd give Canelo a wide margin while the other judge gives Golovkin a close decision is VERY possible.

Byrd is a clown. Moretti can be influenced.

Ugh. Hopefully the power in both fighters' hands makes the judges' decisions irrelevant.

[aholbert32]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Lomo vs. Rigondaeux - Dec 9 at MSG.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Lomo vs. Rigondaeux - Dec 9 at MSG.

A fight for the purists. Excellent fight, but it won't thrill the casuals because Rigo is so damn technical and cautious.

I hope Lomachenko obliterates him. Loma is becoming more of a showman, less afraid of risk. He still doesn't have much power, but his technique, pressure and talent startle with their brilliance.

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Cotto just fought three weeks ago, against Kamegai on the same night as Mayweather-McGregor. Not possible.

Lemieux would be a good, fan-friendly addition to the card. He hasn't fought since May. But who would you pair him against in the Golden Boy stable that wouldn't be a blowout?

How easily could they have put Cotto on this card instead of on HBO free? Yes, it was very possible, if they had planned in advance. Having said that Cotto was off for a long time so no way was he going in against Lemieux.

If you want to rip a promoter, rip Haymon and PBC. They have done NOTHING to promote or grow boxing. They have foisted crap fights -- with a few exceptions -- on a slew of garbage networks. Hans Zimmer music, solo ring walks and referee head cam aren't cutting it when you match your fighters soft once or twice per year, Al.

True boxing fans can see through the smokescreen.

Wow, I thought I was a true boxing fan. Comment on that further PK if you were referring to me.

I'll rip any promoter for not delivering what I think are the goods. I will never question anyone's boxing fans credentials in this forum (including yours) because I disagree with them!!!

EDIT: Come on PK, I know you didn't mean I wasn't a true boxing fan. Just the heat of the battle stuff-It's cool.

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

It rings hollow because you're bitching about a supposedly poor undercard without noticing that Golden Boy has a shallow stable of elite fighters, one of whom (Cotto) isn't available for a fight tomorrow night. Plus Cotto -- whose ego is enormous, even by boxing standards -- still considers himself a main event PPV fighter. He never would fight as a B-side on a PPV. Ever.

I don't care about his business plan!! I'm just telling the truth!! That's all!!

So I'm bitching about a "supposedly" poor undercard unnecessarily because we should grade Oscar's promotion on a curve because of his shallow stable. I guess if he had a deep stable it would be a poor or terrible undercard. Yeah you're probably right about Cotto.

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

"Get new fighters" is a quaint idea. It's also naive. It's not that easy, especially when Haymon is paying fighters big bucks not to fight as part of his PBC Ponzi scheme.

Boxing and business are intertwined, especially due to the turf wars between the three major promoters. You're not really following the sport if you don't at least pay some attention to its business landscape.

The condescending nature of your posts is startling. Once again your penchant for stating the obvious (promoter turf wars) and making it your own revelation is mind-boggling. To suggest that I don't know about promoter infighting in boxing or its basic economic structure is either disingenuous or you don't read my posts. I'm fascinated by it, right down to the fighters' purses. That aside, isn't it snobbish to suggest that those less informed about boxing economics are not boxing fans??

My quaint idea (oh the condensation please stop!!!) about Delahoya getting new fighters is a counter to your cheerleading for GoldenBoy and obviously said tongue in cheek. HE SHOULD ALREADY HAVE MORE NAME FIGHTERS!!!! I realize that's not easy but I'm not talking ten or 15, I thinking 3 or 4.

EDIT: It's still all cool PK. Maybe I was a little opinionated at the beginning. Haven't read all of them....tired..

EDIT 2: The undercard for GGG-Can supposedly sucks.

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Well, I can't get to sleep so here goes.

What was the exact reason GGG couldn't land the left hook to the body on Jacobs? I realize he respected Daniel's power but is that something Canelo can use or was Gennady just not fully clicking.

Will Canelo be slowed by the added muscle? How much more punching power will he have or will the extra bulk serve as more of a shock absorber for the heavier GGG blows?

Does the good big man beats the good little man theory apply here given Canelo's physique vs Golovkin?


BIG-little


little-BIG

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Sorry for the thread hijack guys. I'm done.

Is everyone getting the fight?

[Money99]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

I'm down with that plan!

Cotto has said he has one more fight and wants to fight in San Juan before the end of the year. But I bet he would delay that finale for a few months if he could get the winner of Saturday night's fight early in 2018 in Vegas or Madison Square Garden.

One problem, though: It probably wouldn't be a very good fight. Cotto always has been a blown-up welterweight. Golovkin is a true middleweight, and Canelo is growing into that weight class very nicely. Combine his smaller size and fading skills, and I think Cotto gets blown out by either fighter in the ring Saturday.

I would actually pursue a criminal charge against anyone who would out Cotto in the ring with either guy - especially GGG.
He could very well sustain serious cerebral damage.

Sent from my LG-K210 using Operation Sports mobile app

[Money99]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Read a report that Alvarez was winded trying to lose a few extra ounces prior to the weigh in.
Muscle requires a lot of oxygen when stressed.
Golovkin has a true fighters build. Alvarez looks like he's built for a power lifting competition.

I could very well be wrong about this, but I think GGG wins this fight by KO.
I don't think Alvarez has the power to back him up or stop him.

The only chance Alvarez has is if GGG has aged.
If not, he will get destroyed.

Sent from my LG-K210 using Operation Sports mobile app

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

I would actually pursue a criminal charge against anyone who would out Cotto in the ring with either guy - especially GGG.
He could very well sustain serious cerebral damage.

Don't blame him for going for a final big payday, but he's not going to beat Canelo and then the cerebral damage thing with GGG. I would not pay for either fight.