LXXVII Spawn III: Game Over (See Post 4507)

[LoneStarGirl]

I dont need a bed tonight, i am neither exhausted or wounded, so i will give it up to other people who need it..

I am now going to watch Office SEason 2

[claphamsa]

just wanna pint out... heinze was in the hold...a nd its worse now!

just saying!

[saldana]

more importantly than the fact that i do not think it was a good idea, no lynch means that we still have 21 people posting tomorrow...i dont know how much longer i can keep up with this pace.

[PackerFanatic]

I am sleeping tonight, and I hope I get a damn bed, heh. I need all my energy to actually be productive tomorrow!

[Danny]

The hold took more damage, perhaps now all four of us engineers should go there?

[oliegirl]

I am off to bed...in ww and rl :) Back tomorrow morning @ 8 am (ugh)

[Alan T]

The hold took more damage, perhaps now all four of us engineers should go there?

I agree! :)

Looks like we need Tyrith and Purduebrad to help in the cargo hold too. Probably should have all of our engineers help there tonight...

[hoopsguy]

OK, so why would the hold have taken more damage? Lets discuss this since there are 12 of us in the thread right now.

[jeheinz72]

just wanna pint out... heinze was in the hold...a nd its worse now!

just saying!

DUDE

Give up your hard-on for me, I'm not putting out.

If you bothered to fact-check your baseless accusations you'd find that I spent my day with Tyrith finishing up work on the pens, so we could get those slaves back under control.

It is only now, at the inception of night, that I head to the cargo hold to begin work there.

Dealing with these incessant false allegations you routinely make is extremely annoying. At least *try* and check a fact before slinging more mud, k?

Besides that fact, can spawn even cause damage during the day? It seemed to me that BK was pretty clear that it was the final bits of the riot that did this, not any spawn.

[PackerFanatic]

I will be back in the morning...here's hoping I don't die tonight.

[jeheinz72]

OK, so why would the hold have taken more damage? Lets discuss this since there are 12 of us in the thread right now.

My guess is the tail end of the riot, but I don't know, can spawn convert/damage places during the day even?

Or are we thinking that one of PB and Danny faked work?

[saldana]

OK, so why would the hold have taken more damage? Lets discuss this since there are 12 of us in the thread right now.

had to be the slaves before we got them all back...there is no mechanic i know of to do damage during the day, only fake repairs

[hoopsguy]

but after the destruction of the slave riot, made only slightly worse today before they could be rounded back up

OK, I'm on board with what Heinz posted about the slaves. See, I'm willing to pay attention to some stuff in the moderator write-up.

[saldana]

My guess is the tail end of the riot, but I don't know, can spawn convert/damage places during the day even?

Or are we thinking that one of PB and Danny faked work?

if they faked work, it wouldnt cause more damage, only show that damage wasnt repaired.

[jeheinz72]

So the hold started with 3 units, should have been 1 unit if both worked on it and it had no additional damage. Now it's 4.

So either both worked and the 3 units was all slave damage or 1 worked, 1 faked and it was 2 plus any slave/(spawn?) damage incurred.

[jeheinz72]

if they faked work, it wouldnt cause more damage, only show that damage wasnt repaired.

I think we need to apply Occam's razor here, in that it was most likely just the slaves accounting for 3 more points.

At the very least, it seems risky to think one faked and then it was 2 pts of slave damage instead.

[Alan T]

So the hold started with 3 units, should have been 1 unit if both worked on it and it had no additional damage. Now it's 4.

So either both worked and the 3 units was all slave damage or 1 worked, 1 faked and it was 2 plus any slave/(spawn?) damage incurred.

The engines also took 1 extra damage and no one worked there. slave riot seems most likely scenerio

[hoopsguy]

Shift in damage:
Engine Room: +1
Water: even
Cargo: +1
Slave Pens: -3
Sleeping Quarters: even

So how does this match up with the actions taken by the engineers?

[hoopsguy]

I think we need to apply Occam's razor here, in that it was most likely just the slaves accounting for 3 more points.

At the very least, it seems risky to think one faked and then it was 2 pts of slave damage instead.

Barring the Spawn knowing that there would be more damage - perhaps via a PM to BK? - I agree that this makes the most sense.

[jeheinz72]

Though it is a nice gain for the Spawn in that we now need all engineers at the hold and can't get onto the engine which is inching perilously close to the dreaded 12 mark, which jumps to 24. 24 is going to be darn near unrepairable given that in one cycle we only have 6 repair units, counting clap, and the Tyrith bonus and no one faking

[Alan T]

Just so we are clear, all engineers need to work on the cargo hold tonight.. so there isn't any confusion

[path12]

Beds should be saved for any wounded who aren't needed elsewhere tonight, says the doctor. That would be Packer, Jackal and Chubby, I think.

[jeheinz72]

Shift in damage:
Engine Room: +1
Water: even
Cargo: +1
Slave Pens: -3
Sleeping Quarters: even

So how does this match up with the actions taken by the engineers?

Well the slave pens show that both Tyrith and I did what we said we did (aka didn't fake)

The engine room no one worked on, that must've been slave damage.

Cargo should've been -2, instead +1.

Not asking for confirmation here, but in addition to guarding the hold tonight, the engine needs guarding too. I believe spawn cause 1-4 units in an attack, I don't think we want to take the 50/50 shot that they cause enough damage to bust us as far as getting off this rock. Just wanted that to be at least said.

[jeheinz72]

Just so we are clear, all engineers need to work on the cargo hold tonight.. so there isn't any confusion

Agreed, mine and Danny's should be already in. PB said he's coming back after dinner and to my knowledge, Tyrith posted last night, so here's to hoping that will get set as well.

[hoopsguy]

Path, in terms of tomorrow obviously do what you think is best. It would be personally convenient to be cleared but if not I'll cool continuing to argue my points and defend myself in the thread.

I just found myself frustrated at times that you argued I needed to be scanned when you were the one who has twice had the power to do so and chose others. It is not an issue of who you chose, just that I felt the argument about me not being scanned was particularly empty coming from the guy who has that power.

Anyway, I don't want to bully you into a move that you are not comfortable executing. Or else I'm just trying to confuse you more :)

[mccollins]

My guess is the tail end of the riot, but I don't know, can spawn convert/damage places during the day even?

Or are we thinking that one of PB and Danny faked work?

It's my understanding that during the day the only thing that could have added damage points was the slaves before they were all gathered.

Of course, those that worked on cargo hold still could have faked work so that the situation didn't get better...

[hoopsguy]

Hmm, I really want to go Spawn hunting tonight, but recognize that we have two rooms that are down.

Do people have any deep thoughts on the best way to have some coordination in thread that doesn't tip off the bad guys too much?

[mccollins]

Just so we are clear, all engineers need to work on the cargo hold tonight.. so there isn't any confusion

Why can't Tyrith + 2 Engineers complete the work (4 cycles from them)?

Then the other 2 (Claphamsa is already listed as an Engineer) can begin work on the Engine.

If the Cargo Hold comes up still damaged in the morning, an engineer can fix it then and it will be fixed immediately and we can still pursue the away missions.

[Alan T]

Why can't Tyrith + 2 Engineers complete the work (4 cycles from them)?

Then the other 2 (Claphamsa is already listed as an Engineer) can begin work on the Engine.

If the Cargo Hold comes up still damaged in the morning, an engineer can fix it then and it will be fixed immediately and we can still pursue the away missions.

If the cargo hold is not fixed tonight, we all will be dehydrated tommorrow. I have no idea what that would mean as far as possible death for various people or how it would effect people whom are already wounded or exhausted or wounded&exhausted.

I would rather we have more people than needed to fix it to make sure it gets fixed in case of someone faking work, one of the engineering team dying, etc or both...

I think it would be really bad to let it go through the night without being absolutely sure we fix it.

[mccollins]

Also, I meant to ask earlier regarding the timing of the water dispensing - when does the galley master come into play? Why can't he dispense the water at any point during the day?

That is, if the cargo hold was still damaged (or damaged extra tonight) after the transition to day 3, and the engineers were able to fix it, can't the water just be dispensed after they fix it??

[PurdueBrad]

I'm back and caught up and agree that we over-work the cargo hold to make sure it gets done. My order is going in as we speak.

[path12]

Path, in terms of tomorrow obviously do what you think is best. It would be personally convenient to be cleared but if not I'll cool continuing to argue my points and defend myself in the thread.

I just found myself frustrated at times that you argued I needed to be scanned when you were the one who has twice had the power to do so and chose others. It is not an issue of who you chose, just that I felt the argument about me not being scanned was particularly empty coming from the guy who has that power.

Anyway, I don't want to bully you into a move that you are not comfortable executing. Or else I'm just trying to confuse you more :)

Oh, I wasn't feeling bullied at all. And I can see your point.

As I mentioned to you in our PM's, I do not expect to live very long in this game. Alan pretty much is on target with my strategy, which is to clear until we're off the ship then hunt. Unless I'm really awful in my instincts, I think I can hit a Spawn fairly quickly.

So yes, from that standpoint you are important for me to scan, because you are strong from either side and you can carry a lot of weight in thread. Plus as the Security Officer, your interrogations would be nice to have on our side.

KWhit was my first choice -- he plans the missions and needs to be trusted. I think that's a pretty slam-dunk call. You were second on the list, until Alan asked to be scanned. The captain gets his way, no doubt. So now you are on my list next. I don't think it's an illogical chain at all, albeit frustrating for you.

[Alan T]

Hmm, I really want to go Spawn hunting tonight, but recognize that we have two rooms that are down.

Do people have any deep thoughts on the best way to have some coordination in thread that doesn't tip off the bad guys too much?

Well some roles are fairly limited in what they can protect.. such as it is pretty obvious what the galley master should do tonight based on what he is allowed to do. I'm pretty sure that the spawn already are aware of which roles are locked in to areas such as this. I think for tonight it is each security personal's job to do their best assumption on where to go.. Tommorrow there won't be slaves to round up, so you might want to use your interrogation ability to hook up privately with some security member to try to coordinate things.

[Alan T]

Also, I meant to ask earlier regarding the timing of the water dispensing - when does the galley master come into play? Why can't he dispense the water at any point during the day?

That is, if the cargo hold was still damaged (or damaged extra tonight) after the transition to day 3, and the engineers were able to fix it, can't the water just be dispensed after they fix it??

The galley master comes into play when we run short on water in the hold vs how many people are around.. he can ration only giving x people water. The order has to be submitted at night though prior to the next day. BK mentioned earlier today that water is drunk at the start of the day, so I am assuming (I could be wrong here) that if the hold is broken in the morning, he can't later ration out water later in the day since he has to have the order submitted at night.

[Barkeep49]

Clapshamsa is an Engineer starting tomorrow. He should have been listed there today.

[path12]

D'oh. By off the ship I mean off the planet. I'm a doctor Alan, not an English major!


Oh shit, I am an English major.

[Alan T]

Oh, I wasn't feeling bullied at all. And I can see your point.

As I mentioned to you in our PM's, I do not expect to live very long in this game. Alan pretty much is on target with my strategy, which is to clear until we're off the ship then hunt. Unless I'm really awful in my instincts, I think I can hit a Spawn fairly quickly.

So yes, from that standpoint you are important for me to scan, because you are strong from either side and you can carry a lot of weight in thread. Plus as the Security Officer, your interrogations would be nice to have on our side.

KWhit was my first choice -- he plans the missions and needs to be trusted. I think that's a pretty slam-dunk call. You were second on the list, until Alan asked to be scanned. The captain gets his way, no doubt. So now you are on my list next. I don't think it's an illogical chain at all, albeit frustrating for you.

I feel a little bad about "forcing" you to scan me today.. even though I didn't force you to I put you in an awkward spot. I just talk alot, am pretty strong with my ideas when I feel they are solid and I feel it is important that everyone can feel confident in my motivation beyond just a metagame reason. Once I got my PM this morning from last night's result.. I just was not sure what it meant and wanted to rule out any infection if that possibly was the case.. Figured you were my only hope Obi won

[Barkeep49]

The galley master comes into play when we run short on water in the hold vs how many people are around.. he can ration only giving x people water. The order has to be submitted at night though prior to the next day. BK mentioned earlier today that water is drunk at the start of the day, so I am assuming (I could be wrong here) that if the hold is broken in the morning, he can't later ration out water later in the day since he has to have the order submitted at night.
That is correct.

[path12]

I feel a little bad about "forcing" you to scan me today.. even though I didn't force you to I put you in an awkward spot. I just talk alot, am pretty strong with my ideas when I feel they are solid and I feel it is important that everyone can feel confident in my motivation beyond just a metagame reason. Once I got my PM this morning from last night's result.. I just was not sure what it meant and wanted to rule out any infection if that possibly was the case.. Figured you were my only hope Obi won

No worries. It just swapped days 2 and 3.

[path12]

All right, I'm out. Time to see if I've got any promising 3 year olds.

Wait, that sounded wrong.

[PurdueBrad]

Here I go again...with the engineering crew backing me up

"Baby Got Boxes"
Oh my God,
Hoopsy, look at those boxes
They're so big
They each look like one of those rap guys' cribs
But y'know, who understands those rap guys
They only like those because they have room for stripper poles
I mean, they're so big
I can't believe they're so square
And the spawn, I mean, they're so gross

I like big boxes and I don't know why
you other engineers can't deny
And if a spawn walks in and tries to destroy the place
we'll bust them in their face
Wanna pull up tough
and try to talk some stuff
but us engineers are deep in our repairs
you're jealous 'cause we've got Dilbert hair
and you wanna hang with us
and take our picture
My homeboys tried to warn me
but the Spawn that are around
just ain't that scary
Ooh exploration crew
you say you wanna fly in our ship
well get me some crys and use me so we can get outta here

I've seen the slaves run wild
doing damage like a drunken child
Take the average engineer and ask them that
we gotta kill those slaves flat

So engineers (yeah) engineers (yeah)
Are we working on the big boxes (hell yeah)
So turn it, turn it, turn it, turn it, turn that big ole wrench
Cargo hold got fixed

[PurdueBrad]

Path, hopefully that gets "Whistle While You Work" out of your head.

So, ummm, yeah, how long until my songs get me lynched?

[mccollins]

hahaaaahhaha

[hoopsguy]

Path, scan me please if you don't mind.

I'll explain why after I make sure you haven't already submitted a different scan order or not.. Would rather not give the reason out publically yet if you go a different direction

You got it, Cap.

"Captain Alan if you could please come with me sir," the good doctor path requests. The two men adjourn to the infirmary where an examination is done. A while later the two emerge, the exam done.

The reason why was because of my sleeping PM I received last night. I got an odd message that I think is one of two things. It said that I used to trust the crew, but once I landed that started to change... but it wasn't an always thing, but only a sometimes thing.

I asked Barkeep what it meant, and he told me he wasn't going to clarify any further.. so my hunch is that I have a secret ability to be able to detect a spawn the more nights I sleep with them.. but a small part of me is worried that I have a spawnling inside of me. If the latter, then I want to find out now so Path can remove it.. if the former, then now that I have revealed this, I want to be in the brig where 1) I will be with the same people every night and be able to pick up if a spawn is in there somehow and 2) I want to be protected so someone can't kill me because of this ability.

I found no indication of Spawn with you, so there is no spawnling and we're both still alive. I wonder if this means Unaware Spawn though, which I don't think I would detect.

Dola, but I'll also repeat that no indication of Spawn was found with you.

No spawnling to the best of my knowledge but I got a similar PM as Alan only with some different information. It didn't dawn on me, until he asked to be scanned, to think that it could be a bad thing. Nothing I read from it indicates that. In fact, it is very vague and indicates very little but nothing dark or dangerous in terms of our mission. So it's your call. That's why I asked about Hoops earlier, was hoping for an interrogation to share info with somebody but I guess this did it.

I was unsure if I was going to mention this as I didn't want to give anything away to potential Spawn, but at this point it is probably unspecific enough to be alright.

In my PM last night it said that I could feel the spawn. I don't know if this means I could have a spawnling or I will be gaining a special ability or perhaps it had something to do with working next to Jeheinz.


Here is all the conversation around the "Spawn Aware" stuff up to the point that Danny revealed. Note that Danny's info comes significantly after Alan, as well as PurdueBrad (who I had forgotten about until surfing these posts).

I'm not sure what the results of this post review are going to be, but I'm going into them with the idea that Danny shifted his logic midway through when he found himself in an either/or scenario. I don't think he liked being in that position and thought it was best to extricate himself by changing his story and act like I was putting words in his mouth.

It is entirely possible I'll see he was being consistent, but it is damn hard to keep track of posts in a game that is flying by like this one.

[Alan T]

I'm heading to bed.. I went 4 for 4 tonight (all 4 lousy singles bleh) but my leg and knee are hurting a bit.. I'm thinking I am getting too old for organized sports :(

See you all when I get out of the brig!

[hoopsguy]

D'oh. By off the ship I mean off the planet. I'm a doctor Alan, not an English major!


Oh shit, I am an English major.

Huh, me too.

[PurdueBrad]

Huh, me too.

Me three, well, already have the MA and teach it but I'll jump on this bandwagon.

[Alan T]

Barkeep.. kind of important to know but I can't find it in the rules anywhere so not sure if I am thinking of a past spawn game or this one...

Once we lift up from the planet, current spawnlings will continue to form into spawns, but no more spawnlings can be planted to convert anyone right?

BK, if you can answer this tonight while I sleep (or at least say you aren't going to answer it), it would help me sleep easier tonight! :)

[hoopsguy]

Path, hopefully that gets "Whistle While You Work" out of your head.

So, ummm, yeah, how long until my songs get me lynched?

The correct answer is "not quickly enough". :lol:

On this ship, possibly "never" is the more correct answer. :banghead:


Oh no I didn't!

[jeheinz72]

Good catch hoops, I totally missed the PB Spawn Aware stuff

You do raise an interesting point, not only the stuck scenario, but the fact that it just seems odd that 2 engineers would get the Spawn Aware sense.

Anyhow, I'll eagerly await path's apparently inevitable scan of you before digging into Danny.

I think I'm out for the night as well. I'm not programmed to handle more than 9 hours of WW'ing, I'm beat.

[hoopsguy]

Purdue, as soon as you can I think it makes sense for you, Alan, and Danny to chat about your PMs to see if you think that you have the same role or if we have a case of "one of the three is not like the others"

Also, it looks like you will be with Tyrith again tonight, just as Danny will be with Heinz.

Alan will once again be with KWhit and Path, but not eight of his other favorite friends.

So we have some continuity in being with similar people night to night. Assuming that 1+ of you guys actually are Spawn Aware we might be able to get some better info.

[PurdueBrad]

Good catch hoops, I totally missed the PB Spawn Aware stuff

You do raise an interesting point, not only the stuck scenario, but the fact that it just seems odd that 2 engineers would get the Spawn Aware sense.

Anyhow, I'll eagerly await path's apparently inevitable scan of you before digging into Danny.

I think I'm out for the night as well. I'm not programmed to handle more than 9 hours of WW'ing, I'm beat.

Mine is odd though in that it doesn't really seem to be about any one particular person, just an overall general feeling so I don't know if it is meant to mislead me or if I could be developing an ability. Like Alan, I actually sent BK a couple PMs trying to gain some clarity and got none.

[PurdueBrad]

Purdue, as soon as you can I think it makes sense for you, Alan, and Danny to chat about your PMs to see if you think that you have the same role or if we have a case of "one of the three is not like the others"

Also, it looks like you will be with Tyrith again tonight, just as Danny will be with Heinz.

Alan will once again be with KWhit and Path, but not eight of his other favorite friends.

So we have some continuity in being with similar people night to night. Assuming that 1+ of you guys actually are Spawn Aware we might be able to get some better info.

Hoops, if I'm not mistaken I'll be with all three: Tyrith, Heinz, and Danny. Hopefully one of us is spawn aware as I'm starting to doubt myself as being spawn aware and possibly something else.

[Mrs. Schmidty]

Wow...guys, I had NO idea exactly what was meant by this being a time intensive game. I just got home and there are 15 pages to catch up on since this morning. If I don't seem as active, it's not intentional, but I can't spend all my time at home just trying to get caught up. I will be reading and posting as I come across things, but I apologize now for not being a strong player in this game.


If someone has already posted a summary could you direct me to it and if they haven't, would someone mind? I'll still read through, but if I could get a summary first that would be great.

[Danny]

but I'm going into them with the idea that Danny shifted his logic midway through when he found himself in an either/or scenario. I don't think he liked being in that position and thought it was best to extricate himself by changing his story and act like I was putting words in his mouth.

It is entirely possible I'll see he was being consistent, but it is damn hard to keep track of posts in a game that is flying by like this one.

You are the only one who put things into an either/or scenario. That's the primary reason I voted for you. Look at the post you just quoted. I was rather confused as to what my message meant and nowhere in there does it say jeheinz is bad. At most, it is somewhat implied could be one possibility out of three, but that I didn't know.

If I was a spawn, what I did would have been amazingly stupid. I was under no heat at all, and revealing that would have accomplished nothing for me as a spawn.

[hoopsguy]

Quoting myself as I'd like to know some possible explanations for this :)

Danny, these are the two things that strike me about your post.

My personal choice would be that I think jeheinz shouldn't be voted off today.. we need his help tonight repairing things...

I DO think that the night work crews should be the same as the previous night if that is ok with you Tyrith. Having Danny work in the same room as the same person or people he previously did would help in case it is a spawn aware type thing...

Which room did they work in last night, did we have any security guards say they guarded that location?

AlanT, Jeheinz and I worked in the Slave pen last night

I would like to join Danny and Jeheinz's crew tonight to test something, assuming we need three of us on one job.

I'm hoping Tyrith and the rest of you can figure out who is needed to fix the rest of the cargo hold tonight. I still think it would be wise to plan for more repairs than necessary just in case of faked work.. But any left over can either start to work on engines or water pump (I'd say engines myself) if you all want.

Looking back, I don't believe Danny and Heinz were guarded. Tyrith and I were guarded by Pass and everything seemed good.

I also agree with Alan that we should not vote off Jeheinz at this point. My message may simply be cluing me into a potential ability and not necessarily have anything specific to do with Jeheinz. We should know more tomorrow.

OK, here is continuing conversation by/near Danny on the topic of his PM. The last one is where he does suggest that we should not push on Heinz. This is before I came up with my "widely controversial" duplicant theory.

Small adjustment closer to believing Danny up to this point ... let's see if it stays there.

[hoopsguy]

You are the only one who put things into an either/or scenario. That's the primary reason I voted for you. Look at the post you just quoted. I was rather confused as to what my message meant and nowhere in there does it say jeheinz is bad. At most, it is somewhat implied could be one possibility out of three, but that I didn't know.

If I was a spawn, what I did would have been amazingly stupid. I was under no heat at all, and revealing that would have accomplished nothing for me as a spawn.

The creation of an either/or is definitely bad news for the spawn. A spawn vaulting up the list to be scanned is definitely bad news for the spawn. This is why I felt like you bailed on your position - because you had zero interest in being in an either/or proposition and had zero expectation of the conversation going in that direction. That is the thrust of my argument I'm working through right now.

[hoopsguy]

You are the only one who put things into an either/or scenario. That's the primary reason I voted for you. Look at the post you just quoted. I was rather confused as to what my message meant and nowhere in there does it say jeheinz is bad. At most, it is somewhat implied could be one possibility out of three, but that I didn't know.

If I was a spawn, what I did would have been amazingly stupid. I was under no heat at all, and revealing that would have accomplished nothing for me as a spawn.

Dola, on a day where there was a lack of consensus, you were stating to get some heat about the robot comment. It had not translated into votes yet, but there were some raised eyebrows based on posts in the thread. For what it is worth, I took it as innocuous at the time, figuring you were just adding some color to the role even though I haven't seen you do that in past games.

[Mrs. Schmidty]

That is my point... I would expect it from a scientist.. I am trying to figure out how he built it as an engineer.. Danny isn't a scientist.. I'm not meaning to bark up a tree here, just found it odd , plus found it more odd that no one other than me seemed to pick up on it or mention it.

I would expect an engineer to make a robot over a scientist. Engineers typically work more with inventions and building as opposed to scientists that work more with life (plants, species etc) or matter - whether it be with experiments, composition study or logic. Does that make sense?

Danny building a robot as an engineer makes sense.

[hoopsguy]

One of us should be working with Tyrith as that gets us an extra bonus point. So, PurdueBrad and Tyrith working on the sleeping quarters or water plant? Engine seems like the worst choice to repair at this point.

Then you and I can work on finishing up the cargo hold in case you fake your work.

That's fine, I will go in there with you and hopefully I get a better idea about what that part of last night's PM meant.

PurdueBrad, are you alright with working on the engine with Tyrith? I know you wanted to be with Jeheinz and I, but we should take advantage of that extra point.

Actually, The other option would be for Tyrith to fix the cargohold and three of us to work on the engine? What do you think?

And I thought being an engineer was going to be boring. I actually told my fiancee about me creating a robot in the thread and she asked me what purpose it had. My response was "I don't get to do much as an engineer, so I wanted to create a way to entertain myself".

I was wrong of course :)

Heinz, with speculation that Danny is spawn aware, I think it makes sense for you to help me figure out who might have been in the Slaves area with you last night.

Other options:
- Danny isn's Spawn Aware, but Spawnling
- Danny is bluffing for reasons that don't entirely make sense

Everyone who is not exhausted must have slept last night. So you can cross them off the list. We don't have location information on the following people, to the best of my knowledge:
- RendeR
- PackerFanatic
- Bulletsponge

Also, if our duplicant wanted to scan Danny today by imitating Path that might not be the worst play either. I want good info on our doc, but if Danny is a Spawnling then we have a good vote for today and a small list of people who could have attacked him last night. This potentially leads us to two spawn. If Danny comes up human, then we have to more strongly consider "Spawn Aware" and that ratchets up the heat on Heinz (known to be in same area) and that same small group of people who were exhausted today without a clear reason to be exhausted.

Posts up to my initial floating the Danny/Heinz pairing. Danny has still been consistent with the "lets stay together so I can work through this PM" play. At this point I'm very interested in seeing how active he is with the conversation as it turns either/or with him. Note that he has been quite active in the thread engaged in planning the repairs ... I have left a couple of those posts out but have most of them quoted.

[Mrs. Schmidty]

Danny is seen heading off to the Cargo Hold with his tools. People assume that he's going to make repairs. The cacophony of sounds that soon follows from that part of the ship justifies the crew's assumption.

Does Barkeep give clues at all in his posts? I'm playing catch up a bit and jumping around in the posts a bit, but I came across this and jumped out at me. Is this discussed at all or clarified already?

[hoopsguy]

I'd definitely like to be scanned if possible.

That's the catch, and I've been thinking on it since he posted it, I don't know who else (if not saldana) would've been down there.

There's really no reason for anyone to have been, outside of us working on it. At least no implicitly obvious one.

Trust me, that one from him came out of left field for me. I didn't think Danny as Spawn/ling and don't know if I do now, but I do know I'm not.

Something of note, I'm not implying guilt or innocence, but Packer does seem to be reacting differently to getting suspicion then when he was a villager in St. Cronin's draft game.

I'm up for other explanations. And if you agree with me that these are the logical explanations then you should probably join me in asking the duplicant to scan Danny today, if at all possible.

I like having easy votes. Danny = spawnling would qualify as easy for me. It gets a little trickier if he is clean, because it doesn't damn you but it sure puts the focus on you if we can't put someone else on that location.

That's true Packer, At this point I am not sure who I am going to vote for, but I agree with the idea that a lynch is better than no lynch. I'd prefer choosing between players as opposed to nolynch/you though.

I'm for the replicant coming forward and scanning Danny. In a way, I hate to see that bullet on Danny instead of clearing path through-and-through, but since I know I'm not Spawn, Danny has to be lying I'd think. I can't see why he'd make it up. Though I don't really know if it was a smart lie either.

That's the catch really. What if there was another person there, trying to sleep or whatever (or a spawn attacking it), if the replicant scans Danny and he's clean. Everyone is going to jump on me. While in a way I can't blame them, they're wrong. So now we've wasted the replicant and all we've achieved in doing so is lynch an innocent and wasted time.

If you think Danny is lying then why is your vote on me? If you are a villager, you should see that I'm at least trying to play the game, even if you don't like the direction I'm headed (towards you).

If I live another night or two I'm almost certain to be scanned - potentially even by the replicant if he thinks I'm trying to burn him.

It would make absolutely no sense for me to lie about that message. It is possible I am a spawnling, though it doesn't seem to indicate that if I am reading it correctly. I've already said that even if the message did mean Spawn aware that it doesn't mean you have to be bad.

Again, based on my reading of it, it's possible the message was simply indicating me of a power I am going to have and not necessarily have anything to do with who was near me. I would advise not voting for you today even if I come clean as we'll know more tomorrow.

Because no matter how you slice it, lynching an engineer today, myself or Danny, is a bad play for the village unless you are very near certain of it. Like scanned by the replicant certain of it.

I can't be certain enough with the idea of people just roaming the halls last night.

Let's say the group lynches me (or Danny) and we're wrong. Well now we effectively lose 2 units of repair tonight when there is a lot of work to be done. One of PB or Tyrith would be all but forced to go work with the one of us that wasn't lynched, meaning no 2-point bonus for Tyrith if he stayed on the engine or forced over-repair if he was the one to go to the Hold.

That's the thing, I don't 100% *know* he's lying. Sure, his Spawn Aware sense is wrong, with regard to me allegience, but with the possibility that...

A) Spawn either lied about there whereabouts and attacked the pen last night (which did take damage last night if I have it right)

B) A spawn was walking the halls due to no bed and tried to sleep in the pen and that counts

C) The message has nothing to do with who he was around but about a new acquired power

I can't be certain enough. On top of that, the lie in and of itself would be a poor play at best. I can't see the Spawn thinking "Gee, we really need this Heinz character out of the game" enough to throw bullets my way all day then mimic a previous power in hopes that it's enough to drive home a bullet and get me lynched. Certainly, if they did that, they just f'd themselves since Danny will look bad, as will PF for getting saved (the presumed benefit of doing this at all), as would clap for the vote on me.

I read my PM again. I really don't think it is implying Jeheinz is bad.. When it mentions I can feel spawn, it says "THE" and not "A". Personally, I will not be voting for Jeheinz today as tomorrow we should be able to clear this up.

I generally think Danny has been consistent here, although I'm intrigued about one thing.

Why do you start off the day trying to make sense of your PM, but move to the idea that you will have resolution tomorrow? Does that make sense to Alan and/or PB, who may have the same role?

Why tomorrow specifically, instead of two days out? Or some undetermined number of days out? Is this you making an assumption (repeatedly) or is this something that is pretty clear to you?

[Tyrith]

*whacks head into desk repeatedly*

Sorry, just had to get the frustration out. On Day 2 I completely agree with hoops -- not having a lynch was very, very bad.

I'm off to the cargo hold. Right now I don't really have a good vibe for anyone on this darn ship.

[PurdueBrad]

Hoops, I'll be honest in regards to your question, I'm kind of hoping for added clarity tomorrow as well for my PM. If I get nothing then I'll assume it was a tease or based on certian conditions overnight (being in a certain room, overnight, with Tyrith and Pass...sounds kinky) or maybe I'll get more clarity from a PM. Like I said for mine, it was very, very vague. So much so, that I asked for two different types of clarification and got neither really.

[PurdueBrad]

Hoops, I'll be honest in regards to your question, I'm kind of hoping for added clarity tomorrow as well for my PM. If I get nothing then I'll assume it was a tease or based on certain conditions overnight (being in a certain room, overnight, with Tyrith and Pass...sounds kinky) or maybe I'll get more clarity from a PM. Like I said for mine, it was very, very vague. So much so, that I asked for two different types of clarification and got neither really.

sorry, my spelling errors are annoying me.

[hoopsguy]

Shh, I'm raising our post counts!

I was trying to leave some doubt about what the message stated exactly since I don't want the spawn to know for sure. I also don't want to see you get voted for though when I am cleared.

If I get different information tomorrow that could change of course, but for now there's no reason to lynch you.

Four things.

UNVOTE PACKERFANATIC
VOTE HOOPSGUY

You seem to be ignoring the fact that multiple times I have said that me being cleared doesn't mean lynching Jeheinz is a good action. From the way my message is worded, it does not sound like it is referring to jeheinz. And if it is, we will know tomorrow.

Danny, I've put my vote elsewhere, in part because of what you have said. However, it was suggested that I wasn't being rational in my approach. So I did my best to spell out the argument I had made earlier in the day.

I agree we'll find out more info tomorrow on you + Heinz.

Sounds good.

I do understand suspicion on you honestly. You've made a few plays that seem wolfish to me too. On the other hand, if you are a wolf, would you have made those plays that seem wolfish? I'd prefer to see a two man race either way

Vote Hoopsguy


OK, I'm more or less discarding the idea that your approach varied throughout. But I'll repeat - why are you so sure that you will know more tomorrow? Assuming you are still around tomorrow, I would definitely like an answer to this question then. And if you want to give it tonight while I'm around it may factor into my night action (guard/spy - sleep is not an option).

[hoopsguy]

Hoops, I'll be honest in regards to your question, I'm kind of hoping for added clarity tomorrow as well for my PM. If I get nothing then I'll assume it was a tease or based on certian conditions overnight (being in a certain room, overnight, with Tyrith and Pass...sounds kinky) or maybe I'll get more clarity from a PM. Like I said for mine, it was very, very vague. So much so, that I asked for two different types of clarification and got neither really.

This is different than how I read Danny's posts over the last hour, where he seems pretty damn sure he'll know tomorrow about whether or not to gun for Heinz.

[PurdueBrad]

This is different than how I read Danny's posts over the last hour, where he seems pretty damn sure he'll know tomorrow about whether or not to gun for Heinz.

That is true, he definitely is demonstrating much more certainty than I feel with mine. I'll be honest, mine simply added confusion for me so I'm not sold on me developing any kind of skill (although at first I was quite excited about the possibility). So where I'm *hoping* for some clarity, he seems certain he'll get info so either he is spawn-aware or followed Alan's and my lead but that seems like an odd play.

[Tyrith]

That is true, he definitely is demonstrating much more certainty than I feel with mine. I'll be honest, mine simply added confusion for me so I'm not sold on me developing any kind of skill (although at first I was quite excited about the possibility). So where I'm *hoping* for some clarity, he seems certain he'll get info so either he is spawn-aware or followed Alan's and my lead but that seems like an odd play.

Hey, sometimes a healthy measure of hope is what gets someone through the day. Or realizing that he's shoved himself in a corner and trying to gamble.

[Danny]

This is different than how I read Danny's posts over the last hour, where he seems pretty damn sure he'll know tomorrow about whether or not to gun for Heinz.

I should know more tomorrow, but I guess I may not. Perhaps I shouldn't make that assumption, but I am hopeful I have a power and that I will get some information on that tomorrow.

[PurdueBrad]

Tyrith, are you putting in the labor with us on the cargo hold to make sure that the work gets done?

[Marc Vaughan]

Right I'm off to bed - see you chaps in the morning.

[hoopsguy]

Also, I'm having a hard time believing that there were not Spawn voting on me today. If only for the "spread" theory - that they need someplace to dump their votes and don't want to be in a block.

I wasn't gunning for the engineers as a group today, despite what some people have suggested. But with three of the four (to be five tomorrow) on me at the end, two of them giving "Spawn Aware" signals and the third being a guy I've suspected from the outset I'm going to be analyzing their posts like a hawk going forward.

I still think we have to figure out RendeR/Telle tomorrow, particularly after I'm cleared by the seer who is safely locked up in the Brig tonight. But once that is out of the way I'll be coming back to today's stuff relentlessly.

[hoopsguy]

I should know more tomorrow, but I guess I may not. Perhaps I shouldn't make that assumption, but I am hopeful I have a power and that I will get some information on that tomorrow.

So if you don't know tomorrow should we keep pairing you two up again? How many days do we hope that you have that magic moment of clarity?

I'm not looking to put words in your mouth, but look back at the posts I quoted. The word "tomorrow" appears in a hell of a lot of them, and I didn't get nearly the same sense of equivocation that I'm seeing in this last post of yours.

[hoopsguy]

On another note - I'm clearly a little too into the game when I haven't checked the Cubs score until 11PM.

[Tyrith]

Yes, I'm working in the cargo hold.

Hoops, honestly, I'm uncomfortable with your officer theory, for a reason that has been stated before -- why does there have to be an officer that's a spawn? I accept it as possible but not necessary that at least officer had to be selected to be a spawn as part of the game setup - convince me.

[hoopsguy]

Tyrith, can I just quote the math post again? That should be the most compelling argument around. If you see other 80% voting options out there between two candidates (assuming I'm cleared tomorrow morning) please let me know.

[Tyrith]

BTW, I think that our default play for tomorrow should be to send the people that have been outside twice back outside again, then lynch one. I suspect compelling evidence will arise tonight or tomorrow that will mess with that plan, but it might not. And darnit people, SOMEONE has to die tomorrow.

[Tyrith]

Which post is the math post? In reading eight or ten pages at once I lost the exact one -- then I may or may not ask a more specific question.

[hoopsguy]

3 spawn, 5 officers:
18/23 * 17/22 * 16/21 * 15/20 * 14/19 = 1028160/4037880 = 25.46% no starting spawn

If you add Alan + Kwhit as cleared, I believe the numbers shift like so:
16/21 * 15/20 * 14/19 * 13/18 * 12/17 = 524160/2441880 = 21.46% no starting spawn

I know I did not start spawn, so that moves the numbers down even further for me. The same should be true for RendeR/Telle if they are not Spawn when evaluating the other two candidates:
15/20 * 14/19 * 13/18 * 12/17 * 11/16 = 360360/1860480 = 19.36% no starting spawn

For me, it comes down to initially distrusting RendeR + exhausted without knowing reason vs initially neutral on Telle + 2 away missions (18% chance infected on top of % to be starting spawn)

If people see flaws in how I've put the numbers together, lets discuss them. But if the seer clears three people among the officers, then I think we have to take this path, barring some kind of night-time action giving us a 100% option.

[PurdueBrad]

Guys, I'm beat and will be checking out soon. By the way, I was mistaken, I'm here tomorrow and at the Cubs game on Friday (hoping to see Rich Harden's debut).

[hoopsguy]

His debut is supposed to be Saturday.

[PurdueBrad]

His debut is supposed to be Saturday.

Damn, last I had heard it was 50/50. Oh well, guess we'll see Jason Marquis instead.

[hoopsguy]

Damn, last I had heard it was 50/50. Oh well, guess we'll see Jason Marquis instead.

Pretty serious letdown there :banghead:

[hoopsguy]

OK - important note for the others with guard options. Please guard the two facilities tonight.

(In best Maverick voice) "I'm going after Viper!"

[Tyrith]

Hoops, am I wrong or wouldn't that math apply to any group of people selected, ultimately? If you pick five people isn't it highly likely one of them is going to start spawn? Not interested into getting too much into the nitty gritty, but trying to understand with my tired brain.

[hoopsguy]

This especially means Saldana and Schmidty. Schmidty, you should definitely be on guard at the hold.

Upon further review, I trust Saldana more than others, but we should have given the phaser to someone with more flexibility with their guard action. Sorry for not realizing this earlier - I did not revisit page 1 today and still had him in my head from yesterday when the slave pens were a mess.

[Danny]

So if you don't know tomorrow should we keep pairing you two up again? How many days do we hope that you have that magic moment of clarity?

I'm not looking to put words in your mouth, but look back at the posts I quoted. The word "tomorrow" appears in a hell of a lot of them, and I didn't get nearly the same sense of equivocation that I'm seeing in this last post of yours.

This is why I think I should know more tomorrow.

I outline the three possibilities I thought when I read that part of my PM.

1. I'm a spawnling. I think this is the most unlikely based on the wording used in the PM, but I would know tomorrow as I would then be a spawn. Of course if this happened I would then have to spin it some other way.

2. The PM was simply letting me know of a general ability. I assume there would be further information available regarding this. This is the most likely based on how I read it.

3. It was because I was near Jeheinz or someone else where we were and he/they are a spawn. Two nights in a row is no guarentee, but hopefully some information would be present regarding this even if it is saying "you sensed no spawn activity".

In either case, I do assume I will have more information tomorrow, not necessarily about jeheinz, but in general. At least I certainly hope I will.

[hoopsguy]

Hoops, am I wrong or wouldn't that math apply to any group of people selected, ultimately? If you pick five people isn't it highly likely one of them is going to start spawn? Not interested into getting too much into the nitty gritty, but trying to understand with my tired brain.

Sure, but do you have another group of five where three will be cleared tomorrow? And one of the remaining two will have been on 2-3 away missions? Or a group of five people that pose an equal level of risk post-takeoff? Or a group of five people where there are some meta-game balancing reasons to maybe move the numbers a little bit further?

All that said, you are correct that if you pick any group of five people then you have the same numbers in terms of starting spawn.

[Tyrith]

But ultimately I'm wondering whether or not your starting group of five was arbitrary. If one of the officers had to be a spawn, your logic holds. However, if not then clearing people from that group doesn't specifically effect Telle and Render anymore than anyone else. That said, Telle is going to be my default vote tomorrow -- again, likely to be changed.

[Danny]

And again, it's possible my assumptions could be wrong as I have not played Spawn before, but receiving the PM I did and then getting no further info on it seems unlikely to me.

[hoopsguy]

This is why I think I should know more tomorrow.

I outline the three possibilities I thought when I read that part of my PM.

1. I'm a spawnling. I think this is the most unlikely based on the wording used in the PM, but I would know tomorrow as I would then be a spawn. Of course if this happened I would then have to spin it some other way.

2. The PM was simply letting me know of a general ability. I assume there would be further information available regarding this. This is the most likely based on how I read it.

3. It was because I was near Jeheinz or someone else where we were and he/they are a spawn. Two nights in a row is no guarentee, but hopefully some information would be present regarding this even if it is saying "you sensed no spawn activity".

In either case, I do assume I will have more information tomorrow, not necessarily about jeheinz, but in general. At least I certainly hope I will.

1. Would have been really good to scan you today with the duplicant in that case. You would be cured, we wouldn't be putting Path at risk, and we could drop any thought of you being Spawn Aware.

If that is the case, then you are a threat to whoever does scan you and now will be lying in the thread the rest of the way.

2/3 - we would have known you were clean. From there, we could have either put you in the brig as 4th member, or more likely put you back to work with Heinz while being guarded. Or just taken a shot with our vote on Heinz today, which may or may not have been advantageous. But if you were a known good I would like to think that I would have given your wishes on this a lot of consideration.

[hoopsguy]

But ultimately I'm wondering whether or not your starting group of five was arbitrary. If one of the officers had to be a spawn, your logic holds. However, if not then clearing people from that group doesn't specifically effect Telle and Render anymore than anyone else. That said, Telle is going to be my default vote tomorrow -- again, likely to be changed.

No, in that case the % would be 100% instead of 80%.

[Danny]

And I realize I am being more aggressive in stating what I think will happen with what the PM meant than either AlanT or PurdueBrad. If I don't get anymore info it will probably come back to bite me too, but I'm stating what I believe to be the case regardless of suspicions.

[Tyrith]

Eh, you're right, and I'm moderately confused as to the goings on, but I have to say that I'm not overly fond of the math cases right now, because I'm pretty sure there are a lot of them that could be made and not a lot of people that are willing to make them -- thus, for good or evil it makes it harder for us to be aware of what you are or aren't arguing. It might be valid, but not how I prefer to approach it right now. Maybe I'll feel better about it when I'm less tired.

[Tyrith]

And I have to say, on the whole I'm more comfortable with the Alan/path approach to the Duplicant and overall game strategy than I am with yours, hoops, which makes their no lynch votes today even more frustrating to me, because it wouldn't have hindered us getting a brig-based CoT going at all.

[Danny]

1. Would have been really good to scan you today with the duplicant in that case. You would be cured, we wouldn't be putting Path at risk, and we could drop any thought of you being Spawn Aware.


You're right about this. And while I think the chances are low that the PM meant I was a spawnling, it would be irresponsible of me not to mention this as a possibility because even if I do get turned into a spawn, I am not one now.

[hoopsguy]

I think bringing math into the equation is something that is done all too rarely in WW games, personally. I don't think you should be an absolute slave to it, but it certainly helps me in determining the value of pursuing a direction. The numbers were significantly more compelling for the five-person group (Officers) than the four-person group (Engineers) ... much more than I would have initially anticipated.

So even though my gut was screaming for Heinz (considered a bad vote because he was needed) I couldn't ignore a 25% difference in likelihood among groups.

But once I was down to two parties, I could ignore a 19% difference between candidates (chance that Telle took a hit on an away mission). I bring this up to emphasize using math as a tool, but not an absolute decision maker.

Time will tell if the math was helpful or detrimental. But we all play gut, and I don't think any of us are above 50% doing it that way.

[hoopsguy]

OK, I really do need to get some sleep.

Mrs Schmidty - I would love it if you could put in a guard action tonight with the knowledge that I won't be and that Saldana can't guard the two areas that need protection tonight.

[Tyrith]

My math strategy just involves less actual math and more general math in my head - but I understand your point. Hopefully it won't seem so arcane later on -- which is really odd, seeing that I'm going to be an accountant and all.

[hoopsguy]

Last thought of the night - if there is an empath in the game they may be able to go after one of me, Telle, or RendeR tomorrow.

I've got the most posts out of the three of us, so perhaps it is worth considering that as an option instead of scanning me. But if people want to dredge through posts by the three of us, that might give a way to vouch for one person and semi-vouch for another, rather than leaving us in a guessing game between two candidates.

Obviously we can re-evaluate this in the context of the morning news, but I figure this might be a viable strategy that has yet to be discussed.

[Danny]

Empath would be a cool ability to have, but also a difficult one I would imagine.

[Tyrith]

I'd actually be pretty cool with the empath option, mainly because I don't want hoops the potential spawn eating our seer. But I'm also content to trust path's instincts on this one.

[hoopsguy]

And a difficult one to moderate.

OK, really off to bed this time.

[hoopsguy]

I'd actually be pretty cool with the empath option, mainly because I don't want hoops the potential spawn eating our seer. But I'm also content to trust path's instincts on this one.


Heh, I almost posted "so I don't take out the seer when he scans me as spawn" in my post there, but then decided someone wouldn't have their sarcasm meters on and it would be more trouble than it was worth. So thanks for opening the door for me to actually post it now.

Also, if the empath wants to scan that statement to show that I'm lying when I say that I'll potentially take out the seer when scanned (I would not, villagers don't hurt the seer when scanned, duh) that would be A-OK with me (if allowed, of course).

[hoopsguy]

Somehow I still have 12 posts less than Alan. Good god, man - get a life :)

[Mrs. Schmidty]

OK, I really do need to get some sleep.

Mrs Schmidty - I would love it if you could put in a guard action tonight with the knowledge that I won't be and that Saldana can't guard the two areas that need protection tonight.

It's already been done :)

[Marc Vaughan]

As a private am I allowed to stand guard (sorry but I got lynched in record time in my only other WW game so I honestly am not sure of what I can and can't do).

Empath would be a cool ability to have, but also a difficult one I would imagine.
Thinking logically if there is an empath you can probably finish this game up very quickly (as I mentioned earlier) by getting everyone to state "I am not a spawn" ....

The people who don't obviously are spawns who don't want to take the chance of being 'outed' - the ones who do aren't 'safe' per-se but obviously the empath can now check them out nice and easily.

(or is this a little 'crude' and out of roleplay to utilise such an ability in a lie detector type manner)

To kick things off in case people think I'm not totally mad (its 2am remember):
"I am not a spawn"

:D

[path12]

I generally think Danny has been consistent here, although I'm intrigued about one thing.

Why do you start off the day trying to make sense of your PM, but move to the idea that you will have resolution tomorrow? Does that make sense to Alan and/or PB, who may have the same role?

Why tomorrow specifically, instead of two days out? Or some undetermined number of days out? Is this you making an assumption (repeatedly) or is this something that is pretty clear to you?

Frankly, I'm getting nothing off Danny but engineer. One thing I find interesting is that as this was happening I was most noticing your actions, but in reading this, heinz looks much worse than he appeared at the time to me (which was exasperated). There's where the first implication of Danny=Spawn Aware really came from.

[path12]

You're right about this. And while I think the chances are low that the PM meant I was a spawnling, it would be irresponsible of me not to mention this as a possibility because even if I do get turned into a spawn, I am not one now.

Having gotten interesting phrases in previous Barkeep games I can tell you that it could all be nothing but flavor. GM's sometimes like to have robots too.

[path12]

As a private am I allowed to stand guard (sorry but I got lynched in record time in my only other WW game so I honestly am not sure of what I can and can't do).

You can sort of stand guard by sending Barkeep a PM saying you'll stay awake and hang in some particular area (pick one but don't say in thread). You're not likely to find a bed right now anyway.

[Marc Vaughan]

You can sort of stand guard by sending Barkeep a PM saying you'll stay awake and hang in some particular area (pick one but don't say in thread). You're not likely to find a bed right now anyway.

Ok thanks

[Chubby]

Ok, finally caught up. I have to open for work today (6:15-4pm) but will post more when I get home (thoughts on last day or so/vote). I hate having to clopen (close then open) but it was kinda forced onto me this week. Anywho, hopefully we'll have a productive evening in repairing the ship, staying alive and spotting a spawn.

[hoopsguy]

Frankly, I'm getting nothing off Danny but engineer. One thing I find interesting is that as this was happening I was most noticing your actions, but in reading this, heinz looks much worse than he appeared at the time to me (which was exasperated). There's where the first implication of Danny=Spawn Aware really came from.

In real-time Heinz looked pretty damn guilty to me.

[claphamsa]

holly crap people! i was asleep 7 hours! 5 pages of posts!

[Alan T]

if people are going to press the idea that one of the officers must be a spawn, we need to get Render to finish up his training for Chubby to become an ensign.. People's bloodlust for a lynch can't stand in our way of completing our mission.....

However I would personally rather Render help make a new second doctor instead if people are going to lay off of voting off an officer. I understand people's craving for a lynch or almost a feeling of necessity for a lynch, but my desire to have both a second doctor and a competent away team crew is just as great :)

[hoopsguy]

I would suggest that we have all of the officers in question - including me - submit early orders that should clearly be to the benefit of the team. We can then determine direction from there.

I'll be conducting an interrogation today, unless there is a compelling reason come Day 3 to do otherwise based on night results.

[mccollins]

I still haven't finished pages 27 through around 33, but I'm here and trying to catch up.

We need to find a balance between increasing post counts and helping the village. This game is becoming a full-time job and I'm pretty sure a few of the villagers have not been able to keep up. I've been guilty of it too, but slowing down the cross posting would be a first step to helping everyone stay on top of the game.

[hoopsguy]

Just got word that I'm being routed to another client site this morning, so I likely won't be around just after the deadline. I expect to be posting by mid-afternoon at the latest.

Catching up yesterday wasn't all that much fun, but I guess I get to do it again.

[Telle]

Ok, I just got caught up through 15 pages that I missed since yesterday. There was a LOT of skimming involved, so I'm sure I missed a lot of the back-and-forth discussions.

Since I am not exhausted or wounded I am going to request that I stay awake tonight so that there are free beds for others.

[Barkeep49]

I still haven't finished pages 27 through around 33, but I'm here and trying to catch up.

We need to find a balance between increasing post counts and helping the village. This game is becoming a full-time job and I'm pretty sure a few of the villagers have not been able to keep up. I've been guilty of it too, but slowing down the cross posting would be a first step to helping everyone stay on top of the game.
I agree. It might be nice if every 100 posts or so someone took the time to create a summary so people could read those. It took me nearly 20 minutes of reading to catch up from when I went to bed, so I'm just starting to process night actions, which means they'll be up a little late.

[KWhit]

I don't really care for the assumption people are making that the messages Danny got means that he's becoming Spawn Aware. Alan and PurdueBrad have received similar messages. (And who knows there may even be a 4th person who has received a similar message but is keeping quiet about it until he finds out more).

Do we really think there would be THAT many people who are spawn aware?

[mccollins]

I'm for the replicant coming forward and scanning Danny. In a way, I hate to see that bullet on Danny instead of clearing path through-and-through, but since I know I'm not Spawn, Danny has to be lying I'd think. I can't see why he'd make it up. Though I don't really know if it was a smart lie either.

That's the catch really. What if there was another person there, trying to sleep or whatever (or a spawn attacking it), if the replicant scans Danny and he's clean. Everyone is going to jump on me. While in a way I can't blame them, they're wrong. So now we've wasted the replicant and all we've achieved in doing so is lynch an innocent and wasted time.

I see you're racking up some Passacaglia points this game (for making arguments simply founded upon asserting that you're a villager - I think that's how it works?).

FWIW, when people repeatedly say this, it makes me believe them less. The last time I remember you repeatedly saying stuff like "but I know I'm good" was when you were a wolf in the Chess game.

Also FWIW, I don't particularly want to lynch an engineer before the ship is just about all fixed up.

[jeheinz72]

I see you're racking up some Passacaglia points this game (for making arguments simply founded upon asserting that you're a villager - I think that's how it works?).

FWIW, when people repeatedly say this, it makes me believe them less. The last time I remember you repeatedly saying stuff like "but I know I'm good" was when you were a wolf in the Chess game.

Also FWIW, I don't particularly want to lynch an engineer before the ship is just about all fixed up.

I get that man, but by the same token, when one is taking as much of the riff-raff-at-best heat as I did yesterday, then you kind of have to assume that at least a *few* times, I'm going to assert my innocence, right?

WRT that quote, I was speaking more to the fact that Danny said he had some form of Spawn Aware-ish sense while working with me. My main point is that, I personally know that to be untrue, so where does that leave us.

(It leaves me not looking forward to another day of the jibber jabber about this rather weak arguments against me)

[jeheinz72]

I should also add that no one has more Pass Points (TM) than hoops this game. Not by a long shot.

And also to add, for those who are having a tough time keeping up, I don't plan on posting any less. If people keep coming down my road, I"m going to repeatedly answer them.

[Passacaglia]

I see you're racking up some Passacaglia points this game (for making arguments simply founded upon asserting that you're a villager - I think that's how it works?).

FWIW, when people repeatedly say this, it makes me believe them less. The last time I remember you repeatedly saying stuff like "but I know I'm good" was when you were a wolf in the Chess game.

Also FWIW, I don't particularly want to lynch an engineer before the ship is just about all fixed up.

hah that's funny -- I was thinking about that post later, when I wasn't at the computer, wondering if it scored any points. To get a half point, you had to have a full sentence that said nothing more than "I'm a villager" -- so I think heinz is in the clear here, since he was saying (at least I thought he was saying) that one of the two of them had to be Spawn.

Anyway, I pretty much don't want to lynch anyone at this point. I don't get why scientists are seen as expendable -- don't they make our away missions better? Engineers are cool to keep around -- as long as they're not faking anything, they're helping us out. Officers I'm not sure about -- they're expendable in that they get replaced, but on the other hand, wouldn't we lose a scientist or engineer to do that? Privates do seem expendable, but even they add to away missions, which I don't think you can fake duties on -- although I do remember reading that if they are spawn, they will hurt the mission.

I would have made this argument yesterday, but I was mostly just skimming the thread, dealing with home-buying stuff. We put in an offer yesterday, and got a counter last night, so we have to go through the whole thing again today.

[Passacaglia]

I should also add that no one has more Pass Points (TM) than hoops this game. Not by a long shot.

And also to add, for those who are having a tough time keeping up, I don't plan on posting any less. If people keep coming down my road, I"m going to repeatedly answer them.

Damn my skimming, I honestly missed them all! By my count, no one had any. You should have mentioned it yesterday -- but then again, I'm hesitant to vote for someone, since we're all useful.

[Tyrith]

We have to lynch SOMEONE SOMETIME. We've gotten so caught up in the the fact that everyone has an ability that we're into paralysis. Well, some of these guys are bad and by having their jobs they're hurting the ship. It's time for us to break some eggs.

I think our strategy for today has to start with figuring out, one way or another, if hoops is good or not. The earlier the better. Then it probably goes into prosecuting heinz and whoever our night stuff drags up.

[Alan T]

We have to lynch SOMEONE SOMETIME. We've gotten so caught up in the the fact that everyone has an ability that we're into paralysis. Well, some of these guys are bad and by having their jobs they're hurting the ship. It's time for us to break some eggs.

I think our strategy for today has to start with figuring out, one way or another, if hoops is good or not. The earlier the better. Then it probably goes into prosecuting heinz and whoever our night stuff drags up.


Lets get off of this planet and then I will be more than happy to lead the lynch parade. Removing our crew while we have more work to be done than people to do it is nothing but a losing proposition.

[Tyrith]

Lets get off of this planet and then I will be more than happy to lead the lynch parade. Removing our crew while we have more work to be done than people to do it is nothing but a losing proposition.

We're talking days. Hoops, wolf or not, is right -- you think they're just going to sit here until we peacefully decide to leave? And it's only going to make it eight times harder when we're in space and don't have a clue what's going on because we haven't been doing anything during the day.

There's no way this game was balanced on the basis of us not killing anyone for four days.

[mccollins]

We'll see in the post-game, but I will be absolutely shocked if there were only two starting spawn.


Why? We chose to land in the less-spawn infested area and BK's post said there were a maximum of 3. I think if choosing between 0, 1, 2, or 3 that 2 would be the highest percentage guess. If that makes sense.

I don't know the ramifications of that beyond lowering all the percentages of finding a spawn in your posts of math.

All that being said, I'm starting to think it might be good to lynch today, but I don't have a feel for which of those I suspect is both the most expendable and the best chance at finding a spawn.

[jeheinz72]

We have to lynch SOMEONE SOMETIME. We've gotten so caught up in the the fact that everyone has an ability that we're into paralysis. Well, some of these guys are bad and by having their jobs they're hurting the ship. It's time for us to break some eggs.

I think our strategy for today has to start with figuring out, one way or another, if hoops is good or not. The earlier the better. Then it probably goes into prosecuting heinz and whoever our night stuff drags up.

So wait, now if Hoops is good then I must be bad?

I'm starting to think I'm just going to end up as the bad lynch this game no matter what I do.

[jeheinz72]

Also, do we even know if we have the replicant this game?

If we do, it's time to crap or get off the pot and use it before we lose it (if the plan is to scan someone). Clearing two folks today would be HUGE.

[mccollins]

I get that man, but by the same token, when one is taking as much of the riff-raff-at-best heat as I did yesterday, then you kind of have to assume that at least a *few* times, I'm going to assert my innocence, right?


No - what I assume is that every one of us would say we're a villager when asked. So it means next to nothing to me when I hear people say it.

[Marc Vaughan]

Ok if this helps I'll 'out' myself as the resident empath* ... I'm a newbie so I'm open to guidance as to how and when to use this ability.

So far I've used it only to verify that the doc did indeed clear Alan (ie. he's definitely clear and safe). This DIDNT indicate that the doc himself was clean, after all is he's spawn then clearing a couple of people who are safe lulls us into believing he's a good guy.

Now if anyones got some paint I need to draw a target on my chest for the spawn to aim at ;)

*Hence my couple of blatant attempts to try and get you chaps to say things which would help me detect spawn amongst you.

[Tyrith]

So wait, now if Hoops is good then I must be bad?

I'm starting to think I'm just going to end up as the bad lynch this game no matter what I do.

No, but you're the place to start today, clearly, as there's no way we're going to dislodge the moment for resolving yesterday's Danny-based mess and there seem to be several people that think you're off.l

[Alan T]

We're talking days. Hoops, wolf or not, is right -- you think they're just going to sit here until we peacefully decide to leave? And it's only going to make it eight times harder when we're in space and don't have a clue what's going on because we haven't been doing anything during the day.

There's no way this game was balanced on the basis of us not killing anyone for four days.

Of course they won't sit here peacefully and let us leave. However assuming we started 20-3, and lets say they have at least converted one person by this morning to make it 19-4 .. we already have a very difficult set of tasks with 19 of us.. So lets shoot in the dark for 3 days lynching off three villagers as is a very common occurance at the start of WW games.. plus lets say they kill another 1 or 2 in that time... Do you think it will be any easier to achieve our goals with a 14-4 ratio when we barely can get by with a 19-4 ratio or 20-3 ratio now?

I personally think we've been making fairly good progress with our mission (to get the crystlium and get off the planet) considering we had a slave revolt. I'm hoping the hold is repaired tonight, engineers can start on the engines today, we send out 3 away teams and get at least 45 more crystlium (or even 50+) to put us close to our needed amount and we get ready to try to get off this planet in two days...

[KWhit]

I think we need to have a lynch today, too. It's likely that we'll have some information to put together to make a choice today that's a little better than throwing darts at the wall. I'm still suspicious of Hoops, so would favor a scan of him today.

[mccollins]

It's hard to give fake clears when it is announced that the subject of my scan and I go into the office together.....since as you correctly point out, I'm dead if I find a spawn.

This is the third thing that hoops has said today that is giving me the heebie-jeebies. First it was the thing about minimum 3 spawn, then it was pushing the replicant to scan Danny, now it's suggesting I can fake clear. Hoops knows rules better than that, and no way he hasn't read the rules to this game.

I'm thinking hard about switching my vote.

Four things.


Note to self. Short simple reasons that also made me suspect hoops while reading through.

[Barkeep49]

After the commotion of last night, the mere howling of the wind on the ship’s hull is a bit of a relief. A very big bit of relief, actually. Those who hear the howling all night long include Purdue, Danny, jeheinz, & Tyrith who are seen working hard on the Cargo hold. They are protected by Schmidty. Meanwhile, Pass & Mrs. Schmidty protect the Security HQ and Saldana protects the Slave Pens. Hoops is seen lurking around various parts of the ship through-out the night. All in all the fact that you are, still, all there come breakfast time buoys the ship’s spirit.

Room Reports
Engine Room – Damaged 9 man cycles to repair
Water Plant – Damaged (Non Operational) 6 cycles to repair
Cargo Hold - Operational (Undamaged) (Maximum Capacity: 125 units)
Water Supply – 64 units (Enough reserves for a little less than 4 days at current consumption)
Crystilium Supply – 16 units (at least 75 required)
Security Headquarters Operational (Undamaged)
Brig –
Weapons Locker – 3 unspent phasers (2 spent)
Slave Pens – Operational (Undamaged)
Sleeping Quarters – Damaged. 18 berths requiring repair (enough berths for 5 people to sleep)

The Crew

Command Staff
Captain - Alan T
First Officer – Kwhit
Second Officer - Render
Security Chief - Hoopsguy Exhuasted
Ensign – Telle Exhuasted

Chief Engineer - Tyrith Exhuasted

Engineers
PurdueBrad Exhuasted
Danny Exhuasted
JeHeinz72 Exhuasted
Claphamsa


Trainer – mccollins Exhuasted

Medical Staff
Doctor - path12 Wounded
Medic - The Jackal Wounded
Medic - bulletsponge Exhuasted

Security Staff
Sergeant at Arms - oliegirl Exhuasted
Warden - Passacagalia Exhuasted
Galley Master - Schmidty Exhuasted
Slavemaster – Saldana Exhuasted
Security Crewman - Mrs. Schmidty Exhuasted

Scientists

LoneStarGirl
PackerFanatic Wounded

Privates

Marc Vaughn Exhuasted
Chubby Wounded


Slaves
17 slaves accounted
3 slaves dead

[Tyrith]

Score, looks like we had a good night.

Engineer strategy today - engines, probably. We should definitely put a couple of cycles in on the engines - me and someone else, maybe. Depends on what we come up with today about the status of our engineers.

[KWhit]

Yay! Cargo hold is functioning.

[Alan T]

Ok if this helps I'll 'out' myself as the resident empath* ... I'm a newbie so I'm open to guidance as to how and when to use this ability.

So far I've used it only to verify that the doc did indeed clear Alan (ie. he's definitely clear and safe). This DIDNT indicate that the doc himself was clean, after all is he's spawn then clearing a couple of people who are safe lulls us into believing he's a good guy.

Now if anyones got some paint I need to draw a target on my chest for the spawn to aim at ;)

*Hence my couple of blatant attempts to try and get you chaps to say things which would help me detect spawn amongst you.


Marc,

my suggestion would be try to go through the posts of people whom you suspect the most to be a spawn, especially those that talk alot (ie: if you are uneasy about Hoopsguy, he posts so much he has plenty of things to say).. Surely in his 200+ posts you'll find something somewhere that he says he is not a spawn within context of a sentence.. Most GMs frown on an empath asking people to post "I am not a spawn" for scanning. They usually want it to be used within the context of the conversation. (You can drop a PM to Barkeep if you have questions about what you can or can not scan).

My thoughts is if in the 200+ posts from hoopsguy he doesn't even once mention that he is not spawn or that he is a good guy, or something then that is a bit concerning as smart wolves know if there is an empath they have to be careful with what they say and how.. If he does have something then you can choose that sentence for Barkeep to scan.

I'm using Hoops as an example here, obviously apply it to the person you distrust the most thus far. The only other comment I would say is avoid complex sentences or phrases that include AND statements in it or where one part of the sentence may be true and one part may be false, as it will make the whole statement false

[KWhit]

Path and Jackal: Why are you guys still wounded? Did you not rest last night and the night before?

[Alan T]

Path, maybe you can work with Marc some also, if there is anyone you distrust and are afraid to scan because they might blow you up.. if you can find a sentence or phrase for him to scan..

[KWhit]

And Marc, I'd like you to try to focus on seeing if you can clear our doctor if you can find a statement by him that is pretty definitively stating that he isn't a spawn.

[mccollins]

I'm not sure on Ensign - I think we may need to promote/train a new one. Hopefully BK can clarify.

I don't know if this was answered, but I'll go ahead and throw it out there:

Chubby will be an Officer after one more day of training.

Next question: we still have a ton of cycles of repair to complete. Would it be better for me to train Marc Vaughn to be an Engineer or a Doctor?

[PackerFanatic]

Hooray for getting rest.

Am I the only one a little worried that no one has been attacked by spawn yet (at least during the night)?

[KWhit]

And Marc, I'd like you to try to focus on seeing if you can clear our doctor if you can find a statement by him that is pretty definitively stating that he isn't a spawn.

Or should we use the duplicant role to clear the doc?

[The Jackal]

I can heal someone now or wait until we've had missions. I'll be on the train from 2-5 and then I've got a poker game tonight but I'll be around as much as I can.

[mccollins]

My thoughts is if in the 200+ posts from hoopsguy he doesn't even once mention that he is not spawn or that he is a good guy, or something then that is a bit concerning as smart wolves know if there is an empath they have to be careful with what they say and how.. If he does have something then you can choose that sentence for Barkeep to scan.

I'm using Hoops as an example here, obviously apply it to the person you distrust the most thus far. The only other comment I would say is avoid complex sentences or phrases that include AND statements in it or where one part of the sentence may be true and one part may be false, as it will make the whole statement false

Hoops danced all around this in complex ways yesterday.

[Marc Vaughan]

my suggestion would be try to go through the posts of people whom you suspect the most to be a spawn, especially those that talk alot (ie: if you are uneasy about Hoopsguy, he posts so much he has plenty of things to say).. Surely in his 200+ posts you'll find something somewhere that he says he is not a spawn within context of a sentence.. Most GMs frown on an empath asking people to post "I am not a spawn" for scanning. They usually want it to be used within the context of the conversation. (You can drop a PM to Barkeep if you have questions about what you can or can not scan).

Ok fair enough - one proviso, unless I find something blatant I'll probably be cagey using the ability (as its a once a day shot) and because I'm working as well as doing this I'm not as attentive as some of you ..... so feel free to ask me to do something if I'm missing the obvious.

[Alan T]

Update on my night PMs.. I asked BK regarding the spawn thing once we lift off.. and he confirmed that it is in the rules (somewhere) once we lift off any spawnlings will continue to become a spawn, but no new spawnlings can be planeted.. which is just another reason to support no lynch, get off the planet and then worry about who is who..


My nightly PM makes me feel that I am not spawn aware after all.. it makes me think something else though, and really pushes me away from wanting to kill any of the officers today (Hoopsguy or Telle included)

[The Jackal]

Path and Jackal: Why are you guys still wounded? Did you not rest last night and the night before?

We were both wounded during the middle of the night in the sleeping quarters; I assume this means that that night didn't count towards the healing process, so really we've only had one undisturbed night.

Do you heal up by staying in the brig, path?

[mccollins]

Path and Jackal: Why are you guys still wounded? Did you not rest last night and the night before?

There are only 5 beds (and I didn't get one!); perhaps that's why?

[claphamsa]

way to go!

[Barkeep49]

There is some surprise and confusion when Schmidty rather forcefully insists that Renderfollow him to the infirmary. After a while the two emerge.

[Marc Vaughan]

And Marc, I'd like you to try to focus on seeing if you can clear our doctor if you can find a statement by him that is pretty definitively stating that he isn't a spawn.

I've been trying as verifying his is imperative imho - unfortunately I haven't come up with anything conclusive yet.

[PackerFanatic]

I assume I am going to be wanted on some sort of mission today, so I will hold off on my phaser recharge research until I hear more.

[Alan T]

I don't know if this was answered, but I'll go ahead and throw it out there:

Chubby will be an Officer after one more day of training.

Next question: we still have a ton of cycles of repair to complete. Would it be better for me to train Marc Vaughn to be an Engineer or a Doctor?

I guess it depends if people are going to insist on killing off someone important or not.. if not, then we really can use a second doctor.

[Passacaglia]

So wait, now if Hoops is good then I must be bad?

I'm starting to think I'm just going to end up as the bad lynch this game no matter what I do.

I'm not caught up (thought I did catch a glimpse of an MV reveal) but yeah, that seems wolfish -- like a setup to lynch hoops, then heinz.

[mccollins]

We were both wounded during the middle of the night in the sleeping quarters; I assume this means that that night didn't count towards the healing process, so really we've only had one undisturbed night.

Do you heal up by staying in the brig, path?

I asked at one point and, yes, sleeping in the brig acts like extra beds and gives a full night's rest.

[claphamsa]

i wll be more than willing to fix the engines :)

[Alan T]

There is some surprise and confusion when Schmidty rather forcefully insists that Renderfollow him to the infirmary. After a while the two emerge.


I am guessing that Schmidty is the duplicant and chose to scan Render and the fact they both didnt die means Render isn't bad

[Barkeep49]

We were both wounded during the middle of the night in the sleeping quarters; I assume this means that that night didn't count towards the healing process, so really we've only had one undisturbed night.

Do you heal up by staying in the brig, path?
This is correct. The night they were wounded was hardly a night of undisturbed rest.

[Alan T]

I assume I am going to be wanted on some sort of mission today, so I will hold off on my phaser recharge research until I hear more.


I am pretty sure Kwhit is going to be sending out max away teams today, so yes I bet you will be going out

[Alan T]

Kwhit, what are your thoughts on away teams today? 3 teams?

Telle lead one, Hoopsguy lead one and Saldana lead one?

[mccollins]

There is some surprise and confusion when Schmidty rather forcefully insists that Renderfollow him to the infirmary. After a while the two emerge.

What's this about? Schmidty the water boy forcing an officer into the infirmary? Did I miss Schmidty having some medical knowledge to be used in the infirmary? Or is he quarantining him or something?

[PackerFanatic]

I don't blame him. We have a undamaged hold and 2 (or 3?) planned missions. Let's rock while we can!

[claphamsa]

Ok, last minuit change of plans. Im leaving tongiht instead of tommmroow morning. so I wont be on all day tomrmmow. Im gonna have to wright up lots of conditionals!

[KWhit]

Update on my night PMs.. I asked BK regarding the spawn thing once we lift off.. and he confirmed that it is in the rules (somewhere) once we lift off any spawnlings will continue to become a spawn, but no new spawnlings can be planeted.. which is just another reason to support no lynch, get off the planet and then worry about who is who..


My nightly PM makes me feel that I am not spawn aware after all.. it makes me think something else though, and really pushes me away from wanting to kill any of the officers today (Hoopsguy or Telle included)

I was thinking earlier about this. It didn't sound like spawn awareness to me, it sounded like the absolute trust.

Who has gotten these messages?

[mccollins]

I assume I am going to be wanted on some sort of mission today, so I will hold off on my phaser recharge research until I hear more.

Yes, both scientiests will be needed on away missions today.

[mccollins]

Kwhit, what are your thoughts on away teams today? 3 teams?

Telle lead one, Hoopsguy lead one and Saldana lead one?

And should Telle & Hoops take a scientist and the rest slaves? (And Saldana with all slaves obviously)

[KWhit]

Kwhit, what are your thoughts on away teams today? 3 teams?

Telle lead one, Hoopsguy lead one and Saldana lead one?

Yes. Here's what I was thinking:

Telle
Scientist
3 slaves

Hoops
Scientist
3 slaves

Saldana
4 slaves

[mccollins]

I am guessing that Schmidty is the duplicant and chose to scan Render and the fact they both didnt die means Render isn't bad

WELL - that's good news! Can anyone else confirm what happened in there?

[Passacaglia]

No - what I assume is that every one of us would say we're a villager when asked. So it means next to nothing to me when I hear people say it.

This was pretty much my pet peeve with the whole thing, and why I instituted the points system.

[KWhit]

I am guessing that Schmidty is the duplicant and chose to scan Render and the fact they both didnt die means Render isn't bad

Why choose Render? The second officer? We need the doc cleared.

[mccollins]

Ok, I'm starting to cross post (which I encouraged others to be careful of) and I have some pressing stuff at work so I'm stepping away for a bit.

Whoever I train won't become that specialist role until this time tomorrow so I'll hold off on the order for now.

[Alan T]

WELL - that's good news! Can anyone else confirm what happened in there?

Schmidty probably won't be on until later today... Render seems more hit or miss.. but since both returned from the infirmary, the only possible options are:

1) Schmidty scanned Render as good
2) Schmidty found a spawnling in Render and removed it and Render is still good
3) Schmidty got converted, managed to keep the duplicant ability, fake scanned Render (I don't find this very likely at all)
4) Schmidty is not the duplicant and there is some role that I can't find anywhere that allowed Schmidty to do this (not very likely)...

so I think the fact both returned from the scan tells me that Render is likely fine.

[KWhit]

I'm going to get to planning some missions. Anyone have any better ideas of what I should do with my 2 AP today?

[Alan T]

Why choose Render? The second officer? We need the doc cleared.

Not sure, my guess is that he didn't want to get caught up in the Hoops vs whomever debates and he believes Path is likely ok based on metagame reasons so chose Render whom Hoops was pushing to try to get lynched yesterday... I'm betting it was that he felt Hoops was likely bad so he didn't want to die scanning Hoops and went the other direction instead..

Just my guess though, I obviously had hoped Path to be scanned..


Based on the results for repair work from last night and our current status though, I think we should get a new doctor trained up ASAP today, so we can use him tommorrow to scan path

[mccollins]

Schmidty probably won't be on until later today...

So does that mean he had the PM order in yesterday for this to happen after the morning deadline? Why not do it last night? Or is it because it has to be done during the day?

Ok, I'm outta here for real.

[Alan T]

I'm going to get to planning some missions. Anyone have any better ideas of what I should do with my 2 AP today?


How many missions do you have planned already? 1 mining mission from yesterday correct? If so, then I think 2 more planned missions seems like a good use.. Or plan 1 and save the other AP until later in case you need it elsewhere

[Alan T]

So does that mean he had the PM order in yesterday for this to happen after the morning deadline? Why not do it last night? Or is it because it has to be done during the day?

Ok, I'm outta here for real.


I think the doctor role is day time only, and yesterday Schmidty used his AP to round up slaves, so last night he probably put in an order for first thing today to scan Render

[KWhit]

Based on the results for repair work from last night and our current status though, I think we should get a new doctor trained up ASAP today, so we can use him tommorrow to scan path

Agreed 100%.

[Tyrith]

Alan, ultimately I think that strategy is just not going to be sufficient. If we wait until we're in space to start lynching people we're going to be looking at something like 15-5 if we're lucky -- and those are the kinds of odds that lose us games fast. Especially when the ship starts breaking around us. We may not have been facing 4 spawnlings at the start, but you better believe that our situation is going to RAPIDLY get worse without our intervention. It's the height of folly, I believe, to think that we get along for four or five days on nothing but one doctor scan a day.

[KWhit]

How many missions do you have planned already? 1 mining mission from yesterday correct?

Yes, I think that's right, since we ended up not using the 2nd mining mission.

[Alan T]

Alan, ultimately I think that strategy is just not going to be sufficient. If we wait until we're in space to start lynching people we're going to be looking at something like 15-5 if we're lucky -- and those are the kinds of odds that lose us games fast. Especially when the ship starts breaking around us. We may not have been facing 4 spawnlings at the start, but you better believe that our situation is going to RAPIDLY get worse without our intervention. It's the height of folly, I believe, to think that we get along for four or five days on nothing but one doctor scan a day.

15-5 seems like a bit rough odds for most WW games.. but WW games where you have Multiple bodyguards, multiple seers, an empath, an absolute trust group, etc... is very winnable once in space. Very very winnable.

It is only if we kill off good guys here taking shots in the dark while on the planet and then either don't even get into space, or turn that 15-5 into more like 9-5 once we are in space do we make it really tough

[mccollins]

Based on the results for repair work from last night and our current status though, I think we should get a new doctor trained up ASAP today, so we can use him tommorrow to scan path

ASAP would mean RendeR would use his role to do something and I think Chubby should finish his training sooner rather than later (or is that off-base?).

We have 33 cycles of repair that need to be done overall (9 Engine, 6 Water Plant, 18 beds (though not all are necessary with the brig and any lynchings)) and 6 cycles of available work per day and night (5 engineers + Tyrith bonus).

Originally, I had planned to go Engineer then Doctor. Looking at the work to be done, the Engine should be done after a Day and Night and then the Water Plant could be finished during Day 4.

I started this post to show why I was leaning towards Engineer, but I've talked myself into leaning towards Doctor again.

Okay seriously leaving (unless someone else posted something....)

[Tyrith]

15-5 seems like a bit rough odds for most WW games.. but WW games where you have Multiple bodyguards, multiple seers, an empath, an absolute trust group, etc... is very winnable once in space. Very very winnable.

It is only if we kill off good guys here taking shots in the dark while on the planet and then either don't even get into space, or turn that 15-5 into more like 9-5 once we are in space do we make it really tough

We're going to get at most three lynches here; it's worth it to us if we get even 1. And the extra information we get will be worth a bucket load.

I think it's the height of folly to think that this game was designed in such a way that this strategy can work. Maybe I'm wrong -- maybe we've found the secret strategy that breaks the game open. But it's completely antithetical to the way Werewolf usually works.

[Alan T]

ASAP would mean RendeR would use his role to do something and I think Chubby should finish his training sooner rather than later (or is that off-base?).

We have 33 cycles of repair that need to be done overall (9 Engine, 6 Water Plant, 18 beds (though not all are necessary with the brig and any lynchings)) and 6 cycles of available work per day and night (5 engineers + Tyrith bonus).

Originally, I had planned to go Engineer then Doctor. Looking at the work to be done, the Engine should be done after a Day and Night and then the Water Plant could be finished during Day 4.

I started this post to show why I was leaning towards Engineer, but I've talked myself into leaning towards Doctor again.

Okay seriously leaving (unless someone else posted something....)

I don't think Render can make another doctor, I think you have to. So Render can finish off chubby's training today

[Danny]

I have to get going, but I got the confirmation I was looking for. I am now spawn aware. There was no indication at this point that any of the three engineers I worked with are bad. Doesn't mean they aren't though.

[mccollins]

Agreed 100%.

Okay, I think I talked myself into it fully. Just sent the PM.

[Passacaglia]

Why choose Render? The second officer? We need the doc cleared.

Maybe Schmidty didn't care about clearing the doc, and was just suspicious of RendeR? I'm also going to throw out there that Schmidty was hoping to die, and thought RendeR was more likely to be a wolf.

[mccollins]

Ok - remember - 3 away missions today!

Should they all be planned? (Can Saldana use plans, that is?)

Later!

[PurdueBrad]

Okay, I'm going to work on the engines and my PM indicates that I trust the medical staff and the privates, so while I agree we need a lynch, I will not support a candidate from either pool. Do we think that "medical staff" includes Path?

[Tyrith]

Okay, I'm going to work on the engines and my PM indicates that I trust the medical staff and the privates, so while I agree we need a lynch, I will not support a candidate from either pool. Do we think that "medical staff" includes Path?

Yes, otherwise it'd just be medics.

[jeheinz72]

I'm going to put in to work on the engines.

I also have a nice working relationship with my fellow initial engineers, Tyrith, Danny and PB. I won't be voting for any of them today.

[Telle]

Ok - remember - 3 away missions today!

Should they all be planned? (Can Saldana use plans, that is?)

Later!

KWhit can only plan two. I'd think it would make the most sense for mine and hoops's missions to be the planned ones.

[KWhit]

I have to get going, but I got the confirmation I was looking for. I am now spawn aware. There was no indication at this point that any of the three engineers I worked with are bad. Doesn't mean they aren't though.

Can you expand on this a bit? What kind of message did you get and why do you think it means you're spawn aware?

[jeheinz72]

So if we do that mission plan, the only new person leaving the ship is hoops, do I have that right?

[PurdueBrad]

Then if I can clear, in some weird way, the medical staff and privates, Alan is clearing the officers, what does that leave us? I'll also be curious to hear about Danny's PM on top of it.

Oh yeah, and a new song coming shortly. . .

[PackerFanatic]

KWhit can only plan two. I'd think it would make the most sense for mine and hoops's missions to be the planned ones.

We have at least one left over from yesterday yet, too.

[PurdueBrad]

NM, I apparently missed a post. So Danny is clearing the engineers. Who does that leave?

[Alan T]

KWhit can only plan two. I'd think it would make the most sense for mine and hoops's missions to be the planned ones.

Kwhit had one saved from yesterday also. so we can have a total of 3 to use today, so you, Hoops and Saldana all should be able to get one if Kwhit chooses

[Danny]

Can you expand on this a bit? What kind of message did you get and why do you think it means you're spawn aware?

It directly said I am now convinced I am spawn aware. It said I didn't know what that meant about the three engineers I worked with last night.

[Alan T]

Then if I can clear, in some weird way, the medical staff and privates, Alan is clearing the officers, what does that leave us? I'll also be curious to hear about Danny's PM on top of it.

Oh yeah, and a new song coming shortly. . .


If your message is anything like mine.. I can't clear all of the officers.. I feel that someone in the command staff is good.. I just don't know whom.. it very well may be Kwhit, or it may be Telle or Hoops or Render.. I don't know.

[Telle]

Kwhit had one saved from yesterday also. so we can have a total of 3 to use today, so you, Hoops and Saldana all should be able to get one if Kwhit chooses

Oh awesome. I didn't know we could save them from one day to the next.

[Danny]

NM, I apparently missed a post. So Danny is clearing the engineers. Who does that leave?

Not fully, the rules says I have an increased chance of finding a spawn each night I work with the same person. Hopefully I can work with you guys some more and clear you better

[PurdueBrad]

Born to be Human (Born to be Wild)

Get the engine running
head out to the galaxy
Lookin' for adventure
and whatever comes our way
Yeah scientists go make it happen
get some crys to get us out of this place
fire all your phasers at once
and let's explode into space

I like hand and power tools
metal and electricity
racin' away from the spawn
and workin' under the engine
Yeah scientists go make it happen
Get some crys to get us out of this place
Fire all your phasers at once
and let's explode into space

Like true human children
we were born, born to be Human
We can fly and be gone
I never wanna be spawn

Born to be human
Born to be human

[Danny]

Anyway, I am off, I will be back the same time as always to discuss this more. Hopefully we have a good day in the meantime.

[PackerFanatic]

Born to be Human (Born to be Wild)

Get the engine running
head out to the galaxy
Lookin' for adventure
and whatever comes our way
Yeah scientists go make it happen
get some crys to get us out of this place
fire all your phasers at once
and let's explode into space

I like hand and power tools
metal and electricity
racin' away from the spawn
and workin' under the engine
Yeah scientists go make it happen
Get some crys to get us out of this place
Fire all your phasers at once
and let's explode into space

Like true human children
we were born, born to be Human
We can fly and be gone
I never wanna be spawn

Born to be human
Born to be human

*claps* Well done.

[PurdueBrad]

If your message is anything like mine.. I can't clear all of the officers.. I feel that someone in the command staff is good.. I just don't know whom.. it very well may be Kwhit, or it may be Telle or Hoops or Render.. I don't know.

Alan, my progression is like this:

the first pm said that I'm developing unusual feelings regarding the crew (kinky) and that I think the feelings are good.

the second said my feelings from the day before got stronger, mostly about the medical staff and privates.

Those are paraphrases but they do point to more than just one person if I am reading them right.

[Barkeep49]

A bevvy of post-breakfast activity commences. First Tyrith, Purdue, & heinz all being work on repairing the engines. At the same time, mccollins asks Marc Vaughn to accompany him for some training.

[PurdueBrad]

After re-reading the rules/roles list, I'm not sure that my information is of much value. I honestly am not seeing a role that it points to. Danny is getting readings on the people he's with, hence the spawn-aware. I'm not seeing what I can be other than an enthusiastic welcomer of morning PMs so I feel special.

[PurdueBrad]

Repair-wise, before we start, here is what is left:
Engine room: 9 units (should get down to 3 if ALL engineers work on it)
Water supply: 6 units
Beds: 18 broken

BK, for the beds to get fixed, do we have to put 18 AP or are the beds calculated differently?

[PurdueBrad]

NM, think I answered my own question, yes it does require 18 AP.

[PurdueBrad]

As long as the engine is at less than 5 damage, the ship can take off. That means depending on mission success today, we *could* take off tonight/tomorrow and this means no more engine damage according to the rules.

Then I think we should split the engineer work, half on beds, half on the water supply. The replicator is more important than I originally thought in that it means we won't have to use cargo hold water.

The beds are important for curing exhaustion (obviously) but also we need to keep at least one bed unbroken so that our trainer can train.

Once we're ready to take off, please tell me we are going to kill the slaves? We're close to being ready and I really don't like having them around.

[Barkeep49]

Beds are no easier to repair than other things, just easier to break.

[LoneStarGirl]

We have to lynch SOMEONE SOMETIME. We've gotten so caught up in the the fact that everyone has an ability that we're into paralysis. Well, some of these guys are bad and by having their jobs they're hurting the ship. It's time for us to break some eggs.

I think our strategy for today has to start with figuring out, one way or another, if hoops is good or not. The earlier the better. Then it probably goes into prosecuting heinz and whoever our night stuff drags up.

Wow Tyrith... we agree on something, how unusual. Even if we do lynch somebody we can always train somebody new to take their place, so EVERYBODY is expendable right?

[Alan T]

As long as the engine is at less than 5 damage, the ship can take off. That means depending on mission success today, we *could* take off tonight/tomorrow and this means no more engine damage according to the rules.

Then I think we should split the engineer work, half on beds, half on the water supply. The replicator is more important than I originally thought in that it means we won't have to use cargo hold water.

The beds are important for curing exhaustion (obviously) but also we need to keep at least one bed unbroken so that our trainer can train.

Once we're ready to take off, please tell me we are going to kill the slaves? We're close to being ready and I really don't like having them around.

Yes, I don't see any reason to keep the slaves once we have left the planet. We have enough water for almost 4 days, so I think I want to make sure we do as much repair to the engines today and tonight, so we have the ability to lift off today or tommorrow if we get enough crystlium.

I remember last game there was some kind of special attack done by the spawn just before lift off that did damage to alot of things, so we'll want to make sure we fix as much of the engines as possible so we can get out of here.

[jeheinz72]

I retract my earlier statement, seems my note was more the flavor variety like PB"s.

[PurdueBrad]

I retract my earlier statement, seems my note was more the flavor variety like PB"s.

Heinz, how many PMs have you received, one or two?

[Tyrith]

Not going to lie, I think fixing the beds is a waste of time in the long run if there's anything else that needs to be fixed.

[PurdueBrad]

Not going to lie, I think fixing the beds is a waste of time in the long run if there's anything else that needs to be fixed.

That's fine by me, I'm just seeing a crap-load of us exhausted and I'm waiting for that to really start effecting what we do.

[Alan T]

PurdueBrad

There is conflicting information in the rules regarding liftoff..


Engine Room The ship may not lift-off (see Lift-Off below) unless the engines are working. Once the ship has lifted-off the engines may not be damaged. A successful spawn attack adds 3-8 man cycles of repair time to the engines. If the engines ever have at least 12 cycles worth of damage they will become so damaged that it will take twice as long for them to fix (in game terms the damage will be doubled). The ship cannot move with more than 5 units of damage.


Lift-off
After lift-off no new spawn may be planted (although Spawn may still evolve).

In order to lift-off the engines must not be damaged, the Cargo Hold must have the required amount of Crystlium and the Captain must order the lift-off by posting the order in the thread. Once all conditions are met lift-off takes place immediately.



Barkeep, can we have clarification on this?

[Tyrith]

We probably want to take some over the minimum required about of Crys. We can leak some in space if we take cargo hold damage, so we probably want a buffer.

[claphamsa]

Born to be Human (Born to be Wild)

Get the engine running
head out to the galaxy
Lookin' for adventure
and whatever comes our way
Yeah scientists go make it happen
get some crys to get us out of this place
fire all your phasers at once
and let's explode into space

I like hand and power tools
metal and electricity
racin' away from the spawn
and workin' under the engine
Yeah scientists go make it happen
Get some crys to get us out of this place
Fire all your phasers at once
and let's explode into space

Like true human children
we were born, born to be Human
We can fly and be gone
I never wanna be spawn

Born to be human
Born to be human

u need a hobby :)

[Tyrith]

That's fine by me, I'm just seeing a crap-load of us exhausted and I'm waiting for that to really start effecting what we do.

I don't think there's a cumulative effect on days of exhaustion, if that's what you mean. Our defense rolls are just worse than if we weren't exhausted, and there's a chance we'll fail at our tasks.

[claphamsa]

im gonna go reapir engines unless anyone objects...

[PurdueBrad]

PurdueBrad

There is conflicting information in the rules regarding liftoff..


Good catch Alan, I guess I should've read further on. I think we'll get it to zero anyway because I doubt we'll get the needed number of crys just on today's missions, at least if the one mission that netted 16 is any indication. We can get the engines to zero tonight and still have some left over manpower to work on the water supply.

[RendeR]

SO what was schmidty's results on me? beyond of course still being alive so I'm obviously not a full blown spawn?

Orders going in for the day.

[PackerFanatic]

We probably want to take some over the minimum required about of Crys. We can leak some in space if we take cargo hold damage, so we probably want a buffer.

Plus, if we want to recharge phasers once in space, we need 1 crys per phaser (not sure what happens if we go under 75 crys, but just putting that out there)

[PackerFanatic]

Is there a possibility I could get healed before going on the mission today? I don't know what the effect would be if I went on a mission as wounded, but I imagine it can't be good. If not, that's fine :)

[Barkeep49]

PurdueBrad

There is conflicting information in the rules regarding liftoff..




Barkeep, can we have clarification on this?
The moving with 5 is a remnant of a previous concept I had (that would have likely seen the ship returning to the planet). Lift-off cannot occur except if the engine is undamaged.

[Barkeep49]

"Chubby you'll be spending the day with me. Let's complete your training today,"Render says as the two make their way off to some place private so that they may both concentrate on the task at hand.

[jeheinz72]

BK, do we find out what Schmidty did any time soon?

[LoneStarGirl]

Yes, both scientiests will be needed on away missions today.

It feels good to be needed

[path12]

Path and Jackal: Why are you guys still wounded? Did you not rest last night and the night before?

That was my first night of rest. After tomorrow I should be OK.

[jeheinz72]

I ask, because if RendeR comes back clean, we should give some thought to voting hoops out instead of losing our doctor now.

I know it means little, but I just don't see hoops as a villager coming out hard against 2 villagers knowing that A) He has an important role and B) He's a likely scan target.

If anything, having seen hoops be a wolf a couple times lately, he's usually on the ball and agressive early, knowing he's going to get scanned sooner rather than later.

[PackerFanatic]

It feels good to be needed

Ain't that the truth.

[jeheinz72]

To add, collins, you should make a 2nd doctor. For one, it appears we're ok with our 5-man engineering team even if one person is faking and with all of us doing one chore it'll be harder to fake things without cluing in that an engineer is spawn.

For two, I think path is going to hit a bomb sooner rather than later. Worst case, we have 2 docs and the new one can scan path at the very least since it would appear at least, that the duplicant has chosen to scan RendeR

[Alan T]

I ask, because if RendeR comes back clean, we should give some thought to voting hoops out instead of losing our doctor now.

I know it means little, but I just don't see hoops as a villager coming out hard against 2 villagers knowing that A) He has an important role and B) He's a likely scan target.

If anything, having seen hoops be a wolf a couple times lately, he's usually on the ball and agressive early, knowing he's going to get scanned sooner rather than later.


I was trying to not butt my nose into another one of Path's decisions.. but my thought on this is with Hoops being needed to lead an away team today, that we don't scan him and instead scan Marc Vaughn (as having each doctor scan the other early on might be important).. That way we can include Marc in the brig tonight too and protect him... but like I said I kind of wanted to keep my nose out of Path's decision for a second day :)

[path12]

Do you heal up by staying in the brig, path?

As far as I know, yes.

[oliegirl]

Alright guys, I tried to sleep last night but there was no bed available. Seems ww life is mimicking rl as I didn't sleep much last night either. I'm having a crappy day at work, so during my downtime (12-5) I'm going to go try to get a nap and get rid of the headache I've gotten from being so stressed out with work this morning. I'll be around for another 10 or 15 minutes, and then I'm out for a few hours.

[PackerFanatic]

BK - can LSG and I research at night?

[jeheinz72]

I was trying to not butt my nose into another one of Path's decisions.. but my thought on this is with Hoops being needed to lead an away team today, that we don't scan him and instead scan Marc Vaughn (as having each doctor scan the other early on might be important).. That way we can include Marc in the brig tonight too and protect him... but like I said I kind of wanted to keep my nose out of Path's decision for a second day :)

That's a decent idea as well there.

Though what about the case where hoops is spawn and leading a mission? Surely that can't be a good situation either (to play devil's advocate)

[Alan T]

That's a decent idea as well there.

Though what about the case where hoops is spawn and leading a mission? Surely that can't be a good situation either (to play devil's advocate)


Then we don't have to worry about him getting infected :)

[jeheinz72]

Haha, true that.

[claphamsa]

wait for me!!!! im gonna catch up to the other engineers :)