The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

[Tuscaloosa]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

I'd say turn it off at home on on the road like Bullet said. Feels like on the road it brings that momentum, where if you don't start off well, the home team will get hype and just kill you. Lost 44-13 to an Akron team that wasn't rated much better than my teambuilder.

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You're not using this setup though, right? I haven't seen many drastic imbalances at all.

[young22]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

You're not using this setup though, right? I haven't seen many drastic imbalances at all.

I'm not. I'm using my own sliders based off JKits, I also do the fatigue reset and have injuries on. I edit down my team's injury ratings, and make up injuries when I see limbs bend weird in game, so I get a decent balance. I just can't sacrifice autosubbing and injuries. I don't use any skill tree aside from recruiting though, and I think that's the single biggest thing that helps. And personally I've never found the CPU to fatigue faster or get injured more than the user, so the only thing was the CPU being bad in the second half, which my reset seems to fix.

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[SilverBullet19]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

I definitely think HFA provides a big user bump. I could kill a team at home and really struggle against them on the road or at a neutral site. My team is an 88 overall and I needed a game winning drive against an 83 overall on the road.

I’m not sure if it boosts the cpu when they’re home, but it doesn’t hurt to leave it on when on the road. Turning it off at home should mitigate the boost. Its a realistic thing, to play better at home, but I want the challenge more.


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[Tuscaloosa]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

I never thought I would say this, but with the new setup, Fatigue & Skill Trees both off is actually too much. Before becoming the HC at Oregon St., I was the OC at Alabama. That season, Bama was the only triple 99 team in the nation. With fatigue OFF and skill trees ON, we not only had 4 close games, but one of them (LSU) even went to overtime. A triple 99 team still getting challenged and it was extremely tough to go undefeated. That's as realistic as it gets, for me. I've seen it too many times in real life; just look at last season, IRL, for the Tide. Really hard to go undefeated, even for the best.

First year at Oregon St. I had Fatigue and Skill Trees OFF, and was getting hammered by most teams, including a mid-seventies Washington St., when my Beavers were mid/high eighties.

So, with all that considered, I recommend one of the following to go along with Jarrod21's RED SET:

A) Skill Trees ON, Fatigue OFF, and wide open, unrestricted recruiting - anyone you want.

B) Fatigue ON, Skill Trees OFF, and recruiting restrictions/house rules.

C) For extra difficulty, Fatigue OFF, Skill Trees OFF, and recruiting restrictions/house rules. This level of difficulty may open the door to change other restrictions I've put on myself, including no audibles, no hot routes, no protection adjustments, and only using Ask Coach for playcalling.

For the foreseeable future, I will be going with option A, because that season with the Tide was so much fun, but I could easily see myself giving option C a try in the future.

For anyone still trying to find that challenge without robbing yourself of too much realism, I highly recommend this setup.

[sherrane]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

I never thought I would say this, but with the new setup, Fatigue & Skill Trees both off is actually too much. Before becoming the HC at Oregon St., I was the OC at Alabama. That season, Bama was the only triple 99 team in the nation. With fatigue OFF and skill trees ON, we not only had 4 close games, but one of them (LSU) even went to overtime. A triple 99 team still getting challenged and it was extremely tough to go undefeated. That's as realistic as it gets, for me. I've seen it too many times in real life; just look at last season, IRL, for the Tide. Really hard to go undefeated, even for the best.

B) Fatigue ON, Skill Trees OFF, and recruiting restrictions/house rules.

After reading this thread and trying some recommendations out, I think this is the best solution you presented. Recruiting: I cannot over-recruit and only add recruits to exceed the number of seniors after week 11 in order to prepare for players leaving early and transfers.



I built Rutgers into a 99, 99, 99 and the game is too easy (I left Washington after winning 7 straight championships and then Georgia after winning 10 straight). I read this thread and was intrigued, so I tried the recommendations out. I think this thread misses the peculiarities of fatigue in this game. I don't think the CPU fatigues faster per se, its that they recover more slowly.


I run a no-huddle offense. I'm pressing the triangle as soon as I'm tackled. I have a custom playbook where plays complement each other enough where I have a play for nearly every situation. I huddle every 4 to 6 plays to substitute fatigued RB, WRs, and/or OLs. My RB is usually gassed after 4 plays if 3 are runs and he can barely move on the 5th or 6th play.



I set fatigue off when I went to play at Michigan State (who was a 93 overall) and ran my normal no huddle offense. I turned fatigue back on after the 3rd quarter ended because I was up 77-3 (8 minute quarters). I was able to score so much because my players never fatigued and I never had to huddle on offense. I had three 12+ play touchdown drives in 1:00 -- 1:15.



For those of you who believe having fatigue off is helping them play more competitive games, are you running a no huddle offense? If you aren't and turning fatigue off is a big improvement, my hypothesis could be correct the CPU recovers more slowly rather than fatigues more quickly.

[SilverBullet19]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

After reading this thread and trying some recommendations out, I think this is the best solution you presented. Recruiting: I cannot over-recruit and only add recruits to exceed the number of seniors after week 11 in order to prepare for players leaving early and transfers.



I built Rutgers into a 99, 99, 99 and the game is too easy (I left Washington after winning 7 straight championships and then Georgia after winning 10 straight). I read this thread and was intrigued, so I tried the recommendations out. I think this thread misses the peculiarities of fatigue in this game. I don't think the CPU fatigues faster per se, its that they recover more slowly.


I run a no-huddle offense. I'm pressing the triangle as soon as I'm tackled. I have a custom playbook where plays complement each other enough where I have a play for nearly every situation. I huddle every 4 to 6 plays to substitute fatigued RB, WRs, and/or OLs. My RB is usually gassed after 4 plays if 3 are runs and he can barely move on the 5th or 6th play.



I set fatigue off when I went to play at Michigan State (who was a 93 overall) and ran my normal no huddle offense. I turned fatigue back on after the 3rd quarter ended because I was up 77-3 (8 minute quarters). I was able to score so much because my players never fatigued and I never had to huddle on offense. I had three 12+ play touchdown drives in 1:00 -- 1:15.



For those of you who believe having fatigue off is helping them play more competitive games, are you running a no huddle offense? If you aren't and turning fatigue off is a big improvement, my hypothesis could be correct the CPU recovers more slowly rather than fatigues more quickly.

That makes sense, actually. It could be that they just don’t recover. When I ran fatigue off, the CPU kept up a bit better for sure. Resetting the fatigue in the 2nd half has had a same effect. The CPU doesn’t get gassed, subs occur, and the fight continues


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[young22]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

After reading this thread and trying some recommendations out, I think this is the best solution you presented. Recruiting: I cannot over-recruit and only add recruits to exceed the number of seniors after week 11 in order to prepare for players leaving early and transfers.



I built Rutgers into a 99, 99, 99 and the game is too easy (I left Washington after winning 7 straight championships and then Georgia after winning 10 straight). I read this thread and was intrigued, so I tried the recommendations out. I think this thread misses the peculiarities of fatigue in this game. I don't think the CPU fatigues faster per se, its that they recover more slowly.


I run a no-huddle offense. I'm pressing the triangle as soon as I'm tackled. I have a custom playbook where plays complement each other enough where I have a play for nearly every situation. I huddle every 4 to 6 plays to substitute fatigued RB, WRs, and/or OLs. My RB is usually gassed after 4 plays if 3 are runs and he can barely move on the 5th or 6th play.



I set fatigue off when I went to play at Michigan State (who was a 93 overall) and ran my normal no huddle offense. I turned fatigue back on after the 3rd quarter ended because I was up 77-3 (8 minute quarters). I was able to score so much because my players never fatigued and I never had to huddle on offense. I had three 12+ play touchdown drives in 1:00 -- 1:15.



For those of you who believe having fatigue off is helping them play more competitive games, are you running a no huddle offense? If you aren't and turning fatigue off is a big improvement, my hypothesis could be correct the CPU recovers more slowly rather than fatigues more quickly.

That's the thing with fatigue off, is my guys feel the same 80 snaps in as the first snap. What you say about fatigue makes perfect sense, surprised no one, myself included, ever noticed it. After I read that, I got to thinking and CPU players definitely spend more time out after they leave due to fatigue. I have my HB slider at 79/85, and it takes the CPU backs like 6-7 plays to get back in late in games. For me, I've found that switching fatigue off for the first play of the second half, then immediately switching it on is the best way to play the game.

But the biggest thing is definitely keeping it realistic with recruiting. Can't allow yourself to cherry pick the guys that go unrecruited.

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[Tuscaloosa]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

After reading this thread and trying some recommendations out, I think this is the best solution you presented. Recruiting: I cannot over-recruit and only add recruits to exceed the number of seniors after week 11 in order to prepare for players leaving early and transfers.



I built Rutgers into a 99, 99, 99 and the game is too easy (I left Washington after winning 7 straight championships and then Georgia after winning 10 straight). I read this thread and was intrigued, so I tried the recommendations out. I think this thread misses the peculiarities of fatigue in this game. I don't think the CPU fatigues faster per se, its that they recover more slowly.


I run a no-huddle offense. I'm pressing the triangle as soon as I'm tackled. I have a custom playbook where plays complement each other enough where I have a play for nearly every situation. I huddle every 4 to 6 plays to substitute fatigued RB, WRs, and/or OLs. My RB is usually gassed after 4 plays if 3 are runs and he can barely move on the 5th or 6th play.



I set fatigue off when I went to play at Michigan State (who was a 93 overall) and ran my normal no huddle offense. I turned fatigue back on after the 3rd quarter ended because I was up 77-3 (8 minute quarters). I was able to score so much because my players never fatigued and I never had to huddle on offense. I had three 12+ play touchdown drives in 1:00 -- 1:15.



For those of you who believe having fatigue off is helping them play more competitive games, are you running a no huddle offense? If you aren't and turning fatigue off is a big improvement, my hypothesis could be correct the CPU recovers more slowly rather than fatigues more quickly.

Everything I recommend in this thread is meant to go together. The options I presented were meant to go with Jarrod21's red set and everything else I laid out. If you try to apply certain options with sliders of your own or whatever, the results won't be the same, and I never said they would be. Not just in my thread, but in any, I would try the settings to a T before I tweak it with ideas of my own and then proceed to **** all over someone else's efforts. And at 77-3, it sounds like you need some play-calling self-restraint, regardless of settings.

And I will always adamantly disagree about fatigue. The CPU is penalized at a faster/harder rate than the USER from opening kickoff until the final gun. If not, I don't understand why using the exact same settings, with fatigue being the only thing changed, would produce such a different effort from the CPU's players on THE FIRST PLAY FROM SCRIMMAGE, game in and game out. I've tested this multiple times, playing the same exact game, with the same exact players, and getting a totally different result at the very start of the game. If they weren't penalized more/harsher, why would they be a worse team in the beginning of the game than they are with fatigue off? Coincidence?

[SilverBullet19]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

Everything I recommend in this thread is meant to go together. The options I presented were meant to go with Jarrod21's red set and everything else I laid out. If you try to apply certain options with sliders of your own or whatever, the results won't be the same, and I never said they would be. Not just in my thread, but in any, I would try the settings to a T before I tweak it with ideas of my own and then proceed to **** all over someone else's efforts. And at 77-3, it sounds like you need some play-calling self-restraint, regardless of settings.

And I will always adamantly disagree about fatigue. The CPU is penalized at a faster/harder rate than the USER from opening kickoff until the final gun. If not, I don't understand why using the exact same settings, with fatigue being the only thing changed, would produce such a different effort from the CPU's players on THE FIRST PLAY FROM SCRIMMAGE, game in and game out. I've tested this multiple times, playing the same exact game, with the same exact players, and getting a totally different result at the very start of the game. If they weren't penalized more/harsher, why would they be a worse team in the beginning of the game than they are with fatigue off? Coincidence?

Harsh words Tuscaloosa, but I do have to agree with you a bit. I didn't really catch that part, I guess I was skimming, but if you rack up 17 championships and you're crushing a 93 team 77-3 after 3 quarters, there's 110% some cheesing going on, even if you're a 99.

Making changes for realism and fixing the issues, as this thread is for, won't help if you're still exploiting CPU shortcomings.

[young22]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

Harsh words Tuscaloosa, but I do have to agree with you a bit. I didn't really catch that part, I guess I was skimming, but if you rack up 17 championships and you're crushing a 93 team 77-3 after 3 quarters, there's 110% some cheesing going on, even if you're a 99.

Making changes for realism and fixing the issues, as this thread is for, won't help if you're still exploiting CPU shortcomings.

Yeah homie is 100 percent cheesing. I've never scored 77 in any football game, not even when I ran for 2600 yards and 34 TDs with 1 guy back in Madden 12. Topped out at 76-34 over the Cardinals. I do think he's right about the way fatigue works though.

Tuscaloosa you still the man tho.

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[Tuscaloosa]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

Harsh words Tuscaloosa, but I do have to agree with you a bit. I didn't really catch that part, I guess I was skimming, but if you rack up 17 championships and you're crushing a 93 team 77-3 after 3 quarters, there's 110% some cheesing going on, even if you're a 99.

Making changes for realism and fixing the issues, as this thread is for, won't help if you're still exploiting CPU shortcomings.

Yeah, that's my bad, fellas. Someone was having a bad day, that day lol. My reaction wasn't so much about me and this thread in particular, but rather about an overall mindset that I sometimes see on this board. It mainly happens in the roster update thread - people giving them crap for not updating a game, FOR FREE, at a fast enough rate to suit them. That and to jkits and his settings, which is very ironic, considering that jkits is probably the nicest dude on this board. I've seen it a few times, but that guy last week or so really irked me. I didn't say much then, because it's j's thread and you all had his back pretty quickly, but it just really bothers me when someone tries to tell someone else how THEIR OWN OPINION is wrong. That's not really how opinions work when you're dealing with something in which there are no proven facts. Try it, don't try it. Like it, don't like it. Just don't try and belittle someone else and their opinion/work with your statz and skillz.

[young22]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

Yeah, that's my bad, fellas. Someone was having a bad day, that day lol. My reaction wasn't so much about me and this thread in particular, but rather about an overall mindset that I sometimes see on this board. It mainly happens in the roster update thread - people giving them crap for not updating a game, FOR FREE, at a fast enough rate to suit them. That and to jkits and his settings, which is very ironic, considering that jkits is probably the nicest dude on this board. I've seen it a few times, but that guy last week or so really irked me. I didn't say much then, because it's j's thread and you all had his back pretty quickly, but it just really bothers me when someone tries to tell someone else how THEIR OWN OPINION is wrong. That's not really how opinions work when you're dealing with something in which there are no proven facts. Try it, don't try it. Like it, don't like it. Just don't try and belittle someone else and their opinion/work with your statz and skillz.

Straight facts. You can't bash someone who puts stuff out for free. Like even if it was wack, what did you lose? A couple hours of your time? Keep it moving. Dude in JKits thread was just bad at the game, at least that's what it seemed to me. Talking about it's too hard and stuff, like that's just a "get good" situation.

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[Tuscaloosa]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

Straight facts. You can't bash someone who puts stuff out for free. Like even if it was wack, what did you lose? A couple hours of your time? Keep it moving. Dude in JKits thread was just bad at the game, at least that's what it seemed to me. Talking about it's too hard and stuff, like that's just a "get good" situation.

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Yeah, it's not bad to ask questions. It's just about how you ask. In hindsight, I probably overreacted to this dude, but when he mentioned that score and the fact that he ran a no-huddle, I thought the classic "Come on, man..." So, to you, sir, I apologize. And, to answer your question, I don't run a no-huddle. I've restricted myself with "Ask Coach" for years to avoid scores like that, but I'm always trying to think of a way around that.

That guy in J's thread though, he's one that really deserved that type of response. You can ask questions with a true intent of hoping to be informed, or you can ask them with the sole intent of diminishing someone else or something they believe in, like the rosters or j's sliders. I clearly prefer the former lol.

[young22]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

Yeah, it's not bad to ask questions. It's just about how you ask. In hindsight, I probably overreacted to this dude, but when he mentioned that score and the fact that he ran a no-huddle, I thought the classic "Come on, man..." So, to you, sir, I apologize. And, to answer your question, I don't run a no-huddle. I've restricted myself with "Ask Coach" for years to avoid scores like that, but I'm always trying to think of a way around that.

That guy in J's thread though, he's one that really deserved that type of response. You can ask questions with a true intent of hoping to be informed, or you can ask them with the sole intent of diminishing someone else or something they believe in, like the rosters or j's sliders. I clearly prefer the former lol.

Anyone that's winning 17 titles in a row is not attempting to play sim. Guarantee his sliders are easy, and he spams zone reads/4 verts. I'm pretty good at NCAA and not even on the easier sets I've used have I put up 77 in 3 quarters on Heisman, let alone on a 93 overall team. I don't think I've put up 77 period, I've topped out in the 60s against like FCS teams, or multiple OT shootouts.

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[Tuscaloosa]

Re: The Game Outside of the Game - Issues and How to Fix Them

Anyway, back to business.

Speaking of questions lol, bullet, when you were mentioning turning HFA off for home games, was that just for added challenge or did you see negative/adverse effects that applied to the CPU on the road that didn't apply to the USER on the road?