2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

[wwharton]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

I was going to start a new thread but remember this topic was already out there.

Not a flame/hate post but a legit question: How much better is John Wall right now than Kemba Walker?

Besides size and speed, I don't see any other area where Wall just outclasses Kemba.

Every scouting report and comment from NBA execs knocking Kemba is based on his size.

Okay. Well, Wall couldn't shoot in Kentucky...and he still can't.

He's a much better passer but I don't don't consider him a better player than Kemba.

What do you all think?

Size and speed are pretty big deals.

And why would their FG%s be so vastly different?

This is what I'm trying to get at. He's barely shooting 40%.

If he has so much size and is so physical and can get to the rim so easily, why is his FG% so low?

And is it not that which will separate him from other players? Elite players?

This is not a John Wall thread I know. But why are college players being knocked for their lack of size when someone who has the size can't barely crack 40% shooting.

Same goes for Sullinger.

As just mentioned, the kid is 2 years removed from high school ball. Meanwhile he's the face of a franchise and the captain. In other words, right now he's a bit in over his head... pretty much anyone not named Lebron James would be. He's still putting up solid numbers. I don't think any player without his size and speed in a similar situation (from experience to the team around them) would do as well. I was going to say maybe Iverson but he had the speed.

[da ThRONe]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

Size and speed are pretty big deals.



As just mentioned, the kid is 2 years removed from high school ball. Meanwhile he's the face of a franchise and the captain. In other words, right now he's a bit in over his head... pretty much anyone not named Lebron James would be. He's still putting up solid numbers. I don't think any player without his size and speed in a similar situation (from experience to the team around them) would do as well. I was going to say maybe Iverson but he had the speed.

Like the old saying "You can teach technique, but you can't teach size and/or speed".

[jeebs9]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

But I also think they are 2 different type of points guards at the end of the day. It's shocking to me that Rose has only shot 43% this year. For someone who has the size, speed, and ablitiy to finish like his does. To only shot 43% fg is crazy in my opinion. Rose is more of a scoring point guard. While Wall is more of passing point guard. If they both can get their shooting % and above 45%. They will be unstoppable.

[wwharton]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

But I also think they are 2 different type of points guards at the end of the day. It's shocking to me that Rose has only shot 43% this year. For someone who has the size, speed, and ablitiy to finish like his does. To only shot 43% fg is crazy in my opinion. Rose is more of a scoring point guard. While Wall is more of passing point guard. If they both can get their shooting % and above 45%. They will be unstoppable.

May be expecting too much for a guard. Guards that shoot a lot and approach 50% from the field are rare. The fg% of MJ and Stockton are amazing considering their positions (more amazing for MJ of course, considering the attention he got and how many shots he put up). 43% is nothing to brag about but it's also not horrible by any means... especially in the day of the 3. If he were shooting 43% inside the line then it may be more surprising.

[jeebs9]

Inside the 3 point line?.... Or foul line?
I mean a guys like cp3 and dwill shoot way over 45%.


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[Yeah...THAT Guy]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

Inside the 3 point line?.... Or foul line?
I mean a guys like cp3 and dwill shoot way over 45%.


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CP3 shot 43% his first 2 years and is shooting 47% this year (he shot 48-50% the 3 years between)

Deron shot 42% as a rookie, 45.6% his 2nd year, 50% 3rd year, and the last 3 years he's shot 47%, 47%, and 44%.

[jeebs9]

I know that already... I checked before I said it lol

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[iAM-IncReDiBLe-]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

Yea but they also don't take as many shots as Rose has had to take this year. Your bound to miss more if you take more shots especially when fatigue starts settling in.

[wwharton]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

Inside the 3 point line?.... Or foul line?
I mean a guys like cp3 and dwill shoot way over 45%.


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That says more about them than it does about Rose. If the criticism is about not being good enough then you compare to the norm, not the top of the league (unless you're comparing specifically to those guys and we're only focusing on how one is better than another).

[bigeastbumrush]

I was going to start a new thread but remember this topic was already out there.



Not a flame/hate post but a legit question: How much better is John Wall right now than Kemba Walker?



Besides size and speed, I don't see any other area where Wall just outclasses Kemba.



Every scouting report and comment from NBA execs knocking Kemba is based on his size.



Okay. Well, Wall couldn't shoot in Kentucky...and he still can't.



He's a much better passer but I don't don't consider him a better player than Kemba.



What do you all think?

Size and speed are pretty big deals.

And why would their FG%s be so vastly different?



This is what I'm trying to get at. He's barely shooting 40%.



If he has so much size and is so physical and can get to the rim so easily, why is his FG% so low?



And is it not that which will separate him from other players? Elite players?



This is not a John Wall thread I know. But why are college players being knocked for their lack of size when someone who has the size can't barely crack 40% shooting.



Same goes for Sullinger.

As just mentioned, the kid is 2 years removed from high school ball. Meanwhile he's the face of a franchise and the captain. In other words, right now he's a bit in over his head... pretty much anyone not named Lebron James would be. He's still putting up solid numbers. I don't think any player without his size and speed in a similar situation (from experience to the team around them) would do as well. I was going to say maybe Iverson but he had the speed.

Size and speed? Brandon Knight has both.
What's your point?

How has Wall's size and speed translated into the league and how do you project Kemba's lack thereof projecting?

[jeebs9]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

I don't think Brandon Knight is that good. I think he is more of a shooter. He doesn't have blazing speed as well as that break you down explosiveness in the half court or full court (His handle isn't that good either). His passing is just above average in my opinion.

Kemba Walker reminds me of Kyle Lowery from the Rockets (Surprising Aaron Brooks old team lol). I was just reading that he might go after the lottery right now.

But back to John Wall. Right now... John Wall could be the (next) best point guard in the league. I think his only problems now are in the half court. He doesn't have a go to floater in the lane. Besides that he gets steals, blocks and rebounds. And think once he gets his turnovers down. Look out...

[wwharton]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

Size and speed? Brandon Knight has both.
What's your point?

How has Wall's size and speed translated into the league and how do you project Kemba's lack thereof projecting?

What's your point? Here's the quote (listed right in your post, btw), "Besides size and speed, I don't see any other area where Wall just outclasses Kemba."

No conversation about Brandon Knight at all there.

As for how it's translated, I also answered that in the quote right there in your post. As a rookie who is getting the bulk of attention from other teams' defense (something I don't see happening with Kemba as it's not the case with most rookies), he's averaging 16 points, 8.5 assists and 1.6 steals per game. So to answer the question another way, Wall's size and speed (bc we all know his shot's not there yet) has him in the conversation for rookie of the year. If Kemba ends up being in that conversation, it will have a lot more to do with who he has playing around him (imo).

EDIT: After reading jeebs' reply, I'm thinking maybe the reason you brought up Brandon Knight was to compare him to Wall (maybe since Kemba and Knight have actually played against each other and using that to evaluate). If that's the case then I think jeebs also summed that up... Knight is not Wall.

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

What's your point? Here's the quote (listed right in your post, btw), "Besides size and speed, I don't see any other area where Wall just outclasses Kemba."

No conversation about Brandon Knight at all there.

As for how it's translated, I also answered that in the quote right there in your post. As a rookie who is getting the bulk of attention from other teams' defense (something I don't see happening with Kemba as it's not the case with most rookies), he's averaging 16 points, 8.5 assists and 1.6 steals per game. So to answer the question another way, Wall's size and speed (bc we all know his shot's not there yet) has him in the conversation for rookie of the year. If Kemba ends up being in that conversation, it will have a lot more to do with who he has playing around him (imo).

EDIT: After reading jeebs' reply, I'm thinking maybe the reason you brought up Brandon Knight was to compare him to Wall (maybe since Kemba and Knight have actually played against each other and using that to evaluate). If that's the case then I think jeebs also summed that up... Knight is not Wall.

I only brought up Knight because someone was focused on size and speed which people here and scouts gush over. Neither of which says Knight will translate well into the pro league. Wall has intangibles that Knight doesn't.

[wwharton]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

I only brought up Knight because someone was focused on size and speed which people here and scouts gush over. Neither of which says Knight will translate well into the pro league. Wall has intangibles that Knight doesn't.

Right, you need talent too (and yeah I edited a bit after I figured out that's where you were going). Not saying Kemba doesn't have talent, and a lot of it. The question is does he have enough to make up for the lack of size and speed... and is it possible for him to develop what he doesn't have (to get to an elite level). With Wall, it's much more likely bc he has size and speed... and he's also already putting up stats despite the obvious holes in his game.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: 2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

So who goes #1 overall? And what are your top 5-10 picks

Irving will hire an agent.

In my eyes, I draft him first. All of these other guys like Williams, Kanter and Perry Jones... I mean they seem like projects to me.

With Irving it could be similar to a CP3 situation all over again. I have a sneaking feeling Irving could go 3rd or 4th... but end up the best player of the draft by far.

Don't make that mistake, just take him #1 and be done with it. In fact to me he's the only can't miss out of the lottery projections.

You have a bunch of big Euro's, you have American projects, and then you have PG's like Kemba/Knight/Jimmer who you don't know what you're gonna get out of them.

Take Irving first!