Terrorism in Orlando

[DamnYanks2]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Nobody wants to go boots on the ground. But do we have a choice now? In my eyes what happened was an act of war. That's it, the higher ups need to grow some balls and take care of this, and stop giving us the run around.

49 people are dead, it's time for justice.

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[Fresh Tendrils]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

What do you think we've been doing over in ME for the past 20 years? Boots or drones have been over there doing "justice" for awhile now.

[kehlis]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Alright guys, we're venturing a bit off keel at this point.

[DamnYanks2]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

I can't say anything much more, because I'm not trying to derail this thread. But drone strikes will not defeat anyone, this current strategy is failing.

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[Chip Douglass]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Nobody wants to go boots on the ground. But do we have a choice now? In my eyes what happened was an act of war. That's it, the higher ups need to grow some balls and take care of this, and stop giving us the run around.

49 people are dead, it's time for justice.

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We're literally conducting tens of thousands of airstrikes right now; we're responsible for, like, 80% of the airstrikes against ISIL even though we're in a ~60 country anti-ISIL "coalition". Rather than having yet another American ground presence in the Middle East (a presence that played a huge role in creating ISIS in the first place, it should be said), I would say it's time for the Arab countries, who actually have more at stake against ISIS, to share some of the military burden. Saudi Arabia has the world's 3rd or 4th largest defense budget...and they're carrying out 1 airstrike per month.

And yes, as terrible as ISIS is, we need to keep a proper perspective on this. You're still statistically more likely to drown in your bathtub than be killed by an ISIS terrorist. You can't overreact to terrorism. Terrorism is meant precisely to provoke an overreaction and it's what led the US to militarily intervene on a huge scale in the Middle East after 9/11.

EDIT: I hope I didn't cross a line here, but the conversation in this thread has been civil with good points made all around, and I always viewed the TOS ban on political talk as more of a prohibition on red state/blue state nonsense than discussion on world affairs.

[daflyboys]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

We're literally conducting tens of thousands of airstrikes right now....

Sorry, but that figure has to be challenged.....

[DamnYanks2]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

I want to make it clear I don't fear isis, and we shouldn't buy into the media hype and the fear mongering.

With that said, they are still a threat, Yes I'm well aware that I have about a .0.01 percent chance ever being involved in a mass shooting, and way more likely to die in a car accident.

But we can take necessary steps in the right direction, we can't just sit idly by when these things happen.

There are terrorist networks that have been allowed to grow right here, they are allowed to engage in pro Isis forums. We need to shut that down. There needs to be a low tolerance for anything that supports that thinking.

Drone strikes can never win a war, there has to be a coordinated ground operation. It is the only way.

It should also be common sense that anybody on the terror watch list can not legally buy a gun.

These ****ers are given too much leeway, it's time to crack down hard on this organization.

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[Chip Douglass]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Sorry, but that figure has to be challenged.....

http://www.defense.gov/News/Special-...herent-Resolve

The Pentagon's own numbers as of June 1st: 12,685 coalition airstrikes against ISIL in Iraq and Syria; 9,663 of them are American airstrikes, or 76% of the total.

[Cusefan]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Boots on the ground is a very, very bad idea. Sending in a occupation force will get American troops killed(lots of them). The name of the game is to not only defeat ISIS but to minimize casualties. ISIS will get their shots in but sending thousands of troops to Syria or Iraq will result is massively more people being killed.

Not to mention that ISIS will just go underground. When Al Qaeda was in Iraq they tried going toe to toe with the US military and got decimated so they staged a very successful guerrilla war, ISIS will do the exact same thing and there is nothing the US Military can do about it.

[LambertandHam]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Palm Beach Post is reporting that Mateen was gay himself.

[daflyboys]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

http://www.defense.gov/News/Special-...herent-Resolve

The Pentagon's own numbers as of June 1st: 12,685 coalition airstrikes against ISIL in Iraq and Syria; 9,663 of them are American airstrikes, or 76% of the total.

Ok, well 10's of thousands can make that seem like a helluva lot more, but let's not mince words. Even with 12K+ airstrikes it would seem like there would be a much greater dent into the ISIS strongholds so this is now making me wonder the types of strikes they are and the strategy/magnitude of them.

To put it in perspective, if there was 1 air strike every 5 secs, that would be 12 air strikes / min. That would mean 1,000 mins. of strikes or over 16 and a half constant hours of air strikes, 1 coming every 5 secs. That's a helluva lot..... so where is the effectiveness?

[slickdtc]

Terrorism in Orlando

Boots on the ground is a very, very bad idea. Sending in a occupation force will get American troops killed(lots of them). The name of the game is to not only defeat ISIS but to minimize casualties. ISIS will get their shots in but sending thousands of troops to Syria or Iraq will result is massively more people being killed.

Not to mention that ISIS will just go underground. When Al Qaeda was in Iraq they tried going toe to toe with the US military and got decimated so they staged a very successful guerrilla war, ISIS will do the exact same thing and there is nothing the US Military can do about it.

Yeah I don't see an effective end to this group without creating a lot of problems for ourselves. I mean, we've been playing this game for how long with a couple different villains, but things just get worse and the resentment for us having our hands over there builds. It's been said that our involvement for decades there has spawned groups like this. What sick irony.

It's so delicate but we're already so deep in it too. You can't wipe them off the map, but you can't sit back and eat **** either. I don't know what to do.

Regarding the Orlando attack, I guess details are still coming out but this was one guy with a gun. 49 people, plus another 50+ hurt. 1 man, over 100 victims whether killed or injured. That is NOT good and that's what has scared me for years, someone going out guns blazing and just mowing people down. Big crowded, dark, loud place like a nightclub was the perfection concoction for mass violence. Think about someone doing this at the mall during the holidays, or down a busy city street. It's crazy man.

[DamnYanks2]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Palm Beach Post is reporting that Mateen was gay himself.

Holy plot twist. This is starting to get stranger.

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[SPTO]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Holy plot twist. This is starting to get stranger.

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Yeah, this came out yesterday. Apparently he was a regular at Pulse and was using a gay dating app. This is pretty complicated all the way around.

[gerg1234]

Re: Terrorism in Orlando

Boots on the ground is a very, very bad idea. Sending in a occupation force will get American troops killed(lots of them). The name of the game is to not only defeat ISIS but to minimize casualties. ISIS will get their shots in but sending thousands of troops to Syria or Iraq will result is massively more people being killed.

Not to mention that ISIS will just go underground. When Al Qaeda was in Iraq they tried going toe to toe with the US military and got decimated so they staged a very successful guerrilla war, ISIS will do the exact same thing and there is nothing the US Military can do about it.

ISIS can't go underground. If they lose their territory they lose their Caliph. That's their entire claim for their existence. They don't operate like Al-Qaeda at all. They're completely different.

That said, it's a bad situation all around and I'm glad I don't have to make any decisions.