run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

[KingV2k3]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

Here's an interesting item that will help understand how the Legend books could be thought of / implemented:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Coryell

Madden / Vermeil (Martz) / Gibbs are all from this "Vertical / Spread" tree, along with BAL OC Cameron, SD Turner and OAK Saunders

Walsh / West Coast is a "horizontal" implementation that's success is based in high completion percentage passes and "less talented" (as per Walsh) personnel...

Gibbs is a two TE / Zone run implementation of a vertical offence...

Billick is a West Coast variant as well, which is ALSO a variant of "Air Coryell"...

Flores is ALSO a variant of the Sid Gilman style, which is the predecessor to "Air Coryell"...

Landry and Lombardi are the only Legend books that don't have a Gilman / Coryell / Vertical base...

Even the Walsh / West Coast traces back to that...

Anyway:

It's interesting stuff...

Conclusion:

The majority of these Legend books are based in Vertical / Spread origins, with Gibbs run heavy / twin TE and Walsh's WC variants included...with Billick's book as a "not too distant" cousin...

[SJHalt621]

Off subject I still don't understand how this isn't an easy fix for the Madden team..it's not game play issue..it seems like a easy fix with adjusting the star system..I mean just make each play on 1st and 2nd down the same..that would be the easiest way

[californ14]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

I just recalled something I remember seeing on the EA Madden site prior to release: They had a number of videos explaining the upcoming features to M13, and one of the videos, focusing on the CCM, discussed how the CPU would, adjust play calling based on personnel; the example was something along the lines of: if a team was a geared to the pass, like say the Colts, but lost their big QB, like Petton Manning, the CPU team would adjust to call plays that favored its strength, which meant they may call more run plays if it turned out that their new QB did not give them a strong enough pass offense....


Anyone else recall this?

If so, could this be happening? Or could a glitch or error in the CPU programming be messing up logical play calling? Could the CPU be calculating some teams as run heavy teams when they should be pass? or vice-versa? Based on overall, or other player attribute combinations?

Just a thought, And probably not much to it, but thought I would throw it out...

[KingV2k3]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

Off subject I still don't understand how this isn't an easy fix for the Madden team..it's not game play issue..it seems like a easy fix with adjusting the star system..I mean just make each play on 1st and 2nd down the same..that would be the easiest way

Yup, they had the gameplans MUCH closer in past iterations, so they know (or knew?) how to do it...

Same thing with the sim engine stats...

They used to have them much more in line with reality...now they need to simply (???) reduce the number of minutes played in the sim engine until they get a realistic amount of plays per game...

Got me!

I just recalled something I remember seeing on the EA Madden site prior to release: They had a number of videos explaining the upcoming features to M13, and one of the videos, focusing on the CCM, discussed how the CPU would, adjust play calling based on personnel; the example was something along the lines of: if a team was a geared to the pass, like say the Colts, but lost their big QB, like Petton Manning, the CPU team would adjust to call plays that favored its strength, which meant they may call more run plays if it turned out that their new QB did not give them a strong enough pass offense....


Anyone else recall this?

If so, could this be happening? Or could a glitch or error in the CPU programming be messing up logical play calling? Could the CPU be calculating some teams as run heavy teams when they should be pass? or vice-versa? Based on overall, or other player attribute combinations?

Just a thought, And probably not much to it, but thought I would throw it out...

It might be slightly affected by the above, but the true culprit (thanks to the guys who started and got this thread rolling) is the "star system" in gameplans...

They work in the generics, so they WOULD work with the team specifics, if they were designed similarly...

Once again:

Ya got me as to why / why / why / etc.

[vicaddict]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

Yeah, this offence seems to agree with the Browns roster / scheme...much better than their default west coast...

Are you using Shurmer or a created guy or what?

I'm using a created spread / "strategist" with the Vermeil Book set to 52 pass / 48 run / 52 aggressive / 48 conservative...

I think those coach elements also influence gameplay/ results...

HC prestige is also a factor

Sorry for the late answer. I am using a created coach, team builder, Lvl 1.
run/pass 55/45 (The QB throws ~25 times, RB1 runs 20-25 times, RB2&3 run for a combined ~5)
agg/cons 60/40 (might be 55/45, besides I never found an explanation what that actually does)

When I use the "coach mode" McCoy really uses everyone on the field. Usually both TE's, HB and FB get most of the catches, while the receivers get left behind. Little, Massaqoui, Cribbs and Sanzenbacher (I always pick him up) get the ball and deliver big plays, however. Just how I like it.

Is it posssible that changing the scheme in fact does influence the performance? I blew PHI and CIN using those options and Power Run, when I switched to a balanced scheme (kept everything ele of course) I had trouble playing BUF.

[KingV2k3]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

Sorry for the late answer. I am using a created coach, team builder, Lvl 1.
run/pass 55/45 (The QB throws ~25 times, RB1 runs 20-25 times, RB2&3 run for a combined ~5)
agg/cons 60/40 (might be 55/45, besides I never found an explanation what that actually does)

When I use the "coach mode" McCoy really uses everyone on the field. Usually both TE's, HB and FB get most of the catches, while the receivers get left behind. Little, Massaqoui, Cribbs and Sanzenbacher (I always pick him up) get the ball and deliver big plays, however. Just how I like it.

Is it posssible that changing the scheme in fact does influence the performance? I blew PHI and CIN using those options and Power Run, when I switched to a balanced scheme (kept everything ele of course) I had trouble playing BUF.

I think you decided to roll w Billick, correct?

If that's the case, then I'd switch scheme to either west coast or spread (preferred)...

The players will play differently (with this switch, much better)...

I will bet that making that change gets the WRs more involved in the passing game....

I also would go to your "Progression" screen, make note of each of your starters "Style" and then implement those changes in your scheme screen...

I find when those setting match who's on the field exactly, it improves performance...

I look forward to hearing how all that works out!

[treq21]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

Yup, they had the gameplans MUCH closer in past iterations, so they know (or knew?) how to do it...

Same thing with the sim engine stats...

They used to have them much more in line with reality...now they need to simply (???) reduce the number of minutes played in the sim engine until they get a realistic amount of plays per game...

Got me!






It might be slightly affected by the above, but the true culprit (thanks to the guys who started and got this thread rolling) is the "star system" in gameplans...

They work in the generics, so they WOULD work with the team specifics, if they were designed similarly...

Once again:

Ya got me as to why / why / why / etc.

I think we can safely assume that it will not be fixed. Nothing but silence from EA on this. Just this years game breaker. Almost every year has SOMETHING that keeps the game from being truly great. The lost potential is really saddening.

[D_Fos]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

Game 4
Skins(me) 31 VS Bucs(CPU) 23
Didn't go into OT, like my 2 other games did, however it was down to the final minutes!! w/ both defenses stepping up late in the 2nd half.
Tale of 2 halfs!

1st half:
Skins: 28
Bucs: 20

2nd half:
Skins: 3
Bucs: 3

The Balanced PB played out very well for the Bucs(449yd total O, 203 rushing)

Blount 7brk tak
Skins 2brk tak

This game was going back and forth all game!
T.O.P
Skins: 30:57
Bucs: 29:03

They kept me guessing, using Spread Shotgun and running Blount on Draws! I was surprised how well they executed. They threw in a little bit of everything.
Both sides had a good amount of yards after 1st hit.

Run V Pass
Skins: 28/22
Bucs: 30/33
this is w/ 15min qtrs 12sec time left on playclock.

Player of Game
RG3, 366yds passing, 48rush, 4tds passing 1int. 116qb rating
NFC POW!!

Bucs
449 total yds: ran for over 200yds!
4sacks and 1int
3turnovers, Freeman lost 1 on a sack fumble forced by Kerrigan late in the 4th qtr.

Skins(me)
494 total yds:
3sacks
2ints
1 turnover

Orakpo and Kerrigan each get a sack, for their 1st sacks of the season, hopefully they will start picking it up now. I'm also also making more defensive line/Lb adjustments/blitz angles.


Note:
Adjustments to gameplay Sliders, ie. Ints, BTKs/yards after 1st hit and also Autosubs(RBs need more rotation), and Penalty sliders(still a lil low)1-3per gm.

Updates coming soon, stay tuned.................. http://www.operationsports.com/forum...realism-7.html

[SJHalt621]

I think you decided to roll w Billick, correct?

If that's the case, then I'd switch scheme to either west coast or spread (preferred)...

The players will play differently (with this switch, much better)...

I will bet that making that change gets the WRs more involved in the passing game....

I also would go to your "Progression" screen, make note of each of your starters "Style" and then implement those changes in your scheme screen...

I find when those setting match who's on the field exactly, it improves performance...

I look forward to hearing how all that works out!

I got ordered into work last night..ill be check landry's playbook in a hour or so..sorry about that

[geisterhome]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

i see the first page hasnt been updated for almost 2 weeks, no update needed there, i mean there have been like 20 pages of discussion since then.

[D_Fos]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

Next up!
3-1 Redskins(me) VS 3-1 Falcons(CPU)

The Falcons(irl) through 8gms
Run vs Pass ratio

Run(25) VS Pass(38)

They should do well w/ the Pass Balance PB and 4-3 D.
I like how the CPU is utilizing more shotgun run plays on Balanced and Pass Balanced.

Should be a fun game! Will update asap.
http://www.operationsports.com/forums/madden-nfl-football-sliders/586405-all-madden-default-patch-3-realism.html

[KingV2k3]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

I got ordered into work last night..ill be check landry's playbook in a hour or so..sorry about that

Work???

C'mon Man!!!



Seriously, no prob...

My next CCM Browns game is versus DAL, so I'm going to give them the Landry and we can compare notes...

Maybe tomorrow, mos def Saturday...

i see the first page hasnt been updated for almost 2 weeks, no update needed there, i mean there have been like 20 pages of discussion since then.

My two cents, since I "hijacked" the back end of this thread:



Other than personal preferences like my current (but not permanent) decision to give:

BAL / Billick

OAK / Madden

DAL / Landry

It's all pretty much as it stands on post one.

I'm still trying to find someone to give Gibbs (no gun, but still) to...some team)...

I also might assign Vermeil to someone other than my CLE team at some point...

On a gameplay note:

BAL / Billick lit me up for 51 last game

This game Flacco threw 4 picks, they looked lost and...lost...barely, but still...

When I advance to 2013, I'll prob try a different book for them...

Funny how "polar opposite" the results were...

[Drtro]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

How can I get a decent amount of runs using Ask Madden. I even put the ratio to 70/30 and still rarely have running plays to choose from. I've tried different playbooks.

[agidio3]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

i see the first page hasnt been updated for almost 2 weeks, no update needed there, i mean there have been like 20 pages of discussion since then.

yea sorry i just got power back ...live in the east coast and was in the direct path of that sloot sandy... i havent gotten a chance to look through the rest of the threads

[KBLover]

Re: run/pass ratio Team specific playbooks for computer- offline CCM

On a gameplay note:

BAL / Billick lit me up for 51 last game

This game Flacco threw 4 picks, they looked lost and...lost...barely, but still...

When I advance to 2013, I'll prob try a different book for them...

Funny how "polar opposite" the results were...

Sound about right.

Unfortunately.