The strongest punishment to side sway spam

[Serengeti1]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

Martial mind:You have to really guess where they are slipping to counter em
me:Then this game is based on Luck

A lot of it is luck with the current meta which is really unfortunate. Some are better at manipulating timing than others but there's a ton of luck involved. Definitely too much imo.

[killakrok]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

Thoughts?

That vid also touches on the fact that many of these "counters" just make no sense in terms of real life MMA and combat sports. He mentions that in real life the jab is extremely reliable and prominent but in this game it is risky and rare. During the last UFC event I remember the commentators talking about how much Stefan Struve would benefit from fighting behind his jab to take advantage of his huge reach.

Jabs should be the safest and most reliable strike, but in this system it can be one of the riskiest and least used tools. That just makes no sense from the perspective of representing actual MMA and combat sports.

Within this frames, frame advantage, rock paper scissor, arcade fighting game core it just seems like its a bunch of mechanics that try to emulate MMA on the surface, but don't feel rooted in the actual sport so "counters" to specific actions end up being extremely specific tactics that are more game meta than actual fight logic.

Instead of the system being geared towards representing MMA and progressing towards a true representation of the sport when "fixes" are made, the fixes feel like band-aids to specific game mechanics that when "fixed" just take everything further from reality.

Instead of finding the real life solution to the problem and tweaking the game to replicate that solution and build a better realistic frame around the game, it feels like things are reversed and the game is tweaked to fix very particular things that are already not great representations of the sport which takes things further and further away from the sport the game is trying to replicate.

[Serengeti1]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

^

Real quality post

[johnmangala]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

I wish they could buff the jab to intercept more sways.

But we all fear the game becoming jab city.

So in that case, jabs should become increasingly vulnerable to cross counters, hooks etc so pull counters are more effective.

[The meticulous Esp]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

EA MMA had a small budget and that gane turned out great for what they had, especially the striking. They pushed out a patch for the stamina and the game was as close to sim as possible with perfect pacing on a real clock, not this accelerated timer we have and guys throwing 130 strikes a round.

I loved that game !!

[RetractedMonkey]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

Every UFC has some sort of gimmick that ruins the gaming experience. It was parries last time and now it’s head movement. Remove the gimmick, restore the game. Right now the main strategy against head movement is to do it back and play Russian Roulette on who gets KOed first or try and avoid it until they lose their stamina so you can actually fight.

Now someone tell me, if the main strategy right now revolves around making them lose stamina, HOW DOES A STAMINA TAX NOT STREAMLINE THAT?

This is CLEARLY one of those things that the players know more about than the developers.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[AlEx3KillA]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

Every UFC has some sort of gimmick that ruins the gaming experience. It was parries last time and now it’s head movement. Remove the gimmick, restore the game. Right now the main strategy against head movement is to do it back and play Russian Roulette on who gets KOed first or try and avoid it until they lose their stamina so you can actually fight.

Now someone tell me, if the main strategy right now revolves around making them lose stamina, HOW DOES A STAMINA TAX NOT STREAMLINE THAT?

This is CLEARLY one of those things that the players know more about than the developers.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

They taxed the knockdowns i dont understand why they fear soo much stamina taxing the head movement after taxing everything else

[johnmangala]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

Gassed head movement should be more like how Velasquez was moving his head in R2 and beyond of his fight with Werdum.

[SwordOfAllah]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

The strongest punishment for sway spam is a stamina tax right now....with lag is very hard to counter head movement

[dina1229]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

The players he's playing aren't as good as him for one. Secondly, they're not using the head movement as effectively as it can be used. While I will say there are a couple rocks he got there for hitting the guy at the right vulnerability window... there's also TONS of times when that doesn't happen.

The guys he's fighting here aren't very good with head movement though. They have poor timing in general imo.

I'm going to second this. I've noticed he has multiple accounts on whatever system he is playing on. I'm sure that allows him to be in various divisions depending on what type of gameplay footage he is trying to capture. His tips are good bits of advice, but when you start getting into the action with people that have mastered this particular meta these tips won't help. They will be right up in your face the entire time. There is no way to create space. They force you to brawl.

[dina1229]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

That vid also touches on the fact that many of these "counters" just make no sense in terms of real life MMA and combat sports. He mentions that in real life the jab is extremely reliable and prominent but in this game it is risky and rare. During the last UFC event I remember the commentators talking about how much Stefan Struve would benefit from fighting behind his jab to take advantage of his huge reach.

Jabs should be the safest and most reliable strike, but in this system it can be one of the riskiest and least used tools. That just makes no sense from the perspective of representing actual MMA and combat sports.

Within this frames, frame advantage, rock paper scissor, arcade fighting game core it just seems like its a bunch of mechanics that try to emulate MMA on the surface, but don't feel rooted in the actual sport so "counters" to specific actions end up being extremely specific tactics that are more game meta than actual fight logic.

Instead of the system being geared towards representing MMA and progressing towards a true representation of the sport when "fixes" are made, the fixes feel like band-aids to specific game mechanics that when "fixed" just take everything further from reality.

Instead of finding the real life solution to the problem and tweaking the game to replicate that solution and build a better realistic frame around the game, it feels like things are reversed and the game is tweaked to fix very particular things that are already not great representations of the sport which takes things further and further away from the sport the game is trying to replicate.

I'm glad you mentioned the jab. On a side note, have you guys noticed how high the stamina tax is on a slipped jab? I think it is far too high. I noticed this with several matches against the AI on pro. The AI will just run from you so it becomes risky to hunt them down and throw strikes because they will slip them all and leave you with no stamina. I tried to just keep putting the jab out there as a range finder to know when I could follow up with a more powerful strike.... WOW. When the AI slipped my jab my stamina just melted away. I'm sure this is a factor in online play as well.

[EarvGotti]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

I'm glad you mentioned the jab. On a side note, have you guys noticed how high the stamina tax is on a slipped jab? I think it is far too high. I noticed this with several matches against the AI on pro. The AI will just run from you so it becomes risky to hunt them down and throw strikes because they will slip them all and leave you with no stamina. I tried to just keep putting the jab out there as a range finder to know when I could follow up with a more powerful strike.... WOW. When the AI slipped my jab my stamina just melted away. I'm sure this is a factor in online play as well.

I mentioned this about 20 pages ago in this thread and no one seemed to think anything of it.

That's a big part of the problem with the jab too. You get 10 of those slipped and your stamina has already lost a big chunk...

[dina1229]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

I mentioned this about 20 pages ago in this thread and no one seemed to think anything of it.

That's a big part of the problem with the jab too. You get 10 of those slipped and your stamina has already lost a big chunk...

LOL ya this thread became pretty discombobulated really quickly. I wonder if they are even still viewing this thread?

But back to stamina for a minute. I just posted in another thread that the unrealistic stamina is what is creating this crap meta. We can tune all of these small things and make adjustments, but I truly believe the basic foundation for stamina is flawed in this game. I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote below, but also add a couple of photos of a fight I just had....

Quote: "This is my biggest beef. If you want to blitz me and throw 120 strikes per round, you should be paying for it in the stamina department by the end of the 2nd round.

There was some discussion with GPD about why your fighter uses more energy when he/she misses strikes vs when their strikes hit your block. He mentioned that you exert more energy when you miss because you have to slow your strike down. When you hit something with a big enough mass it absorbs your energy (like hitting someones block).

I take his word for this example since I have never kicked or punched someone in their stomach for 3 rounds. However, regardless of the "science" behind why the game was built this way, the stamina system is completely jacked.

If the end result doesn't accurately reflect the sport, then the logic behind their striking/stamina system is irrelevant. We shouldn't be seeing anyone outside of the flyweight division throwing 200 strikes by the end of round 2 and having 85 percent stamina left simply because their strikes made contact with your block.

They wouldn't have to tweak the up in your face meta so much if they could get the stamina system where it should be. There are mixed opinions about the footwork in this game. Some say that it is OP and some say that it isn't adequate. I tend to be of the opinion that the footwork and headmovement isn't adequate in the current meta. But the meta is unrealistic and I think they should start by fixing that first. End Quote

So here is a fight I just had in the heavyweight division. Now I'm not taking anything away from my opponent. He did an excellent job working my body (which is why I have low 5th round stamina). However, the amount of volume that this guy can throw is absolutely RIDICULOUS. I'm going to attach two photos showing his stamina at the start of round 5 with the end fight striking stats....

[dina1229]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

I mentioned this about 20 pages ago in this thread and no one seemed to think anything of it.

That's a big part of the problem with the jab too. You get 10 of those slipped and your stamina has already lost a big chunk...

PHOTO 2..... Self explanatory

[dina1229]

Re: The strongest punishment to side sway spam

Trying that again since the first didn't upload