2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

[Dogslax41]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Because last year showed that 2012 was a fluke. You are not going to get through the season using only five starters. Cueto spent considerable time on the DL. Latos was banged up at the end of the season. As was Cingrani. Arroyo is now gone. I don't see the Reds being able to keep Latos and Bailey beyond this season. So having another rotation arm doesn't seem that bad of an idea.

And when the Reds originally signed Chapman, he was going to be a starter. They only put him in the bullpen because of injuries. But now that Bryan Price (who was the biggest proponent of putting Chapman in the rotation) has backed down and said Chapman will stay in the bullpen, I say use Chapman as trade bait to get some outfield help.

Last year the rotation, even with injuries was the least of the Reds problems. Trying to turn Chapman into a starter would burn him for a full year at either position. You might get 150 mediocre innings out of him this season. More likely he would need to go back down to AAA to relearn how to face hitters. For some players, like Sale making a move into the starting rotation is not that big of a deal because he doesn't have to fundamentally change how he throws. Chapman would have to alter the entire way he pitches. He would have to drop 4-5mph off his main pitch to be able to last 3+ innings. Starters need control not just power. The Reds aren't built to have throw away seasons right now and for a mid market team burning a top player amounts to burning a year.

If you trade Chapman you have got to have an alternate solution to the closer role. Broxton is not the answer and a reliable closer is an absolute must in baseball now.

Not to mention your "other" rotation arms are Stephenson, Corcino and Holmberg which are on the doorstep of being MLB ready now. Then Travieso is next stage after them. Reds are flush with pitchers and pitching talent.

[Dogslax41]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Looks like the Bailey to New York for Gardner idea is picking up steam. Not sure how I feel about the move. I guess replacing Bailey with Stephenson/Corcino/Holmberg is about the same downgrade as Gardner would be an upgrade over Hamilton for a year. You have to figure one of those three would have as much of a chance to have a breakout season as Hamilton would. Either way Bailey or Gardner will only be here for a year and based on last year offense was the bigger issue. I still think I might take my chances and go with the unknown of Hamilton and let him see what he could do. But having to play Heisey in center if he struggles would be a nightmare.

[redsrule]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Corcino is not on the doorstep to the MLB lol. He was beyond awful last year in AAA. He needs at least another year to see if he can improve at all and will be a contributor one day for this team.

[HustlinOwl]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Reds and Mets pursuing Arroyo

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[SlimKibbles]

2013 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Reds and Mets pursuing Arroyo

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

Just heard that too. If that's the case, they must also be trying to trade Homer for a bat.

[Dogslax41]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Corcino is not on the doorstep to the MLB lol. He was beyond awful last year in AAA. He needs at least another year to see if he can improve at all and will be a contributor one day for this team.

He resolves his control issues (more than likely due to his balance in that awful windup) and he will more than likely see time in the majors next season. He was far from beyond awful last season. His control dipped and his k ratio dipped just like 90% of the other prospects that make the jump to AAA. Bottom line is his 2 seam and slider have show the tendency to break bats and jam hitters. Not to mention he has always shown a pension for keeping the ball in the ball park. He's less ready than the other two but is not a large jump from being able to provide value late next season.

[HustlinOwl]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Where are they going to get the money to extend Bailey and Latos? Let Bruce Walk?

There had been a report that the Reds had talked with the Yankees about trading Bailey to the Yankees. Jocketty said it wasn’t true, so I said, “You’re not looking to trade him?”
“No,” Jocketty said. “We’re trying to sign him.”

Walt Jocketty says Reds aren’t trading Homer Bailey, looking for extension

[jasontoddwhitt]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Last year the rotation, even with injuries was the least of the Reds problems. Trying to turn Chapman into a starter would burn him for a full year at either position. You might get 150 mediocre innings out of him this season. More likely he would need to go back down to AAA to relearn how to face hitters. For some players, like Sale making a move into the starting rotation is not that big of a deal because he doesn't have to fundamentally change how he throws. Chapman would have to alter the entire way he pitches. He would have to drop 4-5mph off his main pitch to be able to last 3+ innings. Starters need control not just power. The Reds aren't built to have throw away seasons right now and for a mid market team burning a top player amounts to burning a year.

If you trade Chapman you have got to have an alternate solution to the closer role. Broxton is not the answer and a reliable closer is an absolute must in baseball now.

Not to mention your "other" rotation arms are Stephenson, Corcino and Holmberg which are on the doorstep of being MLB ready now. Then Travieso is next stage after them. Reds are flush with pitchers and pitching talent.

We disagree on the importance of the closer's role. I think closers are overrated.

Now if the Reds use Chapman more than one inning more often this year, I might be inclined to agree (and Price has said that he didn't agree with Chapman being restricted to just one inning like Dusty did once he made him the closer).

And I don't care what anyone says, we right now don't have major league depth in the starting rotation if someone inevitably goes down or if this Homer Bailey deal goes down (I like Gardner....but not that much).

Also, the Rockies beat writer is reporting that the Reds and Rockies are discussing a deal for Sean Marshall.

And the Rangers are bowing out of the Choo Sweepstakes....the longer this goes, maybe the Reds can get involved again? The rumor is $85 million over five years would keep Choo in Cincy....I'd do it.

[jake44np]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

Where are they going to get the money to extend Bailey and Latos? Let Bruce Walk?
Walt Jocketty says Reds aren’t trading Homer Bailey, looking for extension

Of course their saying they aren't looking to trade him, that's what all gm's say, and then they trade them.
They aren't going to come out and say they are looking to trade him because they can't afford him! That brings down his trade value. Lol

[SlimKibbles]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

We disagree on the importance of the closer's role. I think closers are overrated.

That was a great read. Never seen it before.

And the Rangers are bowing out of the Choo Sweepstakes....the longer this goes, maybe the Reds can get involved again? The rumor is $85 million over five years would keep Choo in Cincy....I'd do it.

That's $17 million a year. I like Choo but don't think the Reds can do that and keep some other important guys.

[Dogslax41]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

We disagree on the importance of the closer's role. I think closers are overrated.

Now if the Reds use Chapman more than one inning more often this year, I might be inclined to agree (and Price has said that he didn't agree with Chapman being restricted to just one inning like Dusty did once he made him the closer).

And I don't care what anyone says, we right now don't have major league depth in the starting rotation if someone inevitably goes down or if this Homer Bailey deal goes down (I like Gardner....but not that much).

Also, the Rockies beat writer is reporting that the Reds and Rockies are discussing a deal for Sean Marshall.

And the Rangers are bowing out of the Choo Sweepstakes....the longer this goes, maybe the Reds can get involved again? The rumor is $85 million over five years would keep Choo in Cincy....I'd do it.

Marshall to Colorado died with the Anderson deal.

And ask Detroit how important the closer role is to baseball. The game has continued to change since 2008 and has become even more specialized with not only closers but lefty and righty specialists. Look at the money Marshall is making to get on average one batter out a game. As hitters become more specialized and dangerous the shut down pitcher becomes more valuable. Not necessarily for 162 game season but for when it really counts. Again, look at the waste of the #1 by far rotation of the tigers against the Red Sox because they didn't have a shut down closer. It may work out over the course of a season but when the pressure is on and things get tight, that's when that multi million dollar one inning guy is like a warm fuzzy blanket. The last two series relied heavily on the closer role 2011 not so much because they were runs fests outside of Feliz shutting the door for the Rangers.

[redsrule]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

He resolves his control issues (more than likely due to his balance in that awful windup) and he will more than likely see time in the majors next season. He was far from beyond awful last season. His control dipped and his k ratio dipped just like 90% of the other prospects that make the jump to AAA. Bottom line is his 2 seam and slider have show the tendency to break bats and jam hitters. Not to mention he has always shown a pension for keeping the ball in the ball park. He's less ready than the other two but is not a large jump from being able to provide value late next season.

He had a 5.86 ERA last year in AAA. I'd say that was awful. Gave up 17 homers as well.

[jasontoddwhitt]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

The Yankees turned down Phillips for Gardner...the rumor being that the Yankees are one of the teams on Phillips veto list and the only way he would accept a trade to the Yankees is if they renegotiated his contract for more money.

I don't think GABP is big enough to hold his ego in anymore.

[Dogslax41]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

The Yankees turned down Phillips for Gardner...the rumor being that the Yankees are one of the teams on Phillips veto list and the only way he would accept a trade to the Yankees is if they renegotiated his contract for more money.

I don't think GABP is big enough to hold his ego in anymore.

I was really hoping they could pull that deal off. I think that probably would have freed up enough to go back and try to lock Homer up long term. Phillips has a major inferiority complex about Votto's contract.

[redsrule]

re: 2014 Cincinnati Reds Thread

I don't blame the Yanks honestly. Gardner is relatively cheap in his last year of his deal, while Phillips is still owed 50m/4 years and is declining. They would have the $$ for him, but you don't want an aging Jeter/Phillips (even while one of the better defensive 2b in baseball still) as your middle infielders imo.