Werewolf XCVIII - 24 Day Game Over - Post 2899

[DaddyTorgo]

i have thoughts on everyone else in the game, with some sort of roadmap

i have probably somewhere around ~40% of the remaining people in the game on a "high trust" list - of those 1 is lower than the others, 1 i could see being a wolf and using their power to buy my trust, 1 could be the same way but the chances are much smaller IMO, and the rest are totally clear.

2 people have claimed powers that we cannot verify publicly (or me privately for that matter). 1 person i haven't heard from all. 3 people have roles it would be difficult (but not impossible) to test publicly. 2 people pushed quickly (via PM) to use their powers against autumn last night (might be nothing but might be something). the rest of the people in the game there are conceivably ways for them to demonstrate their power publicly and move onto the high-trust list.

[DaddyTorgo]

i wouldn't share the complete picture and all thoughts with everyone on the "totally clear" list though. just to be clear.

[saldana]

interesting that you're pushing for me to reveal info when nobody (including me) has heard much of anything from you at all the whole game.


first, i am not pushing for anything, i am just saying i am concerned that we have all our eggs in the daddytorgo basket, and that the wolves could be using you to try to hide themselves.

second, no, i havent sent you (or anyone else) any of my 4 pms...havent seen a reason to, or a value it in...nothing can be confirmed, and it has been my experience that more problems come from sharing with someone you dont trust 100% than not sharing at all (a fact that you have proven two nights in a row)

[Passacaglia]

i have thoughts on everyone else in the game, with some sort of roadmap

i have probably somewhere around ~40% of the remaining people in the game on a "high trust" list - of those 1 is lower than the others, 1 i could see being a wolf and using their power to buy my trust, 1 could be the same way but the chances are much smaller IMO, and the rest are totally clear.

2 people have claimed powers that we cannot verify publicly (or me privately for that matter). 1 person i haven't heard from all. 3 people have roles it would be difficult (but not impossible) to test publicly. 2 people pushed quickly (via PM) to use their powers against autumn last night (might be nothing but might be something). the rest of the people in the game there are conceivably ways for them to demonstrate their power publicly and move onto the high-trust list.

We've got 20 players left? So 40% of them is 5. But 3 of them you seem to have questions about. So it sounds more like you've got high trust in 2, and medium trust in 3, IMO. Obviously, though, I don't know the specifics.

[DaddyTorgo]

so my thinking today would be to go after the person who i've heard nothing from or one of the two people who have roles whose effects cannot be observed publicly.

[DaddyTorgo]

We've got 20 players left? So 40% of them is 5. But 3 of them you seem to have questions about. So it sounds more like you've got high trust in 2, and medium trust in 3, IMO. Obviously, though, I don't know the specifics.

well then my math on the % is off, cuz your numbers are not correct (i don't want to narrow it down too much more). i have high trust in between somewhere between 0-6 people

[Passacaglia]

first, i am not pushing for anything, i am just saying i am concerned that we have all our eggs in the daddytorgo basket, and that the wolves could be using you to try to hide themselves.

second, no, i havent sent you (or anyone else) any of my 4 pms...havent seen a reason to, or a value it in...nothing can be confirmed, and it has been my experience that more problems come from sharing with someone you dont trust 100% than not sharing at all (a fact that you have proven two nights in a row)

You don't trust DT? Or do you mean you don't necessarily trust him to make the right decisions?

Personally, I've been using my PMs to tell people my character's name, in case anyone else tries to use it or something. I'm not sure there will be much use in it, but I don't know what else to do with them. And I don't know what I'll do when I have sent it to everyone -- I guess by then, I might as well have just said it in the thread. Yeah, it's not the best method in the world or anything, but I guess this way I don't feel like I'm wasting my ability, plus I get to unnecessarily clog BK and hoops's inbox!

[DaddyTorgo]

actually the way i explained it initially, the wording was poor.

[Passacaglia]

well then my math on the % is off, cuz your numbers are not correct (i don't want to narrow it down too much more). i have high trust in between somewhere between 0-6 people

I'm not too worried about the numbers themselves, rather the fact that you give this group "high trust" then add caveats to a good number of them, saying that you could see them being wolves. Probably just semantics, but I wouldn't call that "high trust" personally.

[DaddyTorgo]

hey sal - are you a member of the conspiracy?

[DaddyTorgo]

I'm not too worried about the numbers themselves, rather the fact that you give this group "high trust" then add caveats to a good number of them, saying that you could see them being wolves. Probably just semantics, but I wouldn't call that "high trust" personally.

yes, semantics. there's a high-trust list and then that smaller list of 3. call them "medium-high trust" if you will.

[DaddyTorgo]

it's 10am - i am probably heading out around 1:30. I'll have my phone and I can be online and post from my phone, but I will also be socializing and typing on my phone, so my activity will be reduced. But, mindful of the importance of my role in the game I will try to check in at least like...once an hour in case there are PM's or important questions.

[ISiddiqui]

yes, semantics. there's a high-trust list and then that smaller list of 3. call them "medium-high trust" if you will.

I think I may need a flowchart ;)

[DaddyTorgo]

LOL

[Danny]

DT, what are your thoughts on PurdueBrad? Right now, if we have no new information, we learn the most from his lynch as he has been involved in two votes thus far. I would have liked to seen him scanned, but if that's not possible then lynching him would make sense.

[Danny]

Today we have 18 players left, so we need 8 votes for 40%.

[DaddyTorgo]

@saldana PM - okay *nods and moves you around on my list*

[Passacaglia]

Whatever happened to that 36 hours vs. once per calendar week thing? I remember someone mentioning that the 36 hours could be made up, since it was an example given in the first post. And since the once per calendar week guy ended up being good, should we look at the 36 hour guy? I should add that I know who it is, since they told me in a reply to a PM that I sent.

[DaddyTorgo]

my thoughts on PB. he has claimed a sort of "slow developing" role, so i'm willing to give him a little more time. he's definately not on my high-trust list though. but nor do i feel he is going to yield us a wolf.

that being said, i'm not going to throw myself under the bus for him and defend his innocence to the death, because i don't know for certain.

is that clearly-unclear enough?

[DaddyTorgo]

Whatever happened to that 36 hours vs. once per calendar week thing? I remember someone mentioning that the 36 hours could be made up, since it was an example given in the first post. And since the once per calendar week guy ended up being good, should we look at the 36 hour guy? I should add that I know who it is, since they told me in a reply to a PM that I sent.

negative. that person is okay in my book.

[Passacaglia]

negative. that person is okay in my book.

Sounds good. I figure it's a weird skill to have made up, anyway.

[Passacaglia]

negative. that person is okay in my book.

Anyway, seeing that phrase again made me think back to something I saw in the evening. I think you replied to a PM's in the thread, saying "you're okay in my book" a few times. Are these people asking you if you trust them? Cuz that just sets off alarm bells to me.

[DaddyTorgo]

note - saldana never responded to my question about whether he was a member of the conspiracy. would be curious to know about that.

[Danny]

Anyway, seeing that phrase again made me think back to something I saw in the evening. I think you replied to a PM's in the thread, saying "you're okay in my book" a few times. Are these people asking you if you trust them? Cuz that just sets off alarm bells to me.

One of the PM's was mine, I don't know about the others, but I never asked DT if he trusted me (I just assumed he did since I am so cuddly :p ), but he replied that he did.

[DaddyTorgo]

Anyway, seeing that phrase again made me think back to something I saw in the evening. I think you replied to a PM's in the thread, saying "you're okay in my book" a few times. Are these people asking you if you trust them? Cuz that just sets off alarm bells to me.

if i recall what you're thinking about, the answer is "not always." sometimes it was (and in those cases i would bet my jack-bauer life on it), and sometimes it was just deliberate over-use of that phrase to try to throw wolves off, and it essentially meant "thanks for the the PM. you're right about that" or "okay...i believe what you said."

[Passacaglia]

One of the PM's was mine, I don't know about the others, but I never asked DT if he trusted me (I just assumed he did since I am so cuddly :p ), but he replied that he did.

What? The cuddly ones are the ones you have to fear the most? Haven't you ever seen Gremlins?!

[DaddyTorgo]

One of the PM's was mine, I don't know about the others, but I never asked DT if he trusted me (I just assumed he did since I am so cuddly :p ), but he replied that he did.

important to note that that's a generic phrase i've been throwing out to people though - it doesn't imply where along the scale of trust they are. for all you know (and you too Danny) you could be the bottom man on the "medium-high" trust list.

[Danny]

That's true, but I am not wet

[Danny]

important to note that that's a generic phrase i've been throwing out to people though - it doesn't imply where along the scale of trust they are. for all you know (and you too Danny) you could be the bottom man on the "medium-high" trust list.

This is true, as I think it's been said for about half the players :)

[Passacaglia]

important to note that that's a generic phrase i've been throwing out to people though - it doesn't imply where along the scale of trust they are. for all you know (and you too Danny) you could be the bottom man on the "medium-high" trust list.

That's fine. I'm not concerned too much with where I am on the list -- in fact, I'm probably not medium-high, let alone high. I was just worried that if people were asking you if you trusted them, it seemed to me like they were a little too excited to slip into getting your trust without the rest of the gang here having a say. But as long as you're keeping an eye on it, I'm cool.

[path12]

if i recall what you're thinking about, the answer is "not always." sometimes it was (and in those cases i would bet my jack-bauer life on it), and sometimes it was just deliberate over-use of that phrase to try to throw wolves off, and it essentially meant "thanks for the the PM. you're right about that" or "okay...i believe what you said."

Good, I'm glad Pass asked that because I had the same misgivings.

[path12]

I was the other advisor Alan picked, BTW.

[Passacaglia]

Good, I'm glad Pass asked that because I had the same misgivings.

Oh yeah, path. The answer to your question is 'no' -- what you said doesn't really tell me anything (maybe it would if I watched the show), but I can't think of a reason I need to know anything more than that, anyway.

[Passacaglia]

(and sorry for the late reply)

[The Jackal]

note - saldana never responded to my question about whether he was a member of the conspiracy. would be curious to know about that.

Even after sending you a PM? Seems like an obvious question that you know what the answer will be (unless you've got some sort of super lie detecting). I'll admit my suspicion on sal is only because he's voted for me twice, the second being mostly a hidden vote since the runs were on other people yesterday. But he's done nothing to convince me that he isn't at least suspicious. Don't know that I'll go there with a vote yet, but he's in my considerations.

[path12]

Oh yeah, path. The answer to your question is 'no' -- what you said doesn't really tell me anything (maybe it would if I watched the show), but I can't think of a reason I need to know anything more than that, anyway.

Gotcha. Appreciate the reply.

[Autumn]

I'd say if Saldana is refusing to send his role info to DT that's mighty suspicious. We know the wolves only have a few fake roles to hide behind, some of them have to be trying to avoid revealing. I'll have to look back but I seem to remember his votes being kind of odd too.

So yeah, I"m back. I don't think I've seen any voting at all (well except for me I guess last night). I'd be inclined at this moment to go for Saldana or nfg. I'm ggoing to look at the votes on me last night and see who might have seemed eager to take advantage of a runaway lynch.

[The Jackal]

I'd say if Saldana is refusing to send his role info to DT that's mighty suspicious. We know the wolves only have a few fake roles to hide behind, some of them have to be trying to avoid revealing. I'll have to look back but I seem to remember his votes being kind of odd too.

So yeah, I"m back. I don't think I've seen any voting at all (well except for me I guess last night). I'd be inclined at this moment to go for Saldana or nfg. I'm ggoing to look at the votes on me last night and see who might have seemed eager to take advantage of a runaway lynch.

I think DT indicated that he'd received a PM from saldana and then "moved him around the trust list" but then afterwards said that sal had not specifically said he wasn't part of the conspiracy. Which should really be meaningless.

[DaddyTorgo]

@10:59am - *nods* thanks. that's all i needed to know.

[saldana]

note - saldana never responded to my question about whether he was a member of the conspiracy. would be curious to know about that.

uh...no, i am not a member of the conspiracy.

[The Jackal]

uh...no, i am not a member of the conspiracy.

I am shocked! :eek:

[DaddyTorgo]

I think DT indicated that he'd received a PM from saldana and then "moved him around the trust list" but then afterwards said that sal had not specifically said he wasn't part of the conspiracy. Which should really be meaningless.

no i didn't move him around on my trust list. i hope i didn't say that. i moved him around on my little "list of who's who and claims what sort of powers" and such.

like there's a group of "claims powers that we can't publicly verify ever" and a group of "these people have powers we can publicly test" and others.

[DaddyTorgo]

uh...no, i am not a member of the conspiracy.

thanks sal. that's helpful.

[The Jackal]

no i didn't move him around on my trust list. i hope i didn't say that. i moved him around on my little "list of who's who and claims what sort of powers" and such.

like there's a group of "claims powers that we can't publicly verify ever" and a group of "these people have powers we can publicly test" and others.

Ah, I think you simply said "moves you on the list", so I inferred trust list. Thanks for clarifying.

[saldana]

I think DT indicated that he'd received a PM from saldana and then "moved him around the trust list" but then afterwards said that sal had not specifically said he wasn't part of the conspiracy. Which should really be meaningless.

this is 100% correct, and i appreciate that you helped me out here considering i have voted you twice...yesterday's wasnt meant to be "hidden" as so much as i didnt have a chance to follow along during the day and had no clue where the votes were going, so i punted..

as far as specifically saying i was not in the conspiracy, i didnt state that in my PM, but even if i were, I would still say that i wasn't. [scratches head]

[DaddyTorgo]

my little "cheat sheet" of role-based info if you will (names omitted).

The following people have claimed powers that we cannot publicly see the effects of -

The following people claimed powers that would be difficult to test publicly:

The following people pushed quickly (via PM) to use their powers on Autumn (perhaps to help us lynch a villager and then say "oh was just trying to help you jack" all innocently, but perhaps it’s nothing):
The following have powers that could be tested and the results could be publicly observed: NOTE - I ACTUALLY NEED TO BREAK THIS INTO 2 "publicly observed and clearly not a wolf" and "publicly observed and still could be a wolf"

[The Jackal]

this is 100% correct, and i appreciate that you helped me out here considering i have voted you twice...yesterday's wasnt meant to be "hidden" as so much as i didnt have a chance to follow along during the day and had no clue where the votes were going, so i punted..

as far as specifically saying i was not in the conspiracy, i didnt state that in my PM, but even if i were, I would still say that i wasn't. [scratches head]

I do remember both of your votes being early on in the day, which makes it tough to analyze. Day 1 aside, throwing an early vote and then not moving it and having very few posts gives me very little read on you.

And yeah.. I'd be very surprised if anyone came out and said, "Hey Jack, I'm bad!" so.. I wasn't expecting anything to come from that.

[DaddyTorgo]

@11:09 - thanks. figured you'd know what to do with that.

[Telle]

And yeah.. I'd be very surprised if anyone came out and said, "Hey Jack, I'm bad!" so.. I wasn't expecting anything to come from that.

My guess is someone has a soothsayer role and DT wanted it used on saldana.

[DaddyTorgo]

are you all interested in looking at that "claims a role that cannot be publicly verified" grouping?

[DaddyTorgo]

I think if we look in that small group we are likely to find one wolf, and then also find a wolf in my list of "people who claim powers we can test but that wouldn't necessarily be beyond a wolf to use to try to buy trust" and maybe even a cunning that's wormed its way into my CoT (though of course we look there last)

[Autumn]

I'm interested in looking at anything at this point, but I was just about to post saying I think maybe we should start looking at voting records, or thread behavior. Frankly, going off the info you're able to collect in PMs has not been working. I think in the end it will work out for us, especially as you're able to protect the seer. But until you get a wolf scan I'm kind of inclined to just have us work things out in thread. I may be biased because I almost got axed over it, but we could have easily had three villager kills off of PM suspicions. I think it's good if you can wave us away from lynches you think would be poor though.

If I can get some food into me I'm going to look at some votes and make some suggestions.

[DaddyTorgo]

if you cross-reference, both people who "pushed quickly to use powers on autumn" are both on the list of "people who could publicly display their powers and yet still be a wolf seeking to buy trust" also - just FYI

[DaddyTorgo]

I'm interested in looking at anything at this point, but I was just about to post saying I think maybe we should start looking at voting records, or thread behavior. Frankly, going off the info you're able to collect in PMs has not been working. I think in the end it will work out for us, especially as you're able to protect the seer. But until you get a wolf scan I'm kind of inclined to just have us work things out in thread. I may be biased because I almost got axed over it, but we could have easily had three villager kills off of PM suspicions. I think it's good if you can wave us away from lynches you think would be poor though.

If I can get some food into me I'm going to look at some votes and make some suggestions.

fair enough. i have no problem with that. i am only one of...whatever...14 good guys left?

[Passacaglia]

are you all interested in looking at that "claims a role that cannot be publicly verified" grouping?

I'm interested, but I'm not sure if it's the best idea to tell me just cuz I wanna know. So it's your call, I guess.

[Danny]

I have no problem with using DT's lists as a guide which is used in conjunction with voting records and thread behavior. What I really want to know most right now is the affiliation of PB as he was a key player in two votes.

[Autumn]

Thoughts on last night. PB and Danny were the first to jump on my bandwagon, PB doing it a minute after DT posted. Given that PB has avoided lynches two days in a row that interests me. Danny voted me, unvoted me once some people suggested we don't instalynch, and then voted me again once some more "evidence" came out. By itself not anything, but Danny's been pinging me for reasons I'll have to go back and find.

Chief Rum, EF, Issidqui and nfg22 were the others to jump on me. NFG22 has already pinged me, so jumping on last to try to pump up the numbers might add to the suspicion. Nothing rock hard on anyone here, but something to look at.

I"ll be looking at other votes next.

[Danny]

I object to the claim, I only ping my wife!

[DaddyTorgo]

Okay, here's a summary breakdown

without names it looks like this (T=trust, H=high, M=medium, n=no trust/no info)

HT - Myself
HT
HT
HT
HT
HT

MT
MT
MT

HT? - cleared and linked to un-HT person (who we are calling MT now, cuz if both were wolves it'd be very ballsy - especially given wolves are not under-pressure yet)

NI - 7 more

I think that's the total number of players - if not I'm missing people in NI

[Autumn]

fair enough. i have no problem with that. i am only one of...whatever...14 good guys left?

We're 19 now? Five wolves is your guess .... that seems fair enough. Less than that with your abilities would have been a hard game for the wolves.

[DaddyTorgo]

I don't want to respond to everyone's comments about every player and give pluses or minuses, that will just stunt discussion and help the wolves narrow down targets. I'd prefer to wait till a conclusion is reached thru discussion and then give a thumbs-up or thumbs-down on the candidates

[Autumn]

I object to the claim, I only ping my wife!

That's why I could never understand why you pinged me ;-)

[ISiddiqui]

I think a combination of looking at the roles that can't be publically verified along with voting history/posts, etc would be the best role. Let's not throw all our eggs in one basket, but use everything we have to try to determine something off.

[saldana]

My guess is someone has a soothsayer role and DT wanted it used on saldana.
i pretty much knew that, but wasnt going to draw attention to it...keeping something like that hidden could have allowed for it to be used as a trap on a suspect...which you have now made much less likely.

[Autumn]

if you cross-reference, both people who "pushed quickly to use powers on autumn" are both on the list of "people who could publicly display their powers and yet still be a wolf seeking to buy trust" also - just FYI

That is interesting. You're right, definitely sounds wolfish, good way to "gain trust" and off me as well, especially if they got the idea that my role could out them.

I didn't mean to shoot down the idea of you giving us anything to work on. I just think we all need to flex our mental muscles.

[kingfc22]

I wasn't saying it was. I was just setting the scene. Sorry, I guess I could have come through with the percent. It looks like 9/21 is required to lynch. My thinking on Alan was that his vote counted double, making us actually 9/22, but that would have given us a lynch, so my read on him is off.

Any thoughts on Pass guys?

Day 1 he has a throw away vote on a known villager (BrianD)
Day 2 he brings up the idea that Alan's vote counts for double...which turns out to be true after he is killed by the wolves...however DT and path have claimed to be the the advisors so what would make Pass think this?
He also was the one to drop the hammer on clap over PB.

[DaddyTorgo]

i don't blame pass for his d1 throwaway vote, or even for his dropping the hammer on clap, as i fully endorsed and pushed the clap vote.

[Autumn]

I really need to reformat this voting list but I'm finding the day one vote interesting. Jackal has somehow slipped off the radar after getting a lot of votes up and down Day 1. NTN and PB also got a lot of votes day one but managed to slip off the radar with KWhit getting axed. Interestingly it was NTN, Saldana, PB and then Tyrith who unvoted off of Jackal, with NTN introducing KWhit as a candidate.

[DaddyTorgo]

i pretty much knew that, but wasnt going to draw attention to it...keeping something like that hidden could have allowed for it to be used as a trap on a suspect...which you have now made much less likely.

there are 1300 posts in the thread. i'm sure we'll be okay.

[Autumn]

Any thoughts on Pass guys?

Day 1 he has a throw away vote on a known villager (BrianD)
Day 2 he brings up the idea that Alan's vote counts for double...which turns out to be true after he is killed by the wolves...however DT and path have claimed to be the the advisors so what would make Pass think this?
He also was the one to drop the hammer on clap over PB.

I'll have to look at his votes, but I don't think the Day 2 thing means anything. Alan had made clear in his posts that someone was voting double and I assumed that it was probably him. I'm sure others did too.

[DaddyTorgo]

here's a philosophical question - do we assume that the wolves have the standard powers of their character plus the ability to night-kill?

i have been assuming they do.

so like...if i was a wolf i'd have all my jack-bauer character powers plus the night kill ability as opposed to just having "the name jack bauer and no powers except the night-kill ability"

[Autumn]

here's a philosophical question - do we assume that the wolves have the standard powers of their character plus the ability to night-kill?

i have been assuming they do.

so like...if i was a wolf i'd have all my jack-bauer character powers plus the night kill ability as opposed to just having "the name jack bauer and no powers except the night-kill ability"

Good point. I guess I'd say they have their own abilities, but then they woudln't need to be faking roles and powers, would they? Maybe that's the problem with going after suspicious role reveals in PM and why it hasn't been working.

I think if I think back to the Marvel game everyone had powers, plus the wolves had night kills. Might be the same here, though I wonder if the wolves would have powers tailored to being a wolf, or if they'd just have neutral powers that could work for either side?

[The Jackal]

I really need to reformat this voting list but I'm finding the day one vote interesting. Jackal has somehow slipped off the radar after getting a lot of votes up and down Day 1. NTN and PB also got a lot of votes day one but managed to slip off the radar with KWhit getting axed. Interestingly it was NTN, Saldana, PB and then Tyrith who unvoted off of Jackal, with NTN introducing KWhit as a candidate.

Well, I think what happened is that Jack gave me a vote of confidence, and I think I know where I am on his trust list.

The people that unvoted me is an interesting bunch.

[DaddyTorgo]

Good point. I guess I'd say they have their own abilities, but then they woudln't need to be faking roles and powers, would they? Maybe that's the problem with going after suspicious role reveals in PM and why it hasn't been working.

I think if I think back to the Marvel game everyone had powers, plus the wolves had night kills. Might be the same here, though I wonder if the wolves would have powers tailored to being a wolf, or if they'd just have neutral powers that could work for either side?

I wouldn't say I'm going after suspicious role-reveals in PM's anymore at this point. That gave us something on D1 and D2 to at least push the game in some direction, but what I'm doing at this point is more nuanced than that.

[The Jackal]

Good point. I guess I'd say they have their own abilities, but then they woudln't need to be faking roles and powers, would they? Maybe that's the problem with going after suspicious role reveals in PM and why it hasn't been working.

I think if I think back to the Marvel game everyone had powers, plus the wolves had night kills. Might be the same here, though I wonder if the wolves would have powers tailored to being a wolf, or if they'd just have neutral powers that could work for either side?

I can think of a lot of roles that would fit into the style of this game that could either work for a villager or wolf role. I've assumed the whole game that the wolves have actual abilities in addition to NKs.

[Autumn]

That's right, DT did say he'd vote elsewhere than you. DT, do you still feel the same about Jackal?

[DaddyTorgo]

[quote=The Jackal;2068449]Well, I think what happened is that Jack gave me a vote of confidence, and I think I know where I am on his trust list.
[quote]

:confused:

we're going to disagree on this

[DaddyTorgo]

I can think of a lot of roles that would fit into the style of this game that could either work for a villager or wolf role. I've assumed the whole game that the wolves have actual abilities in addition to NKs.

yep. and one of those is your role.

[The Jackal]

[quote=The Jackal;2068449]Well, I think what happened is that Jack gave me a vote of confidence, and I think I know where I am on his trust list.
[quote]

:confused:

we're going to disagree on this

What do we disagree about? I'm not saying a vote of confidence in that "you know I'm good" or anything like that. Just that I wasn't a great way to go on day 1, and that's why people unvoted me.

[DaddyTorgo]

That's right, DT did say he'd vote elsewhere than you. DT, do you still feel the same about Jackal?

nope. that was purely a one-time thing because at that point not everyone had revealed to me.

[Autumn]

I wouldn't say I'm going after suspicious role-reveals in PM's anymore at this point. That gave us something on D1 and D2 to at least push the game in some direction, but what I'm doing at this point is more nuanced than that.

I mean suspicious in the sense that it's based on the idea that the wolves don't have powers they'd be willing to reveal. That seems to be what some of your trust list is based on, right? Other than some powers being undenaibly good for the village and some neutral.

[The Jackal]

yep. and one of those is your role.

I'm aware of that, thanks.

[DaddyTorgo]

[quote=DaddyTorgo;2068454][quote=The Jackal;2068449]Well, I think what happened is that Jack gave me a vote of confidence, and I think I know where I am on his trust list.


What do we disagree about? I'm not saying a vote of confidence in that "you know I'm good" or anything like that. Just that I wasn't a great way to go on day 1, and that's why people unvoted me.

okay - fair enough. we agree then.

just didn't want people getting the wrong idea

[The Jackal]

[quote=The Jackal;2068456][quote=DaddyTorgo;2068454]

okay - fair enough. we agree then.

just didn't want people getting the wrong idea

Yeah, that's fair.

[DaddyTorgo]

I mean suspicious in the sense that it's based on the idea that the wolves don't have powers they'd be willing to reveal. That seems to be what some of your trust list is based on, right? Other than some powers being undenaibly good for the village and some neutral.

no...not really. my "trust list" isn't based on that at all. Well at least not until you get down to "MT". And the "MT" people have demonstrated their powers to me multiple times to our collective benefit, so they've got some trust, but I'm not blind to the idea they could be wolves. my "list of people's role types" is based on that, but everyone except i think one person at this point that is on the "list of role types" list is a NI.

[The Jackal]

All I can offer for myself at this juncture is that I didn't vote for KWhit or clap and had ample opportunity too. I really didn't think either of them was a wolf. And yes, wolves know who the wolves are, I'm aware, but the voting record is what it is.

[path12]

here's a philosophical question - do we assume that the wolves have the standard powers of their character plus the ability to night-kill?

i have been assuming they do.

so like...if i was a wolf i'd have all my jack-bauer character powers plus the night kill ability as opposed to just having "the name jack bauer and no powers except the night-kill ability"

I'm not sure I totally follow where you're going right now (which is fine), but if you're asking here whether a wolf can both use their "power" AND night kill in the same day I would guess it is either one or the other in a particular day.

But that's just my gut on how I'd design a wolf role.

[nfg22]

The did kill two people in one day...

[Autumn]

no...not really. my "trust list" isn't based on that at all. Well at least not until you get down to "MT". And the "MT" people have demonstrated their powers to me multiple times to our collective benefit, so they've got some trust, but I'm not blind to the idea they could be wolves. my "list of people's role types" is based on that, but everyone except i think one person at this point that is on the "list of role types" list is a NI.

I think we're talking past each other, probably just because I'm trying to work and do this at the same time.

I just mean that we may not be able to garner much from chasing the people on your "role that couldn't be publicly proven" or your "roles that ...." gah, this is what I mean, my mind's blanking. *sigh* Anyway, that if we assume the wolves all have regular abilities also this might be chasing up a tree, and also why things like going after clap for his similar ability didn't work. Maybe they don't have to fake abilities.

[Autumn]

The did kill two people in one day...

I thought we were assuming a villager killed the foreigner guy. DT, do you know one way or the other? Does that make any sense from what you know of the roles?

If the wolves really did make two kills, what does that mean?

[Passacaglia]

i don't blame pass for his d1 throwaway vote, or even for his dropping the hammer on clap, as i fully endorsed and pushed the clap vote.

However, it should be noted that I did put the first vote on clap, pushed him to reveal his role, unvoted him when he did (after DT had voted for him), then revoted him afterward. I definitely had my own angle on clap, and I don't want it to look like I was just following DT here for the heck of it when I wasn't.

As for Alan, I thought I was just saying what everyone was thinking. I wouldn't have if not for the fact that I thought that if what I was thinking was true, it meant we should have had a lynch then.

And I explained why I voted Brian the next day. I do remember he's been cleared since then, although since I don't know why, that won't really be 100% for me at this time.

[Danny]

All I can offer for myself at this juncture is that I didn't vote for KWhit or clap and had ample opportunity too. I really didn't think either of them was a wolf. And yes, wolves know who the wolves are, I'm aware, but the voting record is what it is.

Which may or may not mean anything depending on the allegiance of PB and NTN

[path12]

Purdue is still the person I'm most curious about at this moment.

VOTE PURDUEBRAD

[DaddyTorgo]

as i am typing up a big PM to someone, i am leaning towards an EF vote

[The Jackal]

Which may or may not mean anything depending on the allegiance of PB and NTN

Right, but I'm not particularly confident about either of them being a wolf. Maybe PB is the way to go today, though.

[Autumn]

My best bet combing over voting records is that Jackal and NFG are wolves. NFG voted Path early then switched to NTN to put him well ahead of Jackal Day one. Day two NFG voted clap early to make him lead contender.

<b>VOTE NFG22</b>

[Thomkal]

Me too Path. I don't want to start a bandwagon on him, but if he turns out to be a wolf after two days of nearly being the lynch target, it would open up a lot of avenues to explore.

What's your level of trust on PB right now, DT?

[The Jackal]

Well, Autumn, I'm definitely not a wolf. In fact, I've only sent 2 PMs and they were to DT on the first day. But I'm not essential to us, so if we need to come after me some day so be it.

[DaddyTorgo]

didn't i discuss PB earlier? i swear i did.

[Autumn]

as i am typing up a big PM to someone, i am leaning towards an EF vote

I assume he's on one of those suspect lists. I'll be interested to hear what you come up with.

[Passacaglia]

didn't i discuss PB earlier? i swear i did.

I thought so, but it seemed like you were pretty indifferent on him.

[Autumn]

didn't i discuss PB earlier? i swear i did.

Discuss him? I think you said he could be good or bad or something to that effect.

[Passacaglia]

my thoughts on PB. he has claimed a sort of "slow developing" role, so i'm willing to give him a little more time. he's definately not on my high-trust list though. but nor do i feel he is going to yield us a wolf.

that being said, i'm not going to throw myself under the bus for him and defend his innocence to the death, because i don't know for certain.

is that clearly-unclear enough?

Here you go.

[Passacaglia]

However, it should be noted that I did put the first vote on clap, pushed him to reveal his role, unvoted him when he did (after DT had voted for him), then revoted him afterward. I definitely had my own angle on clap, and I don't want it to look like I was just following DT here for the heck of it when I wasn't.

As for Alan, I thought I was just saying what everyone was thinking. I wouldn't have if not for the fact that I thought that if what I was thinking was true, it meant we should have had a lynch then.

And I explained why I voted Brian the next day. I do remember he's been cleared since then, although since I don't know why, that won't really be 100% for me at this time.

So I was glancing at the first page to see if chesapeake was in this game, and I realized that by BrianD's name, it says recovering from torture. I forgot about that mechanic -- so yeah, he's probably good.

[DaddyTorgo]

EF is miffed that I'm leaning towards voting him.

It's the simple fact of the matter that he claims abilities that cannot be publicly verified to this date, and it's also being kept as "mysterious" and keeping him silent. Seems like pretty good wolf-cover, no?

[Passacaglia]

EF is miffed that I'm leaning towards voting him.

It's the simple fact of the matter that he claims abilities that cannot be publicly verified to this date, and it's also being kept as "mysterious" and keeping him silent. Seems like pretty good wolf-cover, no?

What? Can he not post or something?

[DaddyTorgo]

What? Can he not post or something?

this is correct. and his trips away have not yielded any info. apart from "vague suspiscions" about certain players (some of whom i trust, some of whom i don't)

[Passacaglia]

this is correct. and his trips away have not yielded any info. apart from "vague suspiscions" about certain players (some of whom i trust, some of whom i don't)

But wait. When this happened last time, we got an announcement in the thread saying he went off the grid, right? Why didn't that happen this time?

[DaddyTorgo]

But wait. When this happened last time, we got an announcement in the thread saying he went off the grid, right? Why didn't that happen this time?

apparently because it's a "more advanced" type of off-the-grid "mission" if you will.

[Passacaglia]

apparently because it's a "more advanced" type of off-the-grid "mission" if you will.

That sounds fishy. But why make something like that up?

[Passacaglia]

I say that realizing that I *have* lied about not being able to post in the past. But I had a good reason then -- I'm not sure what his reason would be now.

[DaddyTorgo]

That sounds fishy. But why make something like that up?

to try to clear fellow wolves or get villagers lynched if he's bad obviously.

[Passacaglia]

to try to clear fellow wolves or get villagers lynched if he's bad obviously.

I was actually just talking about his inability to post.

[hoopsguy]

there are 1300 posts in the thread. i'm sure we'll be okay.

Pretty slow game, huh? :eek::p:popcorn:

[Autumn]

Weird, that's suspect. I'm now wary of jumping on the "suspicious behavior with DT" bandwagon but I'm certainly ready to switch my vote today if necessary.

[DaddyTorgo]

I was actually just talking about his inability to post.

being quiet keeps you UTR and from slipping up in your posts...

[Danny]

EF is generally not one to be quiet when he is a wolf. I'm mixed on that. He obviously has an ability here since it was demonstrated day 1, but there's no telling whether the ability is for good or evil.

[DaddyTorgo]

okay - i am heading out here in a second. will check in from my phone every hour or so provided that i can. will also be voting from my phone.

[Passacaglia]

So how long can't he post for?

[DaddyTorgo]

EF is generally not one to be quiet when he is a wolf. I'm mixed on that. He obviously has an ability here since it was demonstrated day 1, but there's no telling whether the ability is for good or evil.

good point.

i'm not necessarily endorsing an EF lynch, just saying that as I was typing out that long PM that was one thing that raised an eyebrow with me.

we could lynch PB but I'm willing to cut him a little slack still. could also lynch jackal.

could look at a player like isiddiqui or kingfc as well.

[DaddyTorgo]

So how long can't he post for?

i don't know.

*shuts down computer and goes to grab lunch before leaving*

[chesapeake]

So I was glancing at the first page to see if chesapeake was in this game

Nah...I'm just a viewer enjoying the show :)

[Passacaglia]

EagleFan -- how long can't you post for? :)

[Passacaglia]

Nah...I'm just a viewer enjoying the show :)

That's what I thought, but in a game this big, you never know who could be playing, but you just don't realize it. :)

[Danny]

could look at a player like isiddiqui or kingfc as well.

I was looking at a potential King vote as well as he has struck me a bit, but that is based purely on subjective matters and it would be nice if we had something more to go on.

[ISiddiqui]

apparently because it's a "more advanced" type of off-the-grid "mission" if you will.

So it's a mission he can elect to undertake, but forces him to stay off the grid? And we don't know when he is or isn't off the grid aside from if he sends a PM to someone right beforehand?

[hoopsguy]

Just a note on the PMs, as this has been confusing for a couple of people.

The rule is 4 PMs per 24 hours, not 4 PMs per day. This can be good/bad for the player, depending on the context. The 24 hours is a rolling period of time - it is not static.

Example:
7/7 8:00 AM
7/7 10:00 AM
7/7 9:00 PM
7/8 7:55 AM

At that point the player would not have 3 PMs available for 7/8. Instead would be out of PM's until 8:00 AM, at which point they could send a PM. Another PM would become available at 10:00 AM.

Please let me know if this is unclear. BK and I have sent a couple of PMs to people when they are tapped out on PMs and it was pretty clear to us that the 4-per-24 concept was not universally understood.

If you already understood this, great. For those people who have not been sending any PMs, don't worry about this too much :)

[Autumn]

I'm going to stick with my NFG vote right now. It seems to me we have enough suspects we should be able to have a pretty good showdown today. Let's see some votes.

[ISiddiqui]

I'm going to wait until we get more information on EF, but I realize I still have a vote for Autumn on the books. I think I've seen enough from Autumn and DT to release that at this point.

Unvote Autumn

[PurdueBrad]

Just catching up on lots. I haven't done anything worthy of trust yet, the biggest thing I've done is simply not die to this point and vote incorrectly twice in self-defense situations. I know all votes need to be analyzed but if you look at mine, they are blatant self-defense. Had I not moved and still managed not to get killed, then you would lynch me for the same thing. Honestly, I'm just trying to stay alive (cue John Travolta).

unvote Autumn

And I'll read back and look for who the best candidate is.

[Alan T]

Please let me know if this is unclear. BK and I have sent a couple of PMs to people when they are tapped out on PMs and it was pretty clear to us that the 4-per-24 concept was not universally understood.

If you already understood this, great. For those people who have not been sending any PMs, don't worry about this too much :)



Can you please send me a PM explaining this in detail? Thanks!

[PurdueBrad]

Right now, I think only nfg and I have votes. Obviously, I'll likely end up throwing a vote there out of self-defense eventually.

The case on me thus far: Not sure what drove the initial run on day 1 but lived through lynches on both day 1 and 2 AND cast votes for villagers on day 1 and day 2.

What is the case on nfg at this point?

[Danny]

PB, right now you are on top of my possible vote list because your death tell us a lot. If there was another way we could learn your allegiance without you dying that would be good too. I know DT mentioned you had a slow developing role which helped you stay alive. It might help us if we knew what this was. I know it would help the wolves to possibly kill you, but to be honest, if the wolves kill you, it helps the village quite a bit, by allowing us a much better analysis of day 1 and 2 votes.

[Danny]

Keep in mind PB, use your own judgment here on whether a reveal would be bad or good, I'm not going to press you for it, but sometimes villagers can be a little too slow to reveal. And I realize I may get some suspicion for questioning about PB's role, but it is very helpful if we learn his allegiance one or the other.

[Danny]

Oh and regarding voting, I will not be voting EagleFan today. He clearly has the ability to go underground (we don't know if it's for good or bad though) and I want to see the result of this tonight when he gets back in thread before evaluating him. I am suspicious of anyone who would push for his vote during this time. If you don't trust him, there will be plenty of chances to go that way after today.

[PurdueBrad]

Danny, I don't doubt the information that would be gained from my death. I've learned a lot since the first time I was in this situation (several games ago) and the two since (please note, I was/am a villager to all intents and purposes in all three cases). I will say this about my role, I am not as valuable as Claphamsa right now and will need to prove my worth.

And you do get info from lynching me but I've told two people via PM that I would look at those that bailed off of me during the run on KWhit. I'm in no position to really drive a lynch on anyone but if I were not having to vote out of self-defense, my vote would likely be in there somewhere.

[Danny]

PB, do you have PM's left?

[PurdueBrad]

Danny, I have on PM right now and then three more that open up this evening, so yes.

[PurdueBrad]

on=one

[PurdueBrad]

To the @ 1:25 that I didn't get to answer, I will do so fully when my next PM is available at 4:43 or some such time. The answer to you is definitely maybe and I will lay it out for you then.

[Passacaglia]

I hate Oasis.

[hoopsguy]

I hate Oasis.

Cause maybe (maybe) - you're going to be the one that saves me?

[Danny]

Thanks PB, I am going to do some vote analysis with the assumption that PB is not a wolf and see what might be a good vote at that time. I am not saying PB is not a wolf, but I want to see what can be made of the votes if he is not

[Danny]

Day 1 Final vote count:
The Jackal: clap (453, 1:55 pm)
BrianD: Pass (330, 8:23)

NTN: JAG (332, 8:31) Jackal (374, 10:26 AM) KWhit (390, 10:45 AM) king (425, 12:26 PM) thomkal (441, 1:42 pm) Tyrith (514, 3:44 PM) Schmidty (537, 5:48)

PurdueBrad: Eagle (334, 8:59 AM) saldana (501, 3:22 PM) path (546, 6:03) ntn (560, 6:14)

KWhit: nfg (482, 2:39 PM) CR (565, 6:44) Brian (579, 7:22) Autumn (581, 7:27) DT (595, 7:39) Telle (598, 7:42) ISiddiqui (599 7:44) Alan (600 7:44) PB (602, 7:44)

DAY 1 FINAL

Eaglefan 1 – BrianD (292)
Path 1 – nfg22 (305)
Jackal 1 – PB (328)
BrianD 1 – Pass (330)
Ntn 1 – Jag (332)
PB 1 – Eaglefan (334)
Jackal 2 – Saldana (343)
Path 2 – Tyrith (347)
UNVOTE Eaglefan 0 – BrianD (358)
Ntn 2 – Path (360)
PB 2 – Jackal (366)
Jackal 3 – Brian D (370)
Ntn 3 – Daddy Torgo (371)
UNVOTE PB 1 – Jackal (374)
Ntn 4 – Jackal (374)
UNVOTE Path 1 – Tyrith (388)
Jackal 4 – Tyrith (388)
Ntn 5 – Alan (389)
Ntn 6 – Kwhit (390)
Jackal 5 – Telle (391)
UNVOTE Jackal 4 – Telle (411)
PB 2 – Telle (411)
Ntn 7 – Kingfc (425)
Jackal 5 – Ntn (431)
UNVOTE path 0 – nfg22 (439)
Ntn 8 – nfg22 (439)
Ntn 9 – Thomkal (441)
UNVOTE Jackal 4 – BrianD (443)
PB 3 – BrianD (443)
Jackal 5 – claphamsa (453)
PB 4 – Autumn (459)
UNVOTE ntn 8 – Daddy Torgo (463)
PB 5 – Isiddiqui (471)
UNVOTE ntn 7 – Alan (474)
UNVOTE Jackal 4 – ntn (475)
Kwhit 1 – ntn (475)
UNVOTE ntn 6 – nfg22 (482)
Kwhit 2 – nfg22 (482)
UNVOTE ntn 5 – path (496)
UNVOTE Jackal 3 – saldana (501)
PB 6 – saldana (501)
UNVOTE Jackal 2 – PB (511)
UNVOTE Jackal 1 – Tyrith (514)
Ntn 6 – Tyrith (514)
Ntn 7 – PB (517)
Ntn 8 – Schmidty (537)
PB 7 – path (546)
UNVOTE KWhit 1 – ntn (560)
PB 8 – ntn (560)
KWhit 2 – Chief (565)
UNVOTE PB 7 – BrianD (579)
KWhit 3 – BrianD (579)
UNVOTE PB 6 – autumn (581)
KWhit 4 – autumn (581)
KWhit 5 – Daddy Torgo (596)
UNVOTE PB 5 – Telle (598)
KWhit 6 – Telle (598)
UNVOTE PB 4 - ISiddiqui (599)
KWhit 7 – Isiddiqui (599)
KWhit 8 – Alan (600)
UNVOTE ntn 7 – PB (602)
KWhit 9 – PB (602)

[Danny]

Day 2 Voting Record

Chief Rum: Telle (950, 3:53 PM)
Claphamsa: nfg (781, 9:21 AM) DT (923, 3:23 PM) Alan T (935, 3:31) Autumn (948, 3:46) Purdue (967, 4:58 pm) Chief (969, 6:01 PM) EF (1040, 7:49) Pass (1046 7:54)
Purdue: path (867, 1:55) Schmidty (956 4:18 pm) Jackal (960, 4:37 pm) Danny (966 4:55 pm) NTN (991, 7:09 PM) Clap (993, 7:14 PM) Thomkal (1040, 7:41 pm) henry (1034, 7:44)
Telle: BrianD (881, 2:23 PM)
nfg22: king (949, 3:51 PM)
The Jackal: Saldana (947, 3:44 PM

(652) Danny vote Chief – Chief 1
(754) Clap vote Pass – Chief 1, Pass 1
(775) Pass vote Clap – Chief 1, Pass 1, Clap 1
(781) nfg vote Clap – Clap 2, Chief 1, Pass 1
(867) path vote PB - Clap 2, Chief 1, Pass 1, PB 1
(881) Brian vote Telle - Clap 2, Chief 1, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1
(919) autumn vote nfg - Clap 2, Chief 1, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1. nfg 1
(923) DT vote Clap - Clap 3, Chief 1, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1. nfg 1
(924) EF vote Chief - Clap 3, Chief 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1. nfg 1
(935) Alan vote Clap - Clap 4, Chief 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1. nfg 1
(947) saldana vote Jackal - Clap 4, Chief 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1. nfg 1, Jackal 1
(948) UNVOTE autumn off nfg - Clap 4, Chief 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1
(948) autumn vote Clap - Clap 5, Chief 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1>>
(949) king vote nfg - Clap 5, Chief 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(951) telle vote Chief - Clap 5, Chief 3, Pass 1, PB 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(956) Schmidty vote PB - Clap 5, Chief 3, PB 2, Pass 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(960) Jackal vote PB - Clap 5, Chief 3, PB 3, Pass 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(966) UNVOTE Danny off Chief - Clap 5, PB 3, Chief 2, Pass 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(966) Danny vote PB - Clap 5, PB 4, Chief 2, Pass 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(967) PB vote Clap - Clap 6, PB 4, Chief 2, Pass 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(969) Chief vote Clap - Clap 7, PB 4, Chief 2, Pass 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(991) ntn vote PB - Clap 7, PB 5, Chief 2, Pass 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(993) UNVOTE Clap off Pass - Clap 7, PB 5, Chief 2, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(993) Clap vote PB - Clap 7, PB 6, Chief 2, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(1004) UNVOTE Pass off Clap - Clap 6, PB 6, Chief 2, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(1030) Thomkal vote PB - PB 7, Clap 6, Chief 2, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(1034) henry vote PB - PB 8, Clap 6, Chief 2, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(1040) UNVOTE EF off Chief - PB 8, Clap 6, Chief 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(1040) EF vote Clap - PB 8, Clap 7, Chief 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg 1
(1046) Pass vote Clap - PB 8, Clap 8, Chief 1, Telle 1, Jackal 1, nfg>>

[Danny]

I actually have a good bit of trust that the info I got from PB is the truth. I also think the lack of day 2 movement reinforces that it's a unlikely a wolf was involved in the vote.

Because of this, the wolves likely wanted their votes spread out and to establish the candidates. I think those who votes early on both days as well as those who shied away from the main two candidates (to spread things out) are an excellent group to vote from. Those who stand out to me are the following.

NFG- first vote on Kwhit day 1, first vote on Claphamsa day 2

Saldana- throw away vote both days

King, not too early, but had the 4th vote on NTN and then a throw away vote on day 2.

Telle- Was the first to jump onto Kwhit after DT led the charge and had a throwaway vote yesterday

Jackal- Second vote on NTN day 1 and third vote on PB day 2. Also was the first player to unvote PB.

Right now, I'd say my vote is going towards NFG or Jackal

A couple other notes, we has an extremely low number of unvotes yesterday. One is from Clap, so there are only three unvotes there. Pass, myself and EF. I tend to trust EF and Pass more because of this. I'm guessing all the wolves left there vote where it was that day.

[Danny]

Jackal- Second vote on NTN day 1 and third vote on PB day 2. Also was the first player to unvote PB.



That should read first player to unvote PB on day 1

[Danny]

Here is an interesting display of actions on day 1. At this point NTN is is about two votes ahead of PB

Kwhit 1 – ntn (475)
UNVOTE ntn 6 – nfg22 (482)
Kwhit 2 – nfg22 (482)

[Danny]

At that point NTN ended up unvoting Kwhit and voting for PB in a self defense type vote. Then later Chief followed on Kwhit before a big run started. I am leaning towards and NFG vote right now.

[Danny]

Day 2 NFG was actually the second person to vote as well before Pass later unvoted. That was too quick follow votes on villagers

[Danny]

I'm still suspicious of Jackal, but two second votes on two villagers looks really bad.

Vote NFG

[Danny]

Also, twice now Autumn has voted for NFG early in the day, and there have been no follow votes. I think at least one wolf would have capitalized on that and followed Autumn's vote.

[Danny]

One slight alteration, on day 2, King voted for NFG one post after Autumn dropped his vote there, so technically one person followed the vote there.

[kingfc22]

I'm still suspicious of Jackal, but two second votes on two villagers looks really bad.

Vote NFG

I was trying to start movement on him yesterday by adding a second vote (which I thought at the time) to see what would follow.

Of course, I didn't fully catch up on the thread before I posted as autumn unvoted him just 5 minutes prior.

[Danny]

Yeah, I amended that as I looked at the vote again in the post right above yours. Your vote looks good if NFG turns out wolf

[ISiddiqui]

Wow... that's an impressive analysis. I'm going to have to digest this for a bit. I think you've made quite some good inroads there, Danny. Maybe get DT to comment on it to see if he may have some other info relating to the conclusions you've come to.

[Thomkal]

Great work there Danny. Since you are also suspicious of Jackal, and your analysis makes me suspicious of him too now, I'll go there so we don't have a runaway vote on nfg.

vote Jackal

[DaddyTorgo]

@3:03 - msg received. good to be on same page re:you. will have more to say later

in the car and on my phone. excuse any typos, and if there are any questions I need t answer if someone wants to post them after this post of mine to make sure I don't miss them.

[Danny]

I am fine with a Jackal, NFG run off, I'd bet there is at least one wolf between the two of them.

[The Jackal]

What exactly makes me suspicious with what I've done?

[The Jackal]

Great work there Danny. Since you are also suspicious of Jackal, and your analysis makes me suspicious of him too now, I'll go there so we don't have a runaway vote on nfg.

vote Jackal

What analysis, exactly?

I unvoted PB on day one first because I suddenly got a few votes and shifted my vote to NTN for self defense.

[The Jackal]

I've voted for two unknowns, haven't shuffled my vote around.. not sure why you're after me. Because I got votes on day one? We've already established that was a baseless run.

[PurdueBrad]

Danny, thanks for the hard work.

vote nfg

[kingfc22]

Since I wanted to go this direction yesterday and haven't seen anything to change my mind since autumn's situation was cleared up by DT.

Vote nfg22

[The Jackal]

Well, works for me.

Vote nfg

[DaddyTorgo]

daddytorgo has this to say: in a jacal vs ng runoff the only candidate in there he can support voting for is jackal. jackal is on the NI list, and the "power could be demonstrated and still be wolf" list and nfg is not.

would rather see votes for others over either of those 2, but if I must be one of those 2 I will vote jackal

[Passacaglia]

Do we have a vote count (I see Telle in the thread, she'll probably pull through)?

[Telle]

Well since I've been called out by name and all.. :)

Votes as of post #1421:

1 - Autumn - nfg (1132)
1 - PurdueBrad - path (1347)
5 - nfg - Autumn (1350), Danny (1405), PurdueBrad (1417), king (1418), The Jackal (1419)
1 - The Jackal - Thomkal (1411)

[Autumn]

daddytorgo has this to say: in a jacal vs ng runoff the only candidate in there he can support voting for is jackal. jackal is on the NI list, and the "power could be demonstrated and still be wolf" list and nfg is not.

would rather see votes for others over either of those 2, but if I must be one of those 2 I will vote jackal

DT is starting to talk in third person now? Shades of Dr. Doom.

[Autumn]

I'm not sure if DT's comment is enough to make me change votes. I mean does he actually have anything on NFG or is he just saying NFG has a more believable role? Is NFG on the high trust list or the mild trust list?

What I'd give for a COT right now. DT can you give a little more guidance as to how strongly you feel about this? I like the analysis we have now.

[Passacaglia]

Thinking about that, DT's comment is enough for me to prefer a 5-2 margin over a 5-1.

VOTE THE JACKAL

[Danny]

I'm not sure if DT's comment is enough to make me change votes. I mean does he actually have anything on NFG or is he just saying NFG has a more believable role? Is NFG on the high trust list or the mild trust list?

What I'd give for a COT right now. DT can you give a little more guidance as to how strongly you feel about this? I like the analysis we have now.

I'm not sure either, so far going with the less believable role thing hasn't worked out to well.

[Danny]

Is NFG going to be on soon, I'd like to hear from him

[Telle]

I don't want to join the pile-on on nfg, so I'm going to go with Chief instead. He voted for now-known villagers both days and was one of the people who jumped at following DT on Autumn.

vote Chief Rum

[Thomkal]

What analysis, exactly?

I unvoted PB on day one first because I suddenly got a few votes and shifted my vote to NTN for self defense.

I agree with Danny's theory that the wolves likely wanted to spread their votes out and did so early to get some candidates they could build on. Your votes fit that theory nicely.

[ISiddiqui]

I'm not sure if DT's comment is enough to make me change votes. I mean does he actually have anything on NFG or is he just saying NFG has a more believable role? Is NFG on the high trust list or the mild trust list?

What I'd give for a COT right now. DT can you give a little more guidance as to how strongly you feel about this? I like the analysis we have now.

I think he's saying NFG is a more believable role. Not necessarily making any definitive statements on NFG being high trust or not.

Makes me lean toward Jackal right now, but I'll have to think about it a bit more before casting a vote.

[path12]

Danny, I don't see quite the motive in nfg's voting record that you do.

What I see as the most damning thing about him ends up being a positive, and that is his eagerness to throw Autumn under the bus last night in his PM to DT.

That could be seen as a wolfy thing to do, though when Autumn presumably came up good it would focus extra attention his way. I saw it more as looking for a reason to suspect someone who had voted for him (remember, he mentioned King when he voted Autumn, who had also just happened to vote him).

But the end positive is that he appeared to convince DT one way or the other, so I'm not sold on voting for him.

[The Jackal]

I agree with Danny's theory that the wolves likely wanted to spread their votes out and did so early to get some candidates they could build on. Your votes fit that theory nicely.

I don't see why going after someone who voted early for two unknowns is better than going after people who have voted for two known villagers. You are punishing me because the people I voted for weren't lynched, even though they might be wolves?

[Autumn]

Well, the others on my list today from vote analysis were PB, Danny, NTN and Saldana. I would swtich to Jackal or to one of these people. I know Jackal's not great on DT's list, I'm not sure abou the rest.

[Danny]

NTN I have no idea about, but I think it's unlikely PB is a wolf.

[The Jackal]

I mean, what do you think DT, should I just share my role? I'm not the person to go after.

[Telle]

Danny, I don't see quite the motive in nfg's voting record that you do.

What I see as the most damning thing about him ends up being a positive, and that is his eagerness to throw Autumn under the bus last night in his PM to DT.

Wait. I don't recall DT giving us the names of the two people who PM'd him about wanting to use their powers against Autumn. Did I just miss that or something?

[Danny]

NFG was revealed as one in thread, I'm not sure if the other was or not, I can't remember

[Danny]

Well, NFG is here now, so let's see what he has to say.

[Passacaglia]

Well, NFG is here now, so let's see what he has to say.

probably something like "please don't vote for me"

[nfg22]

Have no fear I am here...Ill give a reason for my votes....I voted on NTN fast because of no activity and needing a viable candidate. Then NTN came on, interacted and gave a good defense. I then voted on Kwhit because NTN gave what seemed to be a good scenario. Thus making me jump on Kwhit right after NTN. The second day I cant say much other than I wanted to get a vote out on my most likely candidate. It was the second vote but really it was a coincidence. I know i dont have much history but you will see if you look at the 4-5 games i have played, that I am very quick to conclusions and I like action.

The fact that DT would rather go for someone else(jackal) instead of me should mean a bit. I sincerly hope you dont vote me off based on two days of voting when really no one had any clue what to do. This was shown by the quick ups and downs of many people. I was not the only one just piling on votes.

[nfg22]

probably something like "please don't vote for me"

Pass...now come one...would I say that? Maybe I want to be voted for before I kill you???RAWWWR.

[Danny]

I find Jackal's behavior somewhat suspicious. He votes for NFG, not necessarily because of what I layed out, but because it's not him, but at this time he only has 1 vote on him. He also is basically ready to give up and reveal with only two votes.

[nfg22]

NFG was revealed as one in thread, I'm not sure if the other was or not, I can't remember

Guarenteed I was not one who wanted to use powers on Autumn. I just didnt want to tell my powers to Autumn. DT will confirm this.

[nfg22]

PM @ 1215...I agree totally and will follow your advice...

[ISiddiqui]

Hmm... can someone who has been in a few of the 4-5 games NFG has been in before verify if he actually is quick to conclusions as he said?

[Passacaglia]

Pass...now come one...would I say that? Maybe I want to be voted for before I kill you???RAWWWR.

Well, I figure this isn't like last game where you wanted everyone to vote for you! :p

[nfg22]

Well i totally messed up a the HERO WW because I sometimes just say something to say something.

[nfg22]

Well, I figure this isn't like last game where you wanted everyone to vote for you! :p

You are correct. I would not like everyone to vote for me...just 40%. Im just joking. I really would like 0%.

[nfg22]

fifteen people? but not DT to vouch for me...how unfortunate.

[Autumn]

I agree Danny about Jackal being suspicious. Given that you're both on my suspect list and are somewhat at odds in this, I think I will vote for you and see how that race goes. Despite my misgivings I'll come off of nfg for now to avoid lynching someone DT thinks might be good and/or helpful.

<b>UNVOTE NFG22
VOTE DANNY</b>

[The Jackal]

I find Jackal's behavior somewhat suspicious. He votes for NFG, not necessarily because of what I layed out, but because it's not him, but at this time he only has 1 vote on him. He also is basically ready to give up and reveal with only two votes.

No, I've been suspicious of NFG since Autumn mentioned he pinged him the other day. And yes, it's partly self-preservation, but I honestly do think there's a good chance he's a wolf, much more confident than I was in my PB or NTN votes.

I'm annoyed because I've done nothing negative for the village and am drawing heat, that's all.

[nfg22]

WTF? Danny? Im glad it isnt me but random? Especially when your the one who spearheaded the dont go with DT but go with voting records...im confused but kinda relieved?

[nfg22]

Im keeping my vote on Autumn.

[Autumn]

WTF? Danny? Im glad it isnt me but random? Especially when your the one who spearheaded the dont go with DT but go with voting records...im confused but kinda relieved?

I mentioned Danny as a suspect much earlier in the day NFG. In addition I just have a gut feeling, he hasn't been playing his normal game. He hasn't drawn any attention. If Jackal is a good guy I think Danny may not be so I'd like to see how a race between them woudl go.

Why are you so sure about DAnny, NFG?

[path12]

I told DT what was asked of me and that Autumn came representing him. The words used were "I have the ability to confirm roles. If you send me your role I can confirm it and send that information to DT. I am doing this so we can help DT build a circle of trust. It was not exactly said that DT authorized this but it was heavily implied...

I did not make a big deal out of it...I just asked DT and he thought that it was suspicious cause he was not made aware of it. I also think it is suspicous because Autumn threw a quick vote on me....For the record I still think it was out of hand and could be a quick way for the wolves to prioritze kills.

Think about this..Im not saying it is true but just think about it. Autumn is a wolf. Autumn sends out asking to confirm roles. Autumn obviously knows who villagers are,so every villager wants to build a COT. Thus Autumn knows all villagers will give an honest reply. So Autumn confirms most villagers and a few wolves...making them into the COT with a fair amount of villagers. This way Autumn and more wolves join COT...they have a list of the best roles to kill....they kill a few....we lynch a few more because they arent in the COT....and bam...game is very close to over...

I know its a long shot but that is how i think...

Wait. I don't recall DT giving us the names of the two people who PM'd him about wanting to use their powers against Autumn. Did I just miss that or something?

Telle, this is what I was referring to.

[path12]

WTF? Danny? Im glad it isnt me but random? Especially when your the one who spearheaded the dont go with DT but go with voting records...im confused but kinda relieved?

I haven't played enough with Danny to know his style, but he's nowhere on my personal trust list right now though I have no real reason to distrust him either. Solidly neutral for me at this point, so I've got no problem with him getting a vote.

[Danny]

PM @ 1215...I agree totally and will follow your advice...

I think he was referring to (and I was answering about) you being one of the two people Autumn messaged, not you being one of the two who wanted to kill him.

[Danny]

In fairness to Autumn, he has had some suspicions of me starting yesterday I believe.

[path12]

Danny, why didn't you vote day 1? I think you said something but am way too busy to find it now.

[DaddyTorgo]

guys I am a page back but I don't necessarily want to spell ut wo is on the "ht" list right now for fear of making them targets.

I will say that my feelings in this case are based on more than role-pm's.

still got a page to catch up

[Danny]

I had company over, so wasn't paying close attention to anything that was happening in the game. I ended up losing track of time and came in at about 6 and the lynch already happened.

[nfg22]

I think he was referring to (and I was answering about) you being one of the two people Autumn messaged, not you being one of the two who wanted to kill him.

ok...np. I just wanted to be off the list of people who tried to use their powers against Autumn cause I did not.

[Danny]

guys I am a page back but I don't necessarily want to spell ut wo is on the "ht" list right now for fear of making them targets.

I will say that my feelings in this case are based on more than role-pm's.

still got a page to catch up

Hmmm, I will unvote because of this, but I'm not sold necessarily on going by this list 100%

Unvote NFG

[Danny]

Votes as of post #1463:

1 - Autumn - nfg (1132)
1 - PurdueBrad - path (1347)
3 - nfg - PurdueBrad (1417), king (1418), The Jackal (1419)
1 - The Jackal - Thomkal (1411), Pass (1425)
1 - Danny - Autumn (1450)
1 - Chief Rum - Telle (1428)

[ISiddiqui]

While I haven't gotten an answer on NFG's play style, I find his explination to be slightly more persuasive than Jackal's right now. So based on Danny's vote history analysis, I think Jackal is the best bet. And I'm going out after work tonight (can't miss trivia night at the bar!) and don't want to be caught without a vote when my suspicions are tingling.

Vote The Jackal

[Poli]

Beep, beep, beep, beep...

[Danny]

Vote Poli

[Danny]

I am going to get going soon. I am bringing my laptop with me to class today, so I may be able to check in, but may not depending on what we are doing.

I am going to stick with my analysis and go with Jackal now that DT doesn't want us to vote for NFG.

Vote Jackal

[Poli]

<table class="tborder" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td class="tcat" colspan="2">Who Posted? Total Posts: 1,468
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="thead" width="100%">User Name</td> <td class="thead">Posts</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> DaddyTorgo (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2341) </td> <td class="alt1">276</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> Danny (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=1238) </td> <td class="alt2">123</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Autumn (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2677) </td> <td class="alt1">122</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> The Jackal (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=5913) </td> <td class="alt2">95</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Passacaglia (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=46) </td> <td class="alt1">87</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> hoopsguy (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=253) </td> <td class="alt2">66</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> nfg22 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3399) </td> <td class="alt1">57</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> claphamsa (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=5793) </td> <td class="alt2">54</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Alan T (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2498) </td> <td class="alt1">47</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> path12 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2700) </td> <td class="alt2">47</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> JAG (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=571) </td> <td class="alt1">44</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> Barkeep49 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=696) </td> <td class="alt2">44</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> PurdueBrad (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=5686) </td> <td class="alt1">43</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> BrianD (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4068) </td> <td class="alt2">36</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> ISiddiqui (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=688) </td> <td class="alt1">35</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> EagleFan (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=495) </td> <td class="alt2">33</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Chief Rum (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=52) </td> <td class="alt1">32</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> Thomkal (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=63) </td> <td class="alt2">28</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Poli (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=1988) </td> <td class="alt1">27</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> kingfc22 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3165) </td> <td class="alt2">26</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Tyrith (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4341) </td> <td class="alt1">26</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> ntndeacon (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2757) </td> <td class="alt2">23</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Schmidty (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=956) </td> <td class="alt1">23</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> Telle (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3366) </td> <td class="alt2">19</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> henry296 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=201) </td> <td class="alt1">18</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> saldana (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4428) </td> <td class="alt2">16</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> KWhit (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2592) </td> <td class="alt1">11</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> PackerFanatic (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4383) </td> <td class="alt2">3</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> Plutonium (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=7522) </td> <td class="alt1">2</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> lerriuqs (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=7163) </td> <td class="alt2">2</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> chesapeake (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=5580) </td> <td class="alt1">1</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt2"> jeheinz72 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4761) </td> <td class="alt2">1</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="alt1"> RendeR (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=1418) </td> <td class="alt1">1</td></tr></tbody></table>

[Autumn]

Ntndeacon has gone under the radar lately, hasn't he? Kind of weird. Schmidty is also strangely quiet.

[Thomkal]

oh my the Clock has one less post than me, I better post some more. :)

[Danny]

Both are very quiet, which is not unusual for either. It makes NTN impossible to read, though Schmidty generally is more active if he has an important role (such as wolf).

[The Jackal]

Ntndeacon has gone under the radar lately, hasn't he? Kind of weird. Schmidty is also strangely quiet.

Yeah.

[The Jackal]

Danny, honestly, you're a good player, what makes you think I'm a wolf? People keep pointing to your "vote analysis". Because my votes were early and on people we don't know about I'm the best person to go after? Seems kind of foolish.

[The Jackal]

You're just rubbing me the wrong way, and now that you've made your intentions clear, and that people are apparently going to move off NFG because DT doesn't want us to vote for him..

unvote NFG

vote danny

[Autumn]

I'm not going to be around a lot this evening, we have a guest. I'd really like to see consolidation of votes. I had hoped that this game would allow us to lynch more often and get a quicker voting record, but hasn't worked so far. I'm willing to go to Jackal if it's the way to get a vote consolidated.

[Autumn]

or stay where I am ;-)

[The Jackal]

Voting for me is going to be a waste of everyone's time.

[kingfc22]

I'm willing to stand by nfg22 for now.

DT hasn't really gotten us anything yet, so I'm hesitant to unvote and move over to jackal or danny. Of course this could end up biting me in the end, but I'm going to stick with my own gut feeling for now.

[The Jackal]

Funny how we're going after 3 of the top 6 posters, eh? Makes you think about the people that are keeping quiet.

[Danny]

You're just rubbing me the wrong way, and now that you've made your intentions clear, and that people are apparently going to move off NFG because DT doesn't want us to vote for him..

unvote NFG

vote danny

It seems to be you're just voting for whoever as long as it's not you, so other than the voting record (which is not good, though a number of others players look poor as well), your play seems to have desperation in it.

[The Jackal]

It seems to be you're just voting for whoever as long as it's not you, so other than the voting record (which is not good, though a number of others players look poor as well), your play seems to have desperation in it.

I completely disagree that my voting record is "not good". Either you're a wolf or you are making me lose faith in WW.

[Danny]

How is your voting record good? You have early votes to establish candidates. You're right that if NTN is a wolf, you're voting record is good, but otherwise it's not. Wolves like to hide behind votes for villagers that are not lynched. There are a number of voting records which are not good and quite honestly much of what I am going off of is due to DT's trust of NTN. Maybe that is a mistake, I don't know.

[ISiddiqui]

Lose faith in WW?

[Danny]

There was also movement off of you day 1 to other players. You also have never unvoted which is very wolfish if NTN and PB are in fact not wolves. I do realize there is a lot of assumptions here, but at this point I was going with DT's trust of NTN and my read that PB is not a wolf.

[The Jackal]

How is your voting record good? You have early votes to establish candidates. You're right that if NTN is a wolf, you're voting record is good, but otherwise it's not. Wolves like to hide behind votes for villagers that are not lynched. There are a number of voting records which are not good and quite honestly much of what I am going off of is due to DT's trust of NTN. Maybe that is a mistake, I don't know.

I never said my voting record was good. But to say it isn't good.. I can't agree with that. It's unknown. And I'd hardly say it falls on the bad side of unknown, since there's still a fair amount of suspicion on NTN and PB.

[The Jackal]

Lose faith in WW?

Yeah, as in playing what you think is a good game to help the village and getting crucified for it, hopefully by wolves, but often times it's usually just misguided villagers trying to grasp at something to give them justification for a vote.

[Danny]

Alright, I am leaving now, but I will check in later. If arguments for other candidates can be made, I am open to that. I actually wouldn't mind DT posting what his thoughts of NTN are as my vote is based off the assumption that NTN is good.

[The Jackal]

There was also movement off of you day 1 to other players. You also have never unvoted which is very wolfish if NTN and PB are in fact not wolves. I do realize there is a lot of assumptions here, but at this point I was going with DT's trust of NTN and my read that PB is not a wolf.

I didn't unvote NTN to go to KWhit, that hardly seems like a negative decision.

And I didn't unvote PB because I wasn't ever fond of the run on clap, which I repeatedly said.

Would it have honestly looked better if I moved my vote from a candidate with votes to someone random?

[Danny]

Yeah, as in playing what you think is a good game to help the village and getting crucified for it, hopefully by wolves, but often times it's usually just misguided villagers trying to grasp at something to give them justification for a vote.

But then you need to create arguments for other players, just quickly voting for whoever else comes up is not the way to win us over. You're play is either a disparate wolf or frustrated villager. Unfortunately, often times either way it gets you lynched. If you're a bad candidate, tell us who is a good one.

[Autumn]

All right, I've got to head out. I guess I will leave my vote where it is and see if there's more time when I get back. I think Danny, Jackal and NFG are all good suspects so I'm interested to see how the runoff goes.

[The Jackal]

But then you need to create arguments for other players, just quickly voting for whoever else comes up is not the way to win us over. You're play is either a disparate wolf or frustrated villager. Unfortunately, often times either way it gets you lynched. If you're a bad candidate, tell us who is a good one.

I'm certainly frustrated. NFG I felt was a good candidate, and I still feel he is, I've already said that wasn't purely self-preservation.

As far as other candidates, it seems like we're being limited in who we can target based on this trust list of DT which none of us know who exactly is on it.

I still think the list of five people that voted for the two villagers who've been lynched is a good place to look. I can see the argument that some of them were just "following Jack" but that's a good place for a wolf to hide. NFG is one of those, yes? CR is another, who I'd definitely consider. How does DT feel about him?

[Danny]

I didn't unvote NTN to go to KWhit, that hardly seems like a negative decision.

And I didn't unvote PB because I wasn't ever fond of the run on clap, which I repeatedly said.

Would it have honestly looked better if I moved my vote from a candidate with votes to someone random?

Not really, I understand you don't agree with it (either cause you are a wolf or you know you're a villager), but you are one of a group of players who I think has some suspicious votes. The primary reason I voted for you, was the way you responded to that.

[The Jackal]

Not really, I understand you don't agree with it (either cause you are a wolf or you know you're a villager), but you are one of a group of players who I think has some suspicious votes. The primary reason I voted for you, was the way you responded to that.

Alright, thanks for your reasoning. I still disagree that they aren't suspicious, but yeah, I guess that's because I know I'm a villager. I'm sorry I tried to defend my voting.. should I have just kept silent?

[Danny]

CR is actually still on my suspect list as well. I'll tell you what, since I have already unvoted three time, I will unvote you for now and see what develops before I check in again.

Unvote Jackal

I do really need to go now

[Danny]

Alright, thanks for your reasoning. I still disagree that they aren't suspicious, but yeah, I guess that's because I know I'm a villager. I'm sorry I tried to defend my voting.. should I have just kept silent?

Defending your votes is fine, this is a game of disagreement :)

[nfg22]

I wont be back till very late tonight so I hope all goes well.

[The Jackal]

unvote danny

We'll see what develops.

[path12]

Ntndeacon has gone under the radar lately, hasn't he? Kind of weird. Schmidty is also strangely quiet.

He was pretty vocal when he had votes on him but once that was over I don't recall much since.

I'd be willing to vote him again.

[DaddyTorgo]

@5:01pm - nothing specific to say. nothing to say to you privately as far as voting that I wouldn't say publicly

[path12]

But then you need to create arguments for other players, just quickly voting for whoever else comes up is not the way to win us over. You're play is either a disparate wolf or frustrated villager. Unfortunately, often times either way it gets you lynched. If you're a bad candidate, tell us who is a good one.

I know you also mentioned saldana's and Telle's voting record and they've gotten very little attention. I don't understand why Jackal's record stands out any more than theirs, except for what you say about his being willing to vote anywhere but himself and being possibly frustrated.

My gut says we've got some (plural) wolves laying low.

[path12]

As a matter of fact, to put my money where my mouth is:

UNVOTE PURDUEBRAD
VOTE TELLE

Per usual, mostly just curious to see what will happen.

[DaddyTorgo]

ntn and chief rum are both "available to vote on" if you will.

guys - I have a good trust list but I don't want to publicly reveal it yet and put targets on those people. it makes no sense right now.

I am sure its frustrating, but im trying not to say too much.

ntn and chief rum are both "no information". chief is on the "no way to verify his power wasgood for the village" list and ntn is on the "pushed to use power against autumn" list and the "could be tested under right circumstances.

note that the push against autumn is not automatically damming in my mind.

@cape league game

[path12]

Me, a GM and a clock. Quiet afternoon.