Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on release

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  • alabamarob
    MVP
    • Nov 2010
    • 3340

    #226
    Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

    Originally posted by rudyjuly2
    Posted this in main impressions. Definitely seeing different things. The Over defence and sagging in particular.

    I’m seeing more “over” PNR coverage now. Before it was 99% under. And I swear they are really sagging off bad shooters now. Josh Jackson is a 30% deep threat and they ran away from covering him!


    Uh oh. They are sagging way too often and in decent shooters like Jerami Grant. Wth?


    Good help on PNR and x-out.
    https://twitter.com/rudyjuly2/status...939075076?s=21
    The thing I notice is that the off ball gap is better then the on ball gap. It should be the other way around. We should be able to give poor shooters all that space off ball. But I like the direction they are going.
    Psn: Alabamarob
    Xbox: Alabama Rob

    Youtube: 2k Hawks

    Settings I play on.
    Minutes: 12
    Difficulty: HOF
    Online or Offline player: Both
    In a MLO: Yes

    Comment

    • rudyjuly2
      Cade Cunningham
      • Aug 2002
      • 14815

      #227
      Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

      I do think PNR can be too easy, particularly the roll man right now. If they go over more it creates new issues.

      Comment

      • ataman5
        MVP
        • Jun 2007
        • 2620

        #228
        Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

        Every other year, you see good and then... It gets boring and i got really old guys for fighting the good fight and all that mambo jambo.

        I'm from current gen and day1 to until some ingame roster update. I've seen great help rotations, i've seen help the helper from weak side playing 1 to 2s. I've seen box and 1 kinda help positioning to defend paint vs pick n roll even just last week there was, i've seen switches and then switching back to right guy in order to fix mismatches happened and all that good stuff i've seen it all, i've had videos related to explain in my MLO to friends.

        Well nevermind me and my post...
        Last edited by ataman5; 10-05-2021, 06:01 AM.

        Comment

        • namanbaniya34
          Rookie
          • Oct 2021
          • 7

          #229
          Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

          there was plenty of room to improve such as pre rotating a big off of a non shooting big, choosing where you want the help to come from, whom you want to run off the 3 point line off the rotation

          Comment

          • Mikelopedia
            The Real Birdman
            • Jan 2008
            • 1523

            #230
            Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

            Until Eccentric, Dirk and a couple other guys chimed in I was gonna add that I was testing on default HOF and SS, with the default roster, on next gen.

            Was wondering if one of those 3 factors (or combo of the 3) was playing a part but I guess not.

            I still see situations where theres no help when there clearly should be, particularly in PnR, but I'm not sure what's happening for the guys who aren't seeing anything at all corrected.

            One thing I'm trying to figure out is what defensive settings aren't working besides Leave Him and Pre Rotate. There's definitely more. For example, I set everyone to off ball gap so as to at least try to resemble an NBA defense, but then on shooters on ball will be tight to have them close out.
            I had Jalen Green on ball set to moderate, then changed to tight after he hit a couple. All the while however, the AI Devin Booker would stand there about 7 feet away from him while the ball was in Jalen's hand. He was the only one on the floor being played like this. There's definitely some hard coded stuff goin on.
            Die hard Heat and Dolphins fan since '89

            PSN: MiiikeMarsh

            Comment

            • michaelsan
              Rookie
              • Aug 2011
              • 297

              #231
              Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

              Now they restored the game where it was... responsive and players not in the mud anymore.... don't touch it anymore 2k.

              Inviato dal mio SM-M315F utilizzando Tapatalk

              Comment

              • alabamarob
                MVP
                • Nov 2010
                • 3340

                #232
                Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                Originally posted by Mikelopedia
                Until Eccentric, Dirk and a couple other guys chimed in I was gonna add that I was testing on default HOF and SS, with the default roster, on next gen.

                Was wondering if one of those 3 factors (or combo of the 3) was playing a part but I guess not.

                I still see situations where theres no help when there clearly should be, particularly in PnR, but I'm not sure what's happening for the guys who aren't seeing anything at all corrected.

                One thing I'm trying to figure out is what defensive settings aren't working besides Leave Him and Pre Rotate. There's definitely more. For example, I set everyone to off ball gap so as to at least try to resemble an NBA defense, but then on shooters on ball will be tight to have them close out.
                I had Jalen Green on ball set to moderate, then changed to tight after he hit a couple. All the while however, the AI Devin Booker would stand there about 7 feet away from him while the ball was in Jalen's hand. He was the only one on the floor being played like this. There's definitely some hard coded stuff goin on.
                Yea. I am seeing help defense and rotations all over the place. Now from time to time guys are able to get to the rim untouched, but that is realistic. It should happen sometimes. The help is not going to be timely everytime.
                Psn: Alabamarob
                Xbox: Alabama Rob

                Youtube: 2k Hawks

                Settings I play on.
                Minutes: 12
                Difficulty: HOF
                Online or Offline player: Both
                In a MLO: Yes

                Comment

                • DaWolf
                  Old school
                  • Feb 2007
                  • 628

                  #233
                  Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                  Why did they remove the double teams in the post again? I don't get it...

                  Comment

                  • The 24th Letter
                    ERA
                    • Oct 2007
                    • 39373

                    #234
                    Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                    Originally posted by alabamarob
                    Yea. I am seeing help defense and rotations all over the place. Now from time to time guys are able to get to the rim untouched, but that is realistic. It should happen sometimes. The help is not going to be timely everytime.
                    This is what i see as well..

                    Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

                    Comment

                    • vannwolfhawk
                      MVP
                      • Jun 2009
                      • 3412

                      #235
                      Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                      Originally posted by alabamarob
                      Yea. I am seeing help defense and rotations all over the place. Now from time to time guys are able to get to the rim untouched, but that is realistic. It should happen sometimes. The help is not going to be timely everytime.
                      For sure! I don’t want anything perfect every time. I didn’t see help once though. Not 1x last night. I honestly think I didn’t get an update because I can see your videos in here and Rudy’s post of sagging off. But my game doesn’t have that either. Nor did it have the small ball. I know 24 is on Xbox next gen as am I. Is everyone else as well?
                      Basketball Playbooks
                      http://www.nextplayhoops.com

                      Comment

                      • vannwolfhawk
                        MVP
                        • Jun 2009
                        • 3412

                        #236
                        Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                        Originally posted by rudyjuly2
                        Posted this in main impressions. Definitely seeing different things. The Over defence and sagging in particular.

                        I’m seeing more “over” PNR coverage now. Before it was 99% under. And I swear they are really sagging off bad shooters now. Josh Jackson is a 30% deep threat and they ran away from covering him!


                        Uh oh. They are sagging way too often and in decent shooters like Jerami Grant. Wth?


                        Good help on PNR and x-out.
                        https://twitter.com/rudyjuly2/status...939075076?s=21
                        That’s good they are going over now. That’s what most teams run in today’s game with over drop coverage.

                        Is the cpu adjusting as game goes on on shooter? Playing tight as game goes on or player gets hot? I like to see the sag.

                        That’s a nice X out but it’s user and I’d like to see if tag man X’s out to switch on the X. Love to see that with cpu. Although I actually did see that 2x last night after a double on the perimeter PNR and it looked and felt great. I recorded it just no idea how to get it on here?
                        Last edited by vannwolfhawk; 10-05-2021, 12:40 PM.
                        Basketball Playbooks
                        http://www.nextplayhoops.com

                        Comment

                        • vannwolfhawk
                          MVP
                          • Jun 2009
                          • 3412

                          #237
                          Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                          It just happened for me. I’m now getting help.

                          So, I got on and was playing a few games and still nothing just like last night. I then got into a new game and everything was slower. I thought my sliders were messed up so I reloaded them. Same thing game was slow, players were slower. So I knew I got an update as I was just playing a few games earlier and it was night and day.

                          So I started testing PNR and sure enough I’m getting all of the help defense and rotations now. There was no update or anything. I literally started a new game after playing a few. I also saw sagging off Rudy Gobert. Also seeing the small ball on big/little mismatches now.

                          On a negative note on the 2 side/strong side of the pnr it’s weird rotations as I’m seeing the top wing help and the bottom lift leaving the corner 3 wide open on the drive and kick to cover 2. Not sure why it’s not the weakside coming to help there? That’s with me running Fist 15 Spread down to the 2 side. That’s a problem and not where the help should come from at all.

                          Edit #1 - it seems random. I just got proper weak side help from corner in same play 2x in a row in a different game, same play.

                          Edit #2 - New game same bad rotation 4x in a row leaving Ingles wide open for 4 straight wide open 3’s in the corner for 12 points. Lol I’m assuming this is an ACE thing and after timeout it will change? Will report back. Same play By the way…

                          Anyways, good news for me as I finally got what others had already received. Weird that mine didn’t get updated when everyone else’s did. But it seems others had the same as well… So, if you were like me go check it now and see if you got something…
                          Last edited by vannwolfhawk; 10-05-2021, 02:31 PM.
                          Basketball Playbooks
                          http://www.nextplayhoops.com

                          Comment

                          • ataman5
                            MVP
                            • Jun 2007
                            • 2620

                            #238
                            Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                            Originally posted by vannwolfhawk
                            It just happened for me. I’m now getting help.

                            So, I got on and was playing a few games and still nothing just like last night. I then got into a new game and everything was slower. I thought my sliders were messed up so I reloaded them. Same thing game was slow, players were slower. So I knew I got an update as I was just playing a few games earlier and it was night and day.

                            So I started testing PNR and sure enough I’m getting all of the help defense and rotations now. There was no update or anything. I literally started a new game after playing a few. I also saw sagging off Rudy Gobert. Also seeing the small ball on big/little mismatches now.

                            On a negative note on the 2 side/strong side of the pnr it’s weird rotations as I’m seeing the top wing help and the bottom lift leaving the corner 3 wide open on the drive and kick to cover 2. Not sure why it’s not the weakside coming to help there? That’s with me running Fist 15 Spread down to the 2 side. That’s a problem and not where the help should come from at all.

                            Edit #1 - it seems random. I just got proper weak side help from corner in same play 2x in a row in a different game, same play.

                            Edit #2 - New game same bad rotation 4x in a row leaving Ingles wide open for 4 straight wide open 3’s in the corner for 12 points. Lol I’m assuming this is an ACE thing and after timeout it will change? Will report back. Same play By the way…

                            Anyways, good news for me as I finally got what others had already received. Weird that mine didn’t get updated when everyone else’s did. But it seems others had the same as well… So, if you were like me go check it now and see if you got something…
                            Same i started seeing ,too coming from current gen but today we got a new patch so i don't know if it did addect or not.

                            And yes same on those examples,too. I find odd helps coming from very wrong players and mostly leaving corner 3 for a wide open shot.

                            Comment

                            • vannwolfhawk
                              MVP
                              • Jun 2009
                              • 3412

                              #239
                              Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                              Originally posted by ataman5
                              Same i started seeing ,too coming from current gen but today we got a new patch so i don't know if it did addect or not.

                              And yes same on those examples,too. I find odd helps coming from very wrong players and mostly leaving corner 3 for a wide open shot.
                              Ya it seems random. What I did was tested 5 games of 12 minute 1st quarters. I was jazz and had 35-40 points each quarter I played.

                              Id restart each time and have different coverages each time. So I believe it’s ACE. ACE was adjusting coverages after every timeout so I was seeing different things but it was way too easy to score. But that’s with no slider changes to help cpu AI and defensive coverages so I’m sure I can dial it back in.

                              But the 2 side help on the strong side should never happen. But if it was to happen then it should be reversed. The bottom guy helps them the wing drops to play 2. Not the other way around. Then on the corner pass the wing defender playing 2 should play the 1st pass and the corner help defender should X out. So as of now it’s programmed wrong and is leaving wide open shots. Like I said I was getting 40 points per quarter just running PNR and hitting the open man.
                              Basketball Playbooks
                              http://www.nextplayhoops.com

                              Comment

                              • ataman5
                                MVP
                                • Jun 2007
                                • 2620

                                #240
                                Re: Please turn the help defense, and cutter help defense back to were it was on rele

                                Originally posted by vannwolfhawk
                                Ya it seems random. What I did was tested 5 games of 12 minute 1st quarters. I was jazz and had 35-40 points each quarter I played.

                                Id restart each time and have different coverages each time. So I believe it’s ACE. ACE was adjusting coverages after every timeout so I was seeing different things but it was way too easy to score. But that’s with no slider changes to help cpu AI and defensive coverages so I’m sure I can dial it back in.

                                But the 2 side help on the strong side should never happen. But if it was to happen then it should be reversed. The bottom guy helps them the wing drops to play 2. Not the other way around. Then on the corner pass the wing defender playing 2 should play the 1st pass and the corner help defender should X out. So as of now it’s programmed wrong and is leaving wide open shots. Like I said I was getting 40 points per quarter just running PNR and hitting the open man.
                                Exactly, and add the new coverage and contest system which makes things easier to shoot you can get 65% FG and higher on HOF easily. The same applies to user vs user,too.

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