Westworld (HBO)

[Money99]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

From episode one, I suspected Bernard was a host. He made a comment then like, "When I first started here..." And it was lacking much detail. To me, I saw it as he didn't even know how long long ago was.

Since then every episode just provided more and more hints such as his backstory being so important when Teddy received his, or Ford always referencing the dead son as if demanding Bernard focus on something new.

Plus Bernard made a lot of jokes about being a host. Side comments like, "maybe it's the way my mind works." "I feel I understand the hosts more than the humans." "It's just part of my technology." Maybe it was subtle but if you already suspected it, it was thrown in your face quite often.

As for did Bernard exist before. I think he did.

Spoiler

But not as Bernard. I strongly believe scenes with Bernard in his all black clothing are him as Arnold before Arnold died.

I assume we will watch Bernard learning about the undocumented hosts again. This will throw off the audience. Oh man, how many times has Bernard stumbled on this find?

But it wouldn't be happening again. It will actually be the first time Arnold (who Bernard is based on) discovers what Ford is doing. This leads to their big disagreement and Ford will refer to Bernard as Arnold in the big jaw drop moments.

And all of this will be happening in an episode where Bernard steps outside to "check on Elsie". Except it will actually be when Arnold dies.

Spoiler

So do you think the Board is actually on Ford's side?

Perhaps Theresa suspected something odd was happening and started backing-up code and contacted the board.
They come in, fool Theresa into going to the cabin with Bernard and Ford and get her out of the way?

I hope they reveal more about the maze too.
And after last night's episode I think it's fairly obvious that William is the MiB. He loves the parks 'reality' more than his own and wants to live there forever.
Maybe he even wants to be a host.
I'm looking forward to his backstory. How does he go from a caring, thoughtful person, who is clearly in love with Dolores, to raping her in the barn?

[CMH]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

Spoiler

So do you think the Board is actually on Ford's side?

Perhaps Theresa suspected something odd was happening and started backing-up code and contacted the board.
They come in, fool Theresa into going to the cabin with Bernard and Ford and get her out of the way?

I hope they reveal more about the maze too.
And after last night's episode I think it's fairly obvious that William is the MiB. He loves the parks 'reality' more than his own and wants to live there forever.
Maybe he even wants to be a host.
I'm looking forward to his backstory. How does he go from a caring, thoughtful person, who is clearly in love with Dolores, to raping her in the barn?

Spoiler

I'm speculating here, but I think Ford has control of the board in some way. I don't know if everyone on the board is a host or human, but it would make sense to me that Ford has the voting edge because most are hosts.

I've seen the theory that the board putting up a fight against Ford is a loop he's created to stir up drama and keep human staff on their toes. But I think that's a weird theory.

I believe someone there wants control of the company because that's life and someone always wants what you own. But I doubt we see that anytime soon. I think that's one of those deeper season 2 or 3 type of storylines when the writers dive deep into the business side of things.

Re: William is the MiB. Yes, I think that's the next bombshell and the dots are beginning to connect a lot.

I have seen some people complain that Bernard as a host or William as the MiB are too obvious. But, how many people listen to podcasts or go to reddit or read VanityFair? I bet that the population that guessed these things, or reads theories is incredibly small.

Just today I've seen several people on reddit say they were blown away by the Bernard is a host reveal. Not everyone reads the theories or has any idea. It's easy to get lost in our information bubble and think that the writers aren't doing a good job.

Also, who says MiB raped Dolores? For a show that's not afraid to show us everything, it's curious they didn't show that. I think something else happened in that barn.

Don't believe everything you see on this show.

Did you notice that the door wasn't there when Theresa and Bernard entered the home. Only when Theresa mentioned it did the camera pan over to reveal a door?

We are constantly watching things from the perspective of the hosts and we already know a lot of things "don't look like anything at all."

[fistofrage]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

I can see this show going way beyond Westworld. If Theresa had intimate interaction with Bernard and did not know he was a host, then what happens if some of these hosts get outside of Westworld?

The Hosts can be programmed to not even know they are hosts. They could potentially have the same amount of data in their backstories that real humans do. I'm not sure how they program them to reason, but they certainly can.

Their only limitation seems to be the default slider set and the fact that humans control that. Jack the sliders all the way up and give the host a computer and he could probably rule the world.

[jeremym480]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

Spoiler

Just today I've seen several people on reddit say they were blown away by the Bernard is a host reveal. Not everyone reads the theories or has any idea. It's easy to get lost in our information bubble and think that the writers aren't doing a good job.

I think the writers are doing a good job even though some of the reveals seem telegraphed. I mean, I've suspected that Bernard was a host for weeks, but when he said "what door" I still lost my ****.

As far as some of the other theories

Spoiler

1)I'm all aboard the William is the MiB train.
2) I'm also all in on Bernard is Arnold (Bernarnold) and the multiple timeline theories.
3) I'm sure that Ford will turn Theresa into a host and more than likely already has multiple host on the board, possibly including Charlotte.

I have some more theories that I'm considering, but I need to see more before throwing them out there.

[fistofrage]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

I think the writers are doing a good job even though some of the reveals seem telegraphed. I mean, I've suspected that Bernard was a host for weeks, but when he said "what door" I still lost my ****.

As far as some of the other theories

Spoiler

1)I'm all aboard the William is the MiB train.
2) I'm also all in on Bernard is Arnold (Bernarnold) and the multiple timeline theories.
3) I'm sure that Ford will turn Theresa into a host and more than likely already has multiple host on the board, possibly including Charlotte.

I have some more theories that I'm considering, but I need to see more before throwing them out there.

When I went to Chicago as a kid, I put 25 cents into a machine and it created a wax german submarine for me right infront of my eyes, I was in awe. That's all I can think of when I see the host machines going to work and how simple it appears to make a host. Given that we have 3d printing now and they are starting to figure out how to print human flesh, I can only imagine what a few hundred years in the future would bring. I am assuming that its at least a few hundred years in the future.

So when you say that they might turn Theresa into a host, why stop there. If you are pulling the strings, hosts are infinitely more predictable than humans.

[jeremym480]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

When I went to Chicago as a kid, I put 25 cents into a machine and it created a wax german submarine for me right infront of my eyes, I was in awe. That's all I can think of when I see the host machines going to work and how simple it appears to make a host. Given that we have 3d printing now and they are starting to figure out how to print human flesh, I can only imagine what a few hundred years in the future would bring. I am assuming that its at least a few hundred years in the future.

So when you say that they might turn Theresa into a host, why stop there. If you are pulling the strings, hosts are infinitely more predictable than humans.

There's no reason to stop there. For all we know people on the board and in the control room are host. I'm not ruling anyone out as a host at this point. I think there's a possibility that Ford himself is the first rogue host. With a Nolan brother involved, I'm fully expecting another Inception level mind warp.

I also agree with your previous post about things going beyond Westworld. I think this could be like some of the recent sci-fi movies the first movie kind of sets the stage, then by the end, the big reveal is things are much bigger than they seem. That's really the only way I can see this thing going for 4-5 seasons.

[fistofrage]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

There's no reason to stop there. For all we know people on the board and in the control room are host. I'm not ruling anyone out as a host at this point. I think there's a possibility that Ford himself is the first rogue host. With a Nolan brother involved, I'm fully expecting another Inception level mind warp.

I also agree with your previous post about things going beyond Westworld. I think this could be like some of the recent sci-fi movies the first movie kind of sets the stage, then by the end, the big reveal is things are much bigger than they seem. That's really the only way I can see this thing going for 4-5 seasons.

The skies the limit, I can't even imagine where this story could take us.

I agree with you at this point, there is no telling who exactly is a host. I will have to pay more attention to the dialogue and the details.

I see this as kind of a planet of the apes scenario. Where they had everything contained to one place and under control but one gets really smart alters the behavior of others
and they can't contain it and everything gets flipped.

The Hosts have every single advantage except the fact that they can probably be hacked or just universally shut down somehow, but other than that, if you can't even tell who the host is, how do you contain them, especially if they are playing a long end game and infiltrate places of power.

I'm just talking out loud though. We may see 5 seasons within the park, but given Maeve is already talking about getting out basically through the front door, we will see.

[mestevo]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

Apparently one of the actors has said that we get all the answers and then are pointed at something else by the end of the season.

Article about it mentioned things about the original story that I never knew about, kind of wish I didn't read it:

Spoiler

Roman World, Medieval World

http://comicbook.com/2016/11/15/west...eline-details/

[fistofrage]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

That makes sense. I mean if you had the technology why just limit it to Westworld. Unless of course there were only very few people who knew how to employ the technology and the Western thing was their passion. It looks like they have done everything they can to protect their proprietary information.

Which of course leads back to why so many of the employees are hosts. You can't trust humans to stay loyal forever.

[mjavon]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

Also notable, in the William & Delores storyline. Delores made that painting, and then they *happened* upon a place that looks exactly like it. Whether she realized it or not, she was drawing it from memory.... she's been there before. But when?

[Money99]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

I rebuke the notion that this show will move beyond the park.
I need my Bullet! Bullet! Gun! Gun!!!

*But I could totally see this happening too. I wonder if they would even introduce other theme parks? Perhaps Ford's vision doesn't include the Old West?

[daflyboys]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

I rebuke the notion that this show will move beyond the park.
I need my Bullet! Bullet! Gun! Gun!!!

*But I could totally see this happening too. I wonder if they would even introduce other theme parks? Perhaps Ford's vision doesn't include the Old West?

That was the case in the original movie. I don't recall what the other parks were other than something like a medieval world. If you watch this trailer, you see glimpses of a ancient Rome/Greece world too.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/pmbYjVy9Xcg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

(and I didn't recall Gene Roddenberry's wife was in this movie as well!)

[jake44np]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

That was the case in the original movie. I don't recall what the other parks were other than something like a medieval world. If you watch this trailer, you see glimpses of a ancient Rome/Greece world too.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/pmbYjVy9Xcg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

(and I didn't recall Gene Roddenberry's wife was in this movie as well!)

The original movie had, Westworld, a Medieval World European city and an ancient Roman city.

[marshallfever]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

My, my ,my, I'm finally all caught up and !!!!!!. I tried my best to avoid spoilers, and fan theories as I started the show. I was really hoping they weren't going to go the predictable route of tricking us with a host we thought was human, but they did and it landed soo well.!!! Like people before mentioned the simple line Bernard through out about hosts not seeing things they're not programmed to then immediately saying "what door" landed soo well.

After that ep, I finally decided to do some reading on theories and I would of never guessed about multiple times lines. I found it really strange that in ep 5, the MIB kills the guy he dragged with him for two eps only for him to reappear mins later as the cartel leader in that city. But now it makes so much more sense.

After the Bernard reveal, I also think, Bernard is based off Arnold, which would explain the Dolores scenes and why they feel so out of place

[mjavon]

Re: Westworld (HBO)

So this episode pretty much puts the multiple timeline theory to rest, no?