News Post

Why I'm Done With NBA Basketball This Year: NBA 2K9

11:53 AM - March 24, 2009 by RaychelSnr

If you have been paying attention to the community’s efforts to tweak NBA 2K9 during the past few months, you probably noticed that Neon1, one of the hardest-working NBA 2K community members, redid the ratings and tendencies for every player and coach in the game.

As someone who had previously shelved NBA 2K9 out of frustration, I was initially excited to sit down and try this tweaked version of NBA 2K9 now that March Madness is in full bloom.

But after only a few games as my underachieving Grizzlies -- who have actually gotten a lot better, ratings-wise, since I last touched the game -- it became clear to me that the same opinion I had formed a few months ago still holds true:

NBA 2K9 is a mess, and no amount of slider tweaking or roster editing can save it.

So, in the first of a two-part series, I am here to explain why I have given up on NBA hoops this year, and I am also here to detail what needs to be improved in 2010.

Read More - Why I'm Done With NBA Basketball This Year: NBA 2K9

Game: NBA 2K9Reader Score: 8.5/10 - Vote Now
Platform: PS2 / PS3 / Xbox 360Votes for game: 72 - View All

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Member Comments

# 201 HMcCoy @ 04/13/09 02:30 AM

TO, would you be willing to bet 1000 bucks that you didn't try to tap the shoot button for a quicker shot knowing you were down to the last seconds...which culmintated in a pump fake? If there were a cosmic DVR that could rewind and show your fingers, i'd be willing to take that bet that you did, bro. Do you often see jumpers hitch like that?

Luv mist brings up another good point though...shooters with slow releases are at a unrealistic disadvantage in this game. I can't get a 'perfect' release jumper off with Gordon without getting blocked to save my life...

# 202 Rawdeal28 @ 04/13/09 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by totalownership


	I gotta double amen and bold this because there is nothing BUT truth being spoken here. I NEVER in my life seen Nate Robinson lay the ball up on the BOTTOM of the rim. In this game it's a guarantee at least twice a game. And I've been watching the Knicks this season closely, my squad, and I can't even recall when anyone has blocked his shot on a jumper. It's just the "stats" say "Hey Nate is open and about to get a shot off and the XYZ's haven't had there share of blocks yet. Do something about that Mr. Animation". And here's Mr. Animation "WTF?!?! Why didn't you tell me a lower team is about to win. I got you. This may , hell , this WILL look ugly but I'll hook something up. I got your back Stat". Then comes the digital equivalent of a barb-wired condom sprinkle with vinegar and salt. Right before you about to "get it" you can hear the faint voice of 2K whispering in your ear, "I can take the stink if you can take the pain"

# 203 luv_mist @ 04/13/09 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HMcCoy


	TO, would you be willing to bet 1000 bucks that you didn't try to tap the shoot button for a quicker shot knowing you were down to the last seconds...which culmintated in a pump fake? If there were a cosmic DVR that could rewind and show your fingers, i'd be willing to take that bet that you did, bro. Do you often see jumpers hitch like that? Luv mist brings up another good point though...shooters with slow releases are at a unrealistic disadvantage in this game. I can't get a 'perfect' release jumper off with Gordon without getting blocked to save my life...

I strictly use the shot stick since it's been implemented in 2K6 (I think that's when it was introduced) and I know I've seen that freaking hitch hundreds of times myself. There are just some of those problems in the game that need to be ironed out more. That and those slow drives to the hole after I give a pump fake to get the defense in the air.

On the real, with Ben Gordon, you can create space and play with him slightly like he's a small Michael Jordan with the fades. Best time to hit with him is when there's a break and the defense is trying to recover. Launch a couple from his hot spots and that fool will be on fire all game.

# 204 ProfessaPackMan @ 04/13/09 09:43 PM

So why keep committing the same "user error"?

# 205 spankdatazz22 @ 04/13/09 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfessaPackMan


	So why keep committing the same "user error"?

His friends are making him play. 5+ times a day sometimes

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...surprised.html

# 206 Pared @ 04/14/09 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spankdatazz22


	His friends are making him play. 5+ times a day sometimes http://www.operationsports.com/forum...surprised.html

As funny as this is, and as ridiculous as he is coming off (you mean Apex posts on OS now too?), Lebron should not have been able to do what he did.

Unfortunately you have to wade through the ridiculous comments in the forum at times to find the true meaning of things. But I guess it's cool to be dramatic now.

# 207 spankdatazz22 @ 04/14/09 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pared


	Unfortunately you have to wade through the ridiculous comments in the forum at times to find the true meaning of things. But I guess it's cool to be dramatic now.

Yeah, it is unfortunate. Because some people's over-the-top-soap-opera-level drama has made the forum almost unreadable at times. It's really only a handful of people, but there's this level of hate - where some refuse to give 2K any credit whatsoever for getting anything right. I really don't get it; especially when there's plenty of other choices. And factoring in that imo this has easily been the most consistently performing next gen sports game (considering it was also a launch 360 game). As I've said before, I think the only way some would be able to appreciate it is if the game were taken away - which I guess could still happen, if these new Take Two takeover rumors are true

# 208 Benicio10 @ 04/15/09 03:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spankdatazz22


	Yeah, it is unfortunate. Because some people's over-the-top-soap-opera-level drama has made the forum almost unreadable at times. It's really only a handful of people, but there's this level of hate - where some refuse to give 2K any credit whatsoever for getting anything right. I really don't get it; especially when there's plenty of other choices. And factoring in that imo this has easily been the most consistently performing next gen sports game (considering it was also a launch 360 game). As I've said before, I think the only way some would be able to appreciate it is if the game were taken away - which I guess could still happen, if these new Take Two takeover rumors are true

my biggest gripe with 2K is developer communication. Let's face it, NBA 2K is much farther along than the Madden franchise is, but the Madden community is invigorated because of the level of communication the devs have established, and the message they have sent across that their goal is to create a SIM.

We don't know what kind of game 2K wants to be, but there is more evidence to support they value arcade gameplay than sim. If that's the case, it's OK. We'll just walk away and not shed a tear like TO says.

It doesn't cost money to socially network online. The lines of communication need to be open. It's becoming an industry standard.

# 209 spankdatazz22 @ 04/15/09 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by totalownership


	People crying about me complaining. Priceless. People defending this game like it's their domestic partner. I wonder which state is going to be the first to allow a man to marry a disc. This game has lost it's way and if they stopped making it tomorrow I wouldn't shed a tear.

And you shouldn't catch feelings for your hypocrisy being pointed out. If you hate the game, fine. I brought Madden last year, played it for maybe a month, posted my displeasure and moved on. And that's the only football choice there is; nothing else to really move on to. We're six months past 2K9's release and some still feel the need to post about their disappointment rather than moving on? With more choices for other NBA games than any other sport? Must be something there.

# 210 spankdatazz22 @ 04/15/09 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benicio10


	my biggest gripe with 2K is developer communication. Let's face it, NBA 2K is much farther along than the Madden franchise is, but the Madden community is invigorated because of the level of communication the devs have established, and the message they have sent across that their goal is to create a SIM. We don't know what kind of game 2K wants to be, but there is more evidence to support they value arcade gameplay than sim. If that's the case, it's OK. We'll just walk away and not shed a tear like TO says. It doesn't cost money to socially network online. The lines of communication need to be open. It's becoming an industry standard.

Okay, this is a pet peeve so I may get long-winded. What choice did the Madden devs really have? It's debateable that Madden's popularity either plataued or declined somewhat the past few years. It's not the NFL; it's continued to grow in popularity. For years they were able to announce record sales year after year; the only reason they haven't been able to the past 3 years or so is because of the quality of the game itself.

As far as the devs communicating that the game will be SIM this year, what news have they actually conveyed that confirms that to be the case? I've seen the community getting excited about:

- the game having refs on the field (every other sport has their referee equivalent on the field/court. )
- procedural awareness (which I think is a fancy name for head-tracking. again, done in games already to date)
- improvements to pursuit angles; improvements to QB play, WR/DB interaction, pocket protection (things expected year in and year out. the game unfortunately still performs behind much older games)
- additional customization options and ratings

There are others; those are off the top of my head. The expectations are totally different. I fully expect Madden 10 to be better. It's supposed to be better. My expectation isn't that it finally beats out NFL2K5; that should've happened with Madden '06 frankly. Anymore than MVP '05 should still be able to be compared to MLB2K9. I have my own expectations of what Madden should be at this point. A lot of people have lowered their expectations of Madden to the point where any positive news is going to be made to be bigger than it is. Again, I'm sure Madden will take more of a SIM approach - but why is that a surprise? That should be expected imo. I'm sure info will be coming detailing the intracacies of cover 2, or OL protection schemes (okay, maybe), etc. But to date there's been no firm information regarding actual gameplay details. So people are excited about the talk of a more SIM approach.

I think I said earlier - NBA2K has been the most consistently performing next gen sports game to date imo. It was the one launch 360 sports game that was a quality title. And has improved significantly with each iteration. But this underscores the fickle nature of the forums. Madden - which has improved but disappointed for years - is now being treated as the standard all other games must follow. 2K's next gen performance hasn't even earned them the benefit of the doubt for a year (personally I think most people enjoy 2K9, despite the complaining of some here). Even NCAA, which has it's own huge following, has some of it's hardcore gamers griping. And they have a certain level of dev involvement. I commend the Madden team for what they've accomplished in turning around the game's perception - Madden '09 became a distant memory back in late Dec./early January when the dev involvement started. It's obvious that some level of developer involvement is expected to some degree now, even if a lot of it comes off as creative marketing.

But in terms of substance - people are getting themselves excited because it's something they want to do. Again, I believe the game will improve - perhaps significantly. But imo a lot of the excitement is because expectations were so low to begin with. No one would be surprised if Madden doesn't have some semblance of individual player signature style, although that's expected in pretty much every other sports game. People would be ecstatic if the game's fundamentals were solid. Much improved OL/DL play, for example. That's different than the standard 2K is held to. As I've said for years, the games are held to totally different standards by the community, yet judged on the same level. As far as community perception, the Madden community actually blames David Ortiz for Madden's problems, totally ignoring that every EA next gen sports game started out slowly. No one's citing the team being unprepared for next gen - was it Ortiz's decision they developed a completely different game engine with a short development window? However, the community conveniently blames him for all of Madden's ills. While I think it's likely a necessity for dev interaction to occur on some level at some point, I also can see the fickle whichever way the wind blows nature of the community.

Apologize for the long winded post

# 211 DC @ 04/15/09 08:53 AM

spankdatazz22; I understand your points but at what point do you just let us voice our disappointment in the game that we WANT to love? We don't HATE the game. Some of us have already said that it is the best basketball game made. But we are still disappointed in it because it isn't as good as we THOUGHT it WOULD BE.

Telling us how much we are ungrateful and never satisfied is cool after the first time, but why must you constantly go that route?

If we want to offer constructive criticism of the game, then let us do that. We shouldn't have to worry about getting our heads cut off because people are attacking us for having an opinion.

We ALL want the game to be perfect. While it won't happen it doesn't hurt trying does it?

So just relax man. We are all on the same page here.

# 212 DC @ 04/15/09 09:15 AM

Not sure what they will listen to but my point is people that "complain" about the game are doing nothing but offering ways to make it better. For any one of you to basically tell them to "STOP COMPLAINING" (what you are essentially doing) leads me to believe that you don't believe the series needs to improve.

But I KNOW we all KNOW the series needs to improve, so my question is why get on the people that are "complaining" instead of getting on 2K for causing them to complain.

That is all I am saying.

Again we ALL want a perfect basketball game. Trying to HUSH folks when they are offering ways for the game to improve won't help us reach that goal.

We need more unity around here is what I am saying. I would NEVER tell another 2K fan to stop complaining about ANYTHING. Because nobody is going to suggest things to HURT the series

# 213 Pared @ 04/15/09 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican


	spankdatazz22; I understand your points but at what point do you just let us voice our disappointment in the game that we WANT to love? We don't HATE the game. Some of us have already said that it is the best basketball game made. But we are still disappointed in it because it isn't as good as we THOUGHT it WOULD BE. Telling us how much we are ungrateful and never satisfied is cool after the first time, but why must you constantly go that route? If we want to offer constructive criticism of the game, then let us do that. We shouldn't have to worry about getting our heads cut off because people are attacking us for having an opinion. We ALL want the game to be perfect. While it won't happen it doesn't hurt trying does it? So just relax man. We are all on the same page here.

The problem is the unrealistic expectations out of some. It's apparently cool to be dramatic now on this board. Who is the biggest drama queen in the forums? Seems like it's always a contest people keep trying to win.

Spank put it best, people talk about how they hate the game then catch feelings when others call them out on their hypocrisy. Cam, where you at? Ask 'em why they mad!

Never played orkl2002 until last night for the first time. Had a great game, nothing out of the ordinary, as Lebron killed me and Vince got his points. We didn't have any buzzer beaters and there wasn't anything bad. It was just great basketball.

The game has a few issues that need addressing. But you're here 6 months after release claiming you hate the game? You have issues.

# 214 DC @ 04/15/09 09:29 AM

Well if that is directed to ME, I NEVER said I hate the game. I like the game. Just expected more. Imagine drafting LeBron James and he never amounted to anything more than Caron Butler. That is the type of disappointed I have for this game.

STILL a very good game, but never reached the promised expected

# 215 Pared @ 04/15/09 09:31 AM

You calling this game Kwame? Wow...

# 216 DC @ 04/15/09 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican


	Well if that is directed to ME, I NEVER said I hate the game. I like the game. Just expected more. Imagine drafting LeBron James and he never amounted to anything more than Caron Butler. That is the type of disappointed I have for this game. STILL a very good game, but never reached the promised expected

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pared


	You calling this game Kwame? Wow...

Too early to be gettin high man

# 217 Pared @ 04/15/09 09:38 AM

Don't lie... you know you don't feel that way about Caron.

Kwame, Oden, Miles, Daugherty... Take your pick.

# 218 DC @ 04/15/09 09:48 AM

When healthy Caron is a top 3 SF in the league man. I wouldn't go that far and call 2K Kwame or Kandi man

# 219 Hassan Darkside @ 04/15/09 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican


	LOL No you have it backwards. I actually complained when the game challenged shots (jumped) for me when I was using lock on Defense.

That's what I thought. Everyone complained last year because when you were locked on, your player would automatically challenge shots and thus, they'd jump on pump fakes even when you didn't press any button at all. They'd also reach in without you commanding them too and pick up frustrating fouls.

# 220 spankdatazz22 @ 04/15/09 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCAllAmerican


	Not sure what they will listen to but my point is people that "complain" about the game are doing nothing but offering ways to make it better. For any one of you to basically tell them to "STOP COMPLAINING" (what you are essentially doing) leads me to believe that you don't believe the series needs to improve.

I don't think there's anyone that thinks the game doesn't need to improve. Pretty much every game is going to have room for improvement, be it Halo, GTA 4, COD, Madden, etc. Games will never achieve some state of perfection. My initial comment wasn't necessarily directed at you. But you do create a lot of threads and comment a lot, and most of it could be intepreted as negative because of the tone. I think you've said at least once that you feel no one at 2K knows anything about basketball, and many times you seem to think they're purposely doing things to [arcade the game up] - when it could've simply been something that was overlooked. It seems your first reaction to something is they're purposely doing [x] to the detriment of [hardcore players] on purpose; rarely that it was simply overlooked or something they didn't account for.

As I said, my initial comment wasn't directed at you. I think you're a perfectionist, and you're bothered when things aren't exact. I'm definitely not trying to "shut anyone up". But I'd think there would be some balance relative to the overall quality of the game. The game certainly has flaws, but there isn't a game that doesn't. And with the comparison of something in 2K9 almost always being compared to what would occur in real life, it's never going to measure up. What other game has these sky-high expectations to measure up to? While I want the game to improve as much as anyone, I also appreciate it for what it is and for the things they did well. My comment was more to the people that say the game is crap, it sucks, it's unplayable, that they could care less about it - but yet they still play, and still feel the need to repeatedly let people know how they feel

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