How is outside fighting considered OP?

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  • ZombieRommel
    EA Game Changer
    • Apr 2016
    • 659

    #136
    Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

    Originally posted by kush land
    Thank you for posting vid and yes they are getting tried but to me thats a high pace fight and hes still chest to chest most of the time.

    The more i watch videos of the game i realized

    1 people have no fear INRL fighters stand just outside of range.

    The wodley wonderboy gif is perfect example wodley probably could have done lunging punches and most likely got chest to chest?


    But hes worried wonder boy will counter him when he closes distance.

    Then they reversed position and wodley was against the cage wonderboy attacked with lunging strikes and was put of balance because wodley moved notice how wodley wasn't even close to returning fire?
    I threw the same amount of strikes (to a T) in that fight that Nate Diaz did against McGregor in their 2nd fight IRL.

    While that is a lot higher than what JONES throws in a normal fight, this is a video game and the number at least adheres to a number a human being can throw.

    Everyone who uses Cormier pressures (as IRL). Since the empty slip strike tweak of the last patch, I don't feel the need to run anymore as Jones. As you can see in the vid, I was content to let him get into phone booth range and then won exchanges with Jones' elbow.

    I still kept him off of me with jabs and long-range hooks, but this fight demonstrates 2 things:

    1) "Outfighting" and using lengthy fighters to succeed against shorter, power fighters is now possible. Before the patch it really wasn't. The head spam made it a losing proposition most of the time. The shorter fighter would get inside with head movement and then spam empty slip strike power shots to get rocks. They can't do that now. Closing the distance isn't an auto-win. And getting inside is harder because of how combo speed isn't interrupted and the strikes track.

    2) Our stamina was shot by round 4 and we weren't throwing a crazy amount of strikes. Most of the drain inflicted was from head movement, lunges, and body shots.

    If the block drain change some people want was implemented now in the game, we'd have gone into the 3rd very winded based mainly off each of us using evasive maneuvers and body shots already.

    If people make full use of the current evasion mechanics and body shots, fighters gas like nobody's business.

    You are right that in the game fighters have no fear compared to IRL. This is a point ZHunter brought up to the GameChangers. In the game, we don't have to worry about CTE, losing money, etc. We take a virtual L and move on. No real way to simulate that fear, we can only make the game dangerous in terms of the virtual consequences, which it already is.
    Last edited by ZombieRommel; 05-03-2018, 02:38 PM.
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    • bmlimo
      MVP
      • Apr 2016
      • 1123

      #137
      Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

      Originally posted by FCB x Finlay
      Are we at the point where 1 side are arguing for parity for a viable style vs others whod rather keep it the same and the fear of it being OP. Tbh thats just sad.
      Looks like those guys just don’t want any change that mess with their style.... if you could use a proper foot work ... combo spam based on input speed would be dead...

      Comment

      • kush land
        Banned
        • May 2016
        • 443

        #138
        Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

        If aldos footwork was 100 and connor was 100 would connor movement be more effective because of his stance?

        Ive noticed some fighters move around way better

        If im runnin in a circle and quickly reverse the direction then reverse it again it seems so effective.

        but only some fighters do it really good connor, holm and cruz do it very well compared to aldo.

        Anyone else notice this

        please answer this dont make me start a new thread
        Last edited by kush land; 05-03-2018, 02:49 PM.

        Comment

        • aholbert32
          (aka Alberto)
          • Jul 2002
          • 33106

          #139
          Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

          Originally posted by ZombieRommel
          I threw the same amount of strikes (to a T) in that fight that Nate Diaz did against McGregor in their 2nd fight IRL.

          While that is a lot higher than what JONES throws in a normal fight, this is a video game and the number at least adheres to a number a human being can throw.

          As an aside, that number is the UFC record for number of strikes in a fight and it wasnt done on an accelerated clock.

          Comment

          • kush land
            Banned
            • May 2016
            • 443

            #140
            Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

            Alot of what zombie said was true just not the pace ?

            Comment

            • Solid_Altair
              EA Game Changer
              • Apr 2016
              • 2043

              #141
              Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

              Originally posted by Zeta Reticulan1
              Lol, no that's not what I am saying at all.

              I am saying that it should take actual skill to cut the cage off from someone and get inside. Footwork needs to be a meta that is expanded in a balanced way for both sides. Buff cutting off the cage and movement for both sides.
              So, you want to buff pressure?

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              • Phillyboi207
                Banned
                • Apr 2012
                • 3159

                #142
                Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                Originally posted by Solid_Altair
                So, you want to buff pressure?
                We want to buff both bro

                Comment

                • aholbert32
                  (aka Alberto)
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 33106

                  #143
                  Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                  Originally posted by Phillyboi207
                  You cant say you didnt throw a crazy amount of strikes and then admit you threw a recod setting amount of strikes with someone 30+ pounds heavier than Nate lol

                  Even Nate slowed down at times in the fight to recharge because of his pace and he literally does triathalons.

                  At the pace y’all were fighting y’all shoulda been gassed by the 3rd round. The big guys cant keep that up.

                  But that would require health regen being tweaked some so exchanging are more dangerous.

                  Im just happy GPD seems interested in improving the footwork of this game on both sides
                  Because its not a crazy amount of strikes to them.

                  Most 5 round high level fights that go to a decision average 90 plus strikes a round. A good amount are over 100-110. This is the norm.

                  Comment

                  • bmlimo
                    MVP
                    • Apr 2016
                    • 1123

                    #144
                    Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                    Originally posted by Solid_Altair
                    Another way to say that:

                    The opponent shouldn't be able to force his way close to me, even at his demise.

                    Another:

                    The opponent should HAVE to behave and stay on the outside, like good doggy, while I dance for the stars from a distance. Even if he is willing to die to get in, the game shouldn't let him.


                    My point is if you think a guy is controlling the pace when he fights in a way that dooms him. Chris Leben was constantly advancing against Anderson Silva. Do you think he was controlling the pace in any relevant way? Do you think we need to nerf poor Leben's advance?
                    Come on man... look at Silva and leben movement speed, leben never get a chance because he was always at the end of Silva fists and silva was controlling the fight at a safe range...if it was ea ufc 3... leben would throw a foward 1-2 and stay face to face against silva

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                    • Solid_Altair
                      EA Game Changer
                      • Apr 2016
                      • 2043

                      #145
                      Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                      Originally posted by bmlimo
                      Come on man... look at Silva and leben movement speed, leben never get a chance because he was always at the end of Silva fists and silva was controlling the fight at a safe range...if it was ea ufc 3... leben would throw a foward 1-2 and stay face to face against silva
                      But witha superior range and speed and the extra speed of stationary strikes, you can do what Silva did to Leben in the game.

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                      • Zeta Reticulan1
                        Banned
                        • Sep 2017
                        • 471

                        #146
                        Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                        Originally posted by kush land
                        Alot of what zombie said was true just not the pace ?
                        Since you asked I am going to give you my answer.

                        His point about outfighting was - Closing the distance isn't an auto-win, and we are better able to use lengthier fighters after the patch.

                        We know that there are effective defenses to an opponent that is constantly pressuring you. However, the problem is that one of those defenses is not footwork alone.

                        Comment

                        • GeneratedName3542
                          Rookie
                          • May 2018
                          • 17

                          #147
                          Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                          I feel like Solid is misinterpreting what everyone is saying on purpose at this point. I’ve read through this entire thread, and the amount of times I’ve seen him ignore arguments or create straw mans is getting really frustrating.
                          Last edited by GeneratedName3542; 05-03-2018, 03:20 PM.

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                          • GameplayDevUFC
                            Former EA Sports UFC Gameplay Developer
                            • Jun 2014
                            • 2830

                            #148
                            Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                            Originally posted by Zeta Reticulan1
                            Since you asked I am going to give you my answer.

                            His point about outfighting was - Closing the distance isn't an auto-win, and we are better able to use lengthier fighters after the patch.

                            We know that there are effective defenses to an opponent that is constantly pressuring you. However, the problem is that one of those defenses is not footwork alone.
                            When you say "foot work alone", would lunging not count as footwork alone?

                            Because you can evade every strike type using only lunges.

                            So I would argue one of the effective defenses is footwork alone.

                            Comment

                            • bmlimo
                              MVP
                              • Apr 2016
                              • 1123

                              #149
                              Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                              Originally posted by Solid_Altair
                              But witha superior range and speed and the extra speed of stationary strikes, you can do what Silva did to Leben in the game.
                              Far from the same... Silva controlled the distance, leben never had a chance to get on the “inside” ,in the game leben would make it come to inside... could be the same ending but impossible to do what Silva did because it’s really easy to glue in your opponent when moving foward striking

                              Comment

                              • GeneratedName3542
                                Rookie
                                • May 2018
                                • 17

                                #150
                                Re: How is outside fighting considered OP?

                                Again, the problem isn’t that pressure fighting is OP. The problem is that there’s no way to keep range using footwork, resulting in constant chest to chest engagements and non-stop pressure, which is a poor representation of striking in MMA.

                                More defensive tools (such as the side shuffle), the ability to move freely instead of being tied to the opponent, and Martial’s suggestions about forward moving combos would solve the issue and make managing distance for everybody more skillful.

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