How is outside fighting considered OP?

[Reinfarcements]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

The folks who dont want to play offline arent likely to get that option though if the majority gets their way and that sucks for them. Any moron can just walk forward and wing hooks online but you better fire back because if not, there is no way to survive consistently no matter who you are using.

This is a big issue. If one player decides he wants a 2 round slug-fest, thats exactly what he is going to get. The other player has ZERO say in the matter. You either slug it out in a risky strike heavy brawl, or you get completely overwhelmed. Even if you miraculously survive the fight, the aggressive player will win decision due to sheer INSANE volume of strikes that in no way, shape, or form resembles real MMA.

In real life, the more skilled fighter chooses how the fight goes down. If the more skilled fighter wants to play it safe for 5 rounds and win decision, thats what he will do. If an unskilled hyper-aggressive fighter tries to make it a slug-fest brawl, it does not force the skilled fighter to play his game and KO the unskilled fighter, even if that is an option. The more skilled fighter should have much more influence on what the fight looks like.

Unless someone is going to argue that it just so happens 99% of the players who are good at the game just happen to prefer gluing themselves to their opponent, I think it is safe to say that the game at its current state does not allow the more skilled player to control the flow of the fight. Right now, the more aggressive player has much more influence on the flow of the fight.

[FCB x Finlay]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

Your tools are to counter attack, in the broad sense of the term. You can do it by intercepting, by whiff punishing, block punishing, or pressuring the opponent after he concedes frame advantage (after his combo). You have to fight.

There are specific tools to create distance, but the bottom line is that he will catch up to you if all you do is run. The best way to get him to back out is making him fear coming forward and being attacked by you when his stamina and/or health are low.

Here is a simple example in the gif below. It was still when the health regen was bugged and super slow, but the principle is still the same. That guy could have retreated and likely survived, after losing the first engagement (eating the 2-3). But he kept coming forward and lost another engagement. That is the bread and butter of the game and the bread and butter of beating a glue-guy. Even without the actual rangey stuff, you're shooting yourself in the foot if you don't retreat.

<iframe src='//gifs.com/embed/ea-ufc-3-killing-the-glue-D9lmxy' frameborder='0' scrolling='no' width='640px' height='360px' style='-webkit-backface-visibility: hidden;-webkit-transform: scale(1);' ></iframe>

Great tools their. No thats nothing, that gif is literally 2 people in the pocket, the opposite of what we are looling for, they are both eating shots as a result, its stupid.

Have you actually looked at tge footage provided or anything, its about distance management not fighting in the pocket.

[FCB x Finlay]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

So this example is based on 2 elite fighters? What about an elite fighter an an amateur? Because its completely possible to force an intelllegent fighter who cares about losing to back off as it is right now. If someone is pressing you backwards, you have condeded space by not punishing them for their advancement(which puts them at a disadvantage)

Thats just completey against what we are saying, its not conceding the back foot, its establishing what range you want to fight at with movement.

[Solid_Altair]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

Thats just completey against what we are saying, its not conceding the back foot, its establishing what range you want to fight at with movement.

Maybe you ask a friend to play as you ropponent and do exactly what you want. The fight is supposed to be a cooperation, after all, right?

[FCB x Finlay]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

8

Maybe you ask a friend to play as you ropponent and do exactly what you want. The fight is supposed to be a cooperation, after all, right?

Have done as the aggressor. So much skill here

http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/fcb-x-finlay-x/video/48618318

[ungorborongo]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

Maybe you ask a friend to play as you ropponent and do exactly what you want. The fight is supposed to be a cooperation, after all, right?

???

Did you really think this was a good post?

the point is about movement mechanics, not cooperation. Use your ****ing brain. Scares the **** out of me that somebody like you is a gamechanger.

[Solid_Altair]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

???

Did you really think this was a good post?

the point is about movement mechanics, not cooperation. Use your ****ing brain. Scares the **** out of me that somebody like you is a gamechanger.

[ZombieRommel]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

If you upped stamina loss, youd need to up damage dealt by indidivual strikes to match the realism. And that cant be done apparently because of rock breakpoints.

Forward moving strikes already leave you more vulnerable, and are slower than stationary strikes. It VERY easy to capitalize on forward moving strikes.

Ive gassed plenty of over aggessive players in 3 round fights by making them whiff and punishing their body on over committed combos. You HAVE to put in work to get the results though. You cant expect to eat punches on your face or on your block and gas them out. Make them miss, make them pay.

I fought SwissLibax recently at LHW, me as Jones and him as Cormier. At the beginning of the 4th round we were both gassed as hell. And our output wasn't anything crazy, either. He did a good job slipping my punches, which drained me bad. I did a good job body kicking him as he slipped, which drained him bad.

Swiss is a high level player. What does it say about the game when 2 high level players (if I'm allowed to call myself one) go into the FOURTH round of a LHW fight gassed as hell while not being extraordinarily aggressive?

It says that the tools to make people gas are EXTREMELY POTENT.

This is why I don't agree with an increased "blocked strike" tax. We can already make people gas through normal movement (whiffing) and from head movement / lunges (evasion). All without ever throwing a punch. Which for some reason Aholbert seems to be overlooking. Exactly what he wants is already in the game - making aggressive fighters pay (by gassing) purely with evasion.

This is even more potent now that we can slip strikes and block during the return to center.

Agreed, most fights feel pretty samey, with just a small bit of diversity in terms of people's ability to time things well and mix up their rhythm.

Compare this to how different Cruz fights from McGregor, from how Daniel Cormier fights than Barboza, from how Woodley fights from Nick Diaz. I wish we could have the ability to replicate these styles better. There definitely has to be a balance, but I agree that cage cutting should be the determinant factor.

I am perfectly capable of counter-striking most guys who bum rush me, but it's not a satisfying victory. I want to be able to get a decision sometimes by playing it safe, like Cruz or DJ. I felt that EA UFC 2 was good at this, though it had some flaws in the way shorter fighters felt. There are definitely major improvements this year to make shorter fighters still viable as they are in real life.

Khabib vs Barboza is an example of one style of pressure, the main one we have now.



I want more of this

So what you want (in gameplay terms) is less stamina drain on feints and an increased ability to cut off the cage with movement.

I agree, and I've suggested both these things to the devs.

[ZombieRommel]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

Last night i was watching a top ranked player on ps4 stream. His name was “yesgumi” and he was fighting another top player named “Advaita_X” and it was a Conor vs Holloway fight and by the middle of the 5th round “yesgumi” threw over 600 strikes and “Advaita_X” threw over 550 strikes with still over 2 mins left in the 5th.

I was in shocked when i saw those numbers that i tried to screen shot the stream, but he removed the stats while i tried taking a picture.

That’s just insane and i don’t understand how that’s ok.

If their stamina was fine, then they both did a crap job making the other player miss. If you're constantly missing strikes (especially due to evasion), you gas bad.

I would argue that 18 denied takedowns should have a bigger stamina effect than it does.

*Looks in Cee's direction*

[Solid_Altair]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

Found this high level fight:

http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/l-nextgen-mma-l/video/49149370

[Bigg Cee]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

If their stamina was fine, then they both did a crap job making the other player miss. If you're constantly missing strikes (especially due to evasion), you gas bad.

I would argue that 18 denied takedowns should have a bigger stamina effect than it does.

*Looks in Cee's direction*

[Solid_Altair]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

I can't exclamate enough how precious a post like this is.

[kush land]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

[QUOTE=ZombieRommel;2049342716]I fought SwissLibax recently at LHW, me as Jones and him as Cormier. At the beginning of the 4th round we were both gassed as hell. And our output wasn't anything crazy, either. He did a good job slipping my punches, which drained me bad. I did a good job body kicking him as he slipped, which drained him bad.


Can we see a screen shot of the fight stats please or maybe a video its not that i dont believe you.Its always good to put a video but a simple screen shot would do

[kush land]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

Found this high level fight:

http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/l-nextgen-mma-l/video/49149370

That was beautiful

Aldo is really really good and moving away the whole time but maxs is still all over him.

[ZombieRommel]

Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

[quote=kush land;2049342731]

I fought SwissLibax recently at LHW, me as Jones and him as Cormier. At the beginning of the 4th round we were both gassed as hell. And our output wasn't anything crazy, either. He did a good job slipping my punches, which drained me bad. I did a good job body kicking him as he slipped, which drained him bad.


Can we see a screen shot of the fight stats please or maybe a video its not that i dont believe you.Its always good to put a video but a simple screen shot would do

Yeah I'll see if I can upload once I'm home. At work now. I recorded the fight.