2023 Offseason Thread

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Horford is 37 and entering his 17th season. It’s not a wild thought to say KP can be better than him. Low bar but still, lol

Smart should fit in nicely with the Grizz Culture on and especially off the court. One area they were definitely lacking in there was the leadership side, while Ja was out here bugging out.

Tyus to the Wizards should be a good fit on team not expected to do well record wise next season. Probably will be able to judge that one more fully once we see what their roster is starting to resemble.

[jeebs9]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Absolutely yes. White, to me, offers the good Smart things without the bad Smart things and knows his place much better than Smart did.

Porzingis was excellent protecting the rim last season and obviously offers far more offense than any of the Celtics current bigs.

And to get multiple first round picks on top of it? It’s an incredible trade for the Celtics.


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The only place this trade works is Memphis. They finally officially replaced Dillon Brooks [emoji23].

I'm not even going to address the bad things comment [emoji1787]

I still don't believe in KP.

[areobee401]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Well, let’s make one thing perfectly clear. Marcus will be missed. Gave it everything he had, played banged up, embraced playing in a sports centric market like Boston, and was the leader Tatum and Brown never embraced or shown the ability to be.

That said, it was time. Something with the Celtics core needed to change. And unfortunately for him, the least talented of the three is usually the one to go. Great role player, heart and soul of the team, but talent wins the NBA.

As for the addition of Kristaps Porzingis…ehh. We will see. Not a fan. Just have to hope to be proven wrong. Off-season is still young. Really, it’s all gonna come down to Tatum and Brown stepping up when the lights are at their brightest, and the team as a whole stops playing like complete *******s. Three head coaches, a number of different complimentary players surrounding them, but the story remains the same. Time and time again, the dumbest basketball team around. Won’t matter who’s on the roster unless the same old mistakes are cleaned up and corrected.


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[jeebs9]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Horford is 37 and entering his 17th season. It’s not a wild thought to say KP can be better than him. Low bar but still, lol

Smart should fit in nicely with the Grizz Culture on and especially off the court. One area they were definitely lacking in there was the leadership side, while Ja was out here bugging out.

Tyus to the Wizards should be a good fit on team not expected to do well record wise next season. Probably will be able to judge that one more fully once we see what their roster is starting to resemble.

Agree, Horford is old period.

Well, let’s make one thing perfectly clear. Marcus will be missed. Gave it everything he had, played banged up, embraced playing in a sports centric market like Boston, and was the leader Tatum and Brown never embraced or shown the ability to be.

That said, it was time. Something with the Celtics core needed to change. And unfortunately for him, the least talented of the three is usually the one to go. Great role player, heart and soul of the team, but talent wins the NBA.

As for the addition of Kristaps Porzingis…ehh. We will see. Not a fan. Just have to hope to be proven wrong. Off-season is still young. Really, it’s all gonna come down to Tatum and Brown stepping up when the lights are at their brightest, and the team as a whole stops playing like complete *******s. Three head coaches, a number of different complimentary players surrounding them, but the story remains the same. Time and time again, the dumbest basketball team around. Won’t matter who’s on the roster unless the same old mistakes are cleaned up and corrected.


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This is the part of agree with. Some change was needed regardless of what happen. They been short the last few seasons. Someone had to go. The only reason I'm ok is the picks. Like I said in the draft thread. You can really add a experienced late seasoned player in the later part of the draft.

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Jeebs overrates the hell outta Marcus Smart man [emoji23].

[georgiafan]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Doesn't Boston need someone that can drive to the basket and not another jump shooter? So after trying to trade Brogdon a few hours later they shift and are keeping him and trading away Smart?

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Jeebs overrates the hell outta Marcus Smart man [emoji23].

Oh depending on the player, you ain’t that much different either sir lol

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Oh depending on the player, you ain’t that much different either sir lol

Who? Khris Middleton? Lol

[BleacherBum2310]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Y’all know my thoughts on Smart, he’s a really good version of the player he is but having him being treated like he’s untouchable for the past few years has made him one of the, if not the, most overrated players in the league. Two first for him seems like a good haul even without Porzingis. Porzingis and two firsts for Smart is a much better trade than Brogdon for Porzingis straight up IMO.

What those picks actually mean for Boston who knows, but they can still be traded this off-season. So they have more assets than they had before this move unless somebody thought Smart could return a star.. Only thing “bad” about this trade would be the whole leadership, loyalty, blah blah aspect.. but it’s been my opinion that Marcus Smart hasn’t needed to have a primary leadership role on this team for some time now, and that “role” had him constantly trying to do way too much on the floor. Again, just my opinion.

I do still think Boston still needs a true point guard. Even if it’s not somebody you don’t expect to play 30+ minutes every night.

Tyus has been great for the Grizz, one of the most consistent guys in the league. If he really wanted a bigger role I guess they could have done worse than Smart. At the very least Smart can be Dillon Brooks for them but a better player overall. Will be a weird dynamic for him going from sorta that leader role to now playing with a bunch of young guys on a team that is clearly Ja’s team. Grizz are a happy go lucky group. Other than Adams they don’t really have guys on the team that feel like they take the game as serious as Smart does. Idk if that’s a good thing, or something that is just going to clash. Does Smart even want to be in Memphis? Wonder if he tries to force himself out.

Tyus might be that good middle ground pickup for Washington where maybe they won’t completely suck, adds a good vet to help steady their offense as they build with young guys. If Tyus wants a bigger role and is headed to Washington what does that mean for Chris Paul? And if LAC was concerned with Brogdon’s injury history again what does that say about their interest in Chris Paul? Weird dynamic going on there. Worst case scenario Jones is a trade chip for Washington. Teams really needing a PG should be willing to send decent assets for him. One of the few players in the league who can be a starting caliber PG and not give a damn about taking touches or scoring attempts from others. Scores when he needs to, runs the offense as well as anybody.

I was never opposed to moving him but this doesn't feel like it. Smart has rised to the occasion in the playoffs consistently. I never once bought that the Celtics needed a PG takes. It's extremely lazy, because if the Co-star could dribble and make decisions at all it's a non issue but now they have no passing at all so yeah they do kind of need one. the 2 1sts in theory sounds great but it's 25 this year and a 18-24 pick next year. I'll wait to see other moves but I dunno how they are going to get better here. I do think some are better over dramatic on smart but that's fandom. he's been a fan favorite for years here. I thought a shakeup could be coming and could be good but didn't think Brad would actually pull the trigger. i don't think this was the move. He Traded the wrong guy lol.

the fact that Brogdon might be cooked as well is not great either.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Brogdon being cooked shouldn’t surprise anyone considering how injury prone he’s been for the last few years now.

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

I was never opposed to moving him but this doesn't feel like it. Smart has rised to the occasion in the playoffs consistently. I never once bought that the Celtics needed a PG takes. It's extremely lazy, because if the Co-star could dribble and make decisions at all it's a non issue but now they have no passing at all so yeah they do kind of need one. the 2 1sts in theory sounds great but it's 25 this year and a 18-24 pick next year. I'll wait to see other moves but I dunno how they are going to get better here. I do think some are better over dramatic on smart but that's fandom. he's been a fan favorite for years here. I thought a shakeup could be coming and could be good but didn't think Brad would actually pull the trigger. i don't think this was the move. He Traded the wrong guy lol.

the fact that Brogdon might be cooked as well is not great either.

The bolded part was never my issue with Smart though. He has the skillset to be that guy, lacking the ability to be a ball-handler and passer wasn't an issue. It was him constantly overextending that role in order to try things he shouldn't be trying. I don't think Boston actually NEEDED a "point guard", it was only a point guard because that is what Smart was playing as. It could have simply been putting the ball in Tatum's hands as a play-maker more often (they did a decent job at that in the playoffs in 2022 at times), utilizing Horford more in that type of half-court playmaking, or just making a trade that shifted them to having a guy better suited than either of them regardless of position.. Sabonis for example, a Draymond type.

To me Smart has a very Draymond-like role for Boston. Where they need his strengths, his leadership, all that.. But the difference is Draymond makes sure 99% of what he provides offensively is how to get Steph and Klay EASY looks, how to make sure everyone else gets the highest percentage shots in the league, lay-ups/dunks.. Especially in key moments of big games. Far too often I had to watch Marcus Smart go try to be the hero when his ability couldn't back that up. Putting his head down and trying to get to the rim while Tatum is on a heater.. It was just annoying to me.

Had I been a Boston fan I'm sure there would be a much larger sentimental connection there. As an outsider looking in he often just left me wanting to pull my hair out. There is nothing else really "wrong" with his game, he's probably the most ideal role player you could ask for.. But to pull a Jeebs and put it in 2K terms he was a 78 thinking he was a 90.

As far as the rest of this goes, I don't think the trade is a homerun in the sense of what Boston needs to fix, or them actually using the picks. I think we need to see another move for them. But just on paper, two first rounders and Porzingis, like Jazzman said, feels like robbery. As an armchair GM I would never have traded two first for Smart, I don't even know if he has the same value on another team. It was rumored Memphis was having trouble trading those firsts last year because of how young they are so maybe this is the best they could get.. Would have preferred any of the Toronto guys for their needs though.

Time will tell with Boston. I think it terms of leadership, the culture, etc this is the type of trade that could (worst case scenario) cripple them... But IMO I think they needed to get away from Smart being their "leader" 2-3 years ago. Because I feel like he needed to take it back a notch for awhile now. Maybe that's not on him, maybe it's on Tatum, Brown, the coaching staff, idk. But I think if this pushes Tatum to be more of that undisputed leader on this team that ultimately gives them a MUCH higher ceiling than what they had where Smart was acting like this was his team just as much as Tatum's team.

TL'DR - I never truly felt like Boston was going to win it all until Smart took it back a notch, or was moved. This move might not be a homerun if they don't have some other moves this off-season to go with it, but I do feel much more confident in what Boston could potentially be if everything goes right.

[Master Live 013]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

KP ain't all that (), but this is for the better. Smart is what he is, bless his soul and he wasn't going to change, so I have been waiting for this move for some time now.

[jeebs9]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

I was never opposed to moving him but this doesn't feel like it. Smart has rised to the occasion in the playoffs consistently. I never once bought that the Celtics needed a PG takes. It's extremely lazy, because if the Co-star could dribble and make decisions at all it's a non issue but now they have no passing at all so yeah they do kind of need one. the 2 1sts in theory sounds great but it's 25 this year and a 18-24 pick next year. I'll wait to see other moves but I dunno how they are going to get better here. I do think some are better over dramatic on smart but that's fandom. he's been a fan favorite for years here. I thought a shakeup could be coming and could be good but didn't think Brad would actually pull the trigger. i don't think this was the move. He Traded the wrong guy lol.



the fact that Brogdon might be cooked as well is not great either.

Boom you knocked it out of the park. You said this in your other post. Smart is literally their identity. Especially with the news of Malcolm Brogden being really hurt. Put Brad in a corner. Now thru free agency or the draft they have to replace Smart hit only they're best defender but point guard on the team. Unless they think Pritchard is ready for a bigger part of the pie.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Who? Khris Middleton? Lol

Lol He’s one of them.

FWIW, we’re all do the same thing. And more times than not, we do it for that confirmation bias.

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2023 Offseason Thread

Feel like moving Smart out and creating more minutes for Derrick White alone is an upgrade

Absolutely yes. White, to me, offers the good Smart things without the bad Smart things and knows his place much better than Smart did.

Time will tell with Porzingis. I feel like they have a weird logjam at "bigs" now and are down a backcourt player, 2 if Brogdon can't go. But it's not a bad problem to have yet IMO.

But 100% agree with you on White. Smart has history with the team, but White to me was easily the better player last season, though to be fair Smart missed some time with injuries.. He was all team defense this year and does almost everything better offensively. Read into the advanced stuff what you will be he had the best on/off splits on the team last year and was their 2nd best player (10th best in the league) in 538's WAR stat too.

Smart is a more switchable defender, and does all the little things like hustle, charges, etc.. He can also at times take himself out of plays and give up free shots too trying to draw charges that aren't there, and with Tatum+Brown Boston really shouldn't need their 6'3 dudes guarding 6'8 forwards anyways.

Every team needs a guy like Marcus Smart on their team, no team looking to win it all needs that player as their 2nd option though. White getting 28 minutes a game last year at that impact seems dumb in hindsight, if this pushes him to 32+ or something that's a win. He fits much better off ball, but I feel like they still need Tatum to take a step forward as a play-maker if White is the only "guard" in the rotation.

Smart is literally their identity.

This was my issue.